Scottish Rock Garden Club Forum

Bulbs => Galanthus => Topic started by: steve owen on October 29, 2010, 08:25:24 PM

Title: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: steve owen on October 29, 2010, 08:25:24 PM
Snowdrop Company catalogue in this morning's post. Usual tempting selection of goodies, but notably Greenfinch, Lady Fairhaven, Rosemary Burnham, Celia Sawyer, Ruby Baker and Margaret Biddulph. Yum yum. Not cheap though. :( :(
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: KentGardener on October 30, 2010, 04:48:21 AM
Nothing here yet.   :(  And one of those is on my 'really wants' list.  Out all day today - but hopeully the catalogue may arrive while I am out and, if I can afford the price...., I can catch the post on Monday - which knowing my luck will be too late again.   ::)
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Maggi Young on October 30, 2010, 08:48:00 AM
While it is handy for those waiting for a list to arrive to know that others are receiving it, I would appreciate it if only lists which are  available to anyone are mentioned here.

There are some snowdrop suppliers who do not wish their lists to be discussed in the Forum and who only distribute their lists to people they know and  have approved.


Happily, The Snowdrop Company will  send lists to those who apply.
A S.A.E.(A5)  will get you the Snowdrop Company catalogue . The address is The Snowdrop Company,Dr R Mackenzie, Barn Cottage, Shilton, Oxon, OX18 4AB.

Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: daveyp1970 on October 30, 2010, 09:41:02 AM
this link isn't a snowdrop list as such but a fantastic group of snowdrop prints you might want to have a look at,Christmas is only around the corner.http://www.andreajones.co.uk/template.cfm?s=5943
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Maggi Young on October 30, 2010, 09:56:18 AM
Nice link,  Davey, some good ideas there for special gifts ...... ;)
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: KentGardener on October 30, 2010, 10:19:44 AM
Great link Davey - nice to see pictures of 'ex Emma Thick' (a member on here)  and 'JMBS-7B2-6' (also found by a member on here)
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: daveyp1970 on October 30, 2010, 10:23:45 AM
Great link Davey - nice to see pictures of 'Emma Thick' (a member on here)  and JMBS-7B2-6 (also found by a member on here)
John they are really special,JMBS-7B2-6 what a find that was and really could do with a name JMBS-7B2-6 just does not do it credit.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Maggi Young on October 30, 2010, 10:46:28 AM
Great link Davey - nice to see pictures of 'Emma Thick' (a member on here)  and JMBS-7B2-6 (also found by a member on here)

 Remarkable how many great galanthophiles there are in "these parts", eh?  8)

I don't think I knew that Emma T had a 'drop with her name..... :) 8)
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: daveyp1970 on October 30, 2010, 10:50:23 AM
Great link Davey - nice to see pictures of 'Emma Thick' (a member on here)  and JMBS-7B2-6 (also found by a member on here)

 Remarkable how many great galanthophiles there are in "these parts", eh?  8)

I don't think I knew that Emma T had a 'drop with her name..... :) 8)
Does anybody no the back story to how the drop was named after Emma i love the back stories if that's the right term,Maggie you just need one named after you or more correctly a crocus.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: daveyp1970 on October 30, 2010, 10:52:24 AM
Get the BD busy this coming spring with a paint brush pollen dabbing you never know. ;D
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: KentGardener on October 30, 2010, 10:58:56 AM
I don't think I knew that Emma T had a 'drop with her name..... :) 8)

It's not actually 'named' as, I believe, it wasn't considered good enough to name - but it came from Emma and was given to John Grimshaw hence the 'ex Emma Thick'.  I seem to remember that Emma found it in a mixed clump in her village while walking the dog.  I rather like it and hope that one day the 'ex' can be removed from the label and it can be known as Galanthus 'Emma Thick'.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: mark smyth on October 30, 2010, 12:57:26 PM
G. fosteri isn't correct.

No catalogue here today
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: KentGardener on October 31, 2010, 12:05:11 PM
Still no catalogue here - but someone has sent me a scan of it luckily.   8)

I was wondering what Galanthus 'Fiona MacKenzie' looked like as I have never seen one.  I stumbled across these rather excellent Galanthus photograph pages via a web search.

http://www.clivenichols.com/cgi-bin/stephen_johnson/database/imageFolio.cgi?search=GALANTHUS&img=0&cat=&bool=phrase
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Maggi Young on October 31, 2010, 01:51:41 PM
When did Galanthus  'HIPPOLYTA'  become  Hypolita??!!  ??? :P
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: emma T on October 31, 2010, 02:04:34 PM
Hello   ;D  KentGardener is right. I found it while walking my dog, due to foot and mouth restrictions at the time our normal walking route was out of bounds.

Just came across it growing in a mixed group of nivalis and plicatus. My dog  Vincent did try and Squash them with his big fat french bulldog face   :o  ( he gets a bit huffy when hes not the centre of attention ) Was lucky enough to be given permission to take a couple.

John Grimshaw does not think it worthy of a name, but i still like it. Im glad people admire it.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Brian Ellis on October 31, 2010, 02:12:12 PM
Great link Davey - nice to see pictures of 'ex Emma Thick' (a member on here)  and 'JMBS-7B2-6' (also found by a member on here)
Just got round to looking at this, the JMBS-7B2-6 is absolutely gorgeous, so elegant.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: daveyp1970 on October 31, 2010, 03:16:50 PM
Emma thanks for back story well like John i think the ex should be dropped and i think its a drop everybody would admire with in there own collections its a beauty.
But what i find attractive isn't everybodies cup of tea.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: daveyp1970 on October 31, 2010, 03:19:16 PM
Still no catalogue here - but someone has sent me a scan of it luckily.   8)

I was wondering what Galanthus 'Fiona MacKenzie' looked like as I have never seen one.  I stumbled across these rather excellent Galanthus photograph pages via a web search.

http://www.clivenichols.com/cgi-bin/stephen_johnson/database/imageFolio.cgi?search=GALANTHUS&img=0&cat=&bool=phrase
John there are some fantastic drops on there,Ronald Mackenzie did it for me,stunning.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Anthony Darby on October 31, 2010, 03:40:37 PM
There's something not quite right about Galanthus ikariae on that web site. ???
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: mark smyth on October 31, 2010, 03:49:33 PM
There are a few mistakes.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Maggi Young on October 31, 2010, 04:19:34 PM
I hope thatsince John didn't think it worthy of a name, Emma, he gave it back to you so you could give it to someone who would appreciate it??!!  ;D
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: emma T on November 01, 2010, 08:43:28 AM
Nope, hes still got it.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: steve owen on December 07, 2010, 05:00:36 PM
Really good list available on the Harveys Garden Plants website www.harveysgardenplants.co.uk/. Some unfamiliar and scarce varieties available.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Brian Ellis on December 07, 2010, 05:44:38 PM
Isn't this last years list Steve?
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: KentGardener on December 07, 2010, 05:49:46 PM
Has it changed from earlier this year?...   ??? 

p.s.  I've just noticed it says available for spring 2010 too so I think it is an old list.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: steve owen on December 07, 2010, 07:35:48 PM
Brian/John

The on-website list may be last year's but their 2010/11 list is out today. Worth ringing them?
For the forumists overseas, Britain is locked in sub -zero temperatures day and night at present; up to minus 23C in Scotland. Freezing mist has left trees and bushes coated in ice - an unearthly and unique sight when the sun gets through. No gardening possible. Thank heavens for the cricket from Oz.

Steve
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: fermi de Sousa on December 08, 2010, 08:09:42 AM
Marcus Harvey (Hillview rare plants Nursery) in Tasmania has a new catalogue out with a couple of pages of Galanthus (and lots of other bulbs/corms). He does send to customers overseas but you need to contact him about extra charges.
If anyone would like an electronic version of his list please send me a PM with your e-mail address - the list is about 1MB in size.
cheers
fermi
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: ashley on December 15, 2010, 02:28:03 PM
Here (http://www.ivycroftgarden.co.uk/docs/SnowdropList.htm)'s the Ivycroft list for 2011.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Brian Ellis on December 15, 2010, 03:21:28 PM
Thanks Ashley
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: emma T on January 12, 2011, 04:00:56 PM
Avon bulbs has some lovely snowdrops in the catalogue/website   :). A number of them already sold out   :(
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: steve owen on January 16, 2011, 07:47:38 PM
North Green Snowdrops catalogue arrived. As usual an appetising mixture of the known and the unusual, including some obtainable only via blind bids (a system John Morley has been using for a couple of years now).  Prices not necessarily cheap. The catalogue lists two Eastern European finds; an encouraging indication that some of the distinctive snowdrop finds from Europe may become available to us via UK nurserymen.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: mark smyth on January 16, 2011, 07:51:57 PM
he is asking for bids for Galadriel but its available in Ebay
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Sean Fox on January 17, 2011, 04:29:46 PM
he is asking for bids for Galadriel but its available in Ebay

I saw that too, anybody who is thinking of putting a bid in should know that BethChatto are selling them on a buy it now for £30 on e bay!
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Warren Desmond on January 17, 2011, 06:37:12 PM
Bought a few bulbs from Beth Chatto last year and was very happy with the quality of the bulbs... and seem to be doing ok..think they were Bill Bishop,Mighty Atom &  Primrose's giant
Regards Warren
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: steve owen on January 17, 2011, 07:34:43 PM
Like Warren I think the Beth Chatto nursery plants are good and when one of mine bombed they replaced it nice as pie. On the minus side they are not cheap.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Sean Fox on January 20, 2011, 10:51:39 AM
My experience with Beth Chatto is that they are very generous with their bulbs that they sell. I too ordered a few snowdrops from them last year and when ordering one Bill Bishop they actually sent four good sized bulbs. I also got multiple bulbs with the others I ordered. Their snowdrop selection on the website is quite limited though, they sell their more unusual snowdrops on e-bay.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: chasw on January 20, 2011, 09:44:50 PM
Well I had my list from Glen Chantry,placed my order,they arrived in great condition and are now potted up for a while before being transplanted into the garden ,very very pleased
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: mark smyth on January 20, 2011, 09:48:41 PM
I didn't get my list  :'(
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: chasw on January 20, 2011, 10:09:35 PM
Mark would you like it sending?

Sent
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: mark smyth on January 20, 2011, 10:48:56 PM
yeah please
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: loes on January 21, 2011, 02:13:25 PM
Who is Glen Chantry?
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Maggi Young on January 21, 2011, 02:46:20 PM
Who is Glen Chantry?
Glen Chantry is not a "who", Loes, it's a place.......it is the lovely home of Snowdrop specialists Sue and Wol Staines... it is no longer open to the public but you can see some photos here in the Forum : http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?topic=3698.0  and on their old website..... http://www.glenchantry.demon.co.uk/
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: loes on January 22, 2011, 10:10:17 PM
Ha,thanks Maggi.very,very nice pictures of the garden.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Maggi Young on January 22, 2011, 10:20:26 PM
It is a lovely place isn't it?   The Staines must work very hard to keep it so smart.... work to be proud of!
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Gail on January 25, 2011, 09:48:04 AM
I've just had an email from Woottens nursery drawing attention to their snowdrop list - I've not bought from them but link here in case anyone is interested;
http://www.woottensplants.co.uk/index.html then follow advice in next post......
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Alan_b on January 25, 2011, 09:58:51 AM
This last post should probably be under 2010/2011 catalogues and the link didn't work initially; you need to go to the home page at http://www.woottensplants.co.uk/ then select G, Galanthus and Go towards the top of the page.

Perhaps our ever-helpful moderator can sort this out.  
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: mark smyth on January 25, 2011, 11:21:18 AM
I hope Woottens mail their snowdrops in better condition than they mailed my Pelargoniums
http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?topic=2392.0 (http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?topic=2392.0)

I had selected big plants with lots of buds
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: emma T on January 28, 2011, 10:17:23 AM
Joe Sharmans list came today  ;D wow . He has a PINK regine-olgae " Pink Panther " going for £150   :o  Has any one seen this plant ? Is it really pink ?

And lots more wonderful new snowdrops  :o ;D ;D Same i had to payout to fix my car recently  :-\

Pink, wow
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Sean Fox on January 28, 2011, 10:44:00 AM
Got mine too apparantly, can't wait to get home.
15 E.A.Bowles available for £120 each, bargain  :D
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: mark smyth on January 28, 2011, 03:20:30 PM
My page is covered in highlighter  ;D :o
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: loes on January 28, 2011, 04:11:17 PM
drops I never heard of on that list  :o
I wonder how to tell my husband that I need some of those
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: chasw on January 28, 2011, 04:35:20 PM
Also had my list from Jo,and its on the way back already,better do some overtime
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: scatigaz on January 28, 2011, 05:49:37 PM
Could someone give me the address to send for the catalogue please. Many thanks Gary.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Brian Ellis on January 28, 2011, 06:21:06 PM
Check your PMs Gary
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: scatigaz on January 28, 2011, 06:34:00 PM
Thanks Brian. Much appreciated.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: galanthophile on January 28, 2011, 07:05:55 PM
Is this a private party or can anyone join..?
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Maggi Young on January 28, 2011, 07:17:47 PM
Is this a private party or can anyone join..?
Ann, as I said in the 'Snowdrop prices' thread the other day :  all Monksilver contact details  are on this page  http://www.monksilvernursery.co.uk/2.html ..... that's what they're on about!  ;)
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: steve owen on January 28, 2011, 08:37:03 PM
If anyone could scan and send me Joe's list I would be v appreciative.
Steve
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: mark smyth on January 28, 2011, 10:07:56 PM
After consulting Joe Sharman here's his 2011 list. I hope it doesnt cause a sleepless nights

 Monksilver List 2011  

 [attach=1]
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: galanthophile on January 29, 2011, 07:29:14 AM
Oh my...! Thanks to Brian for sending me the Monksilver list :)
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: steve owen on January 29, 2011, 09:59:10 AM
Thanks Mark and Brian.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: mark smyth on January 29, 2011, 10:16:40 AM
Steve aren't you on Joe's mailing list?
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Brian Ellis on January 29, 2011, 10:18:29 AM
Steve aren't you on Joe's mailing list?

Mark I seem to remember on the Gala Form that Joe asked us to indicate whether if we still wanted the list.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: kentish_lass on January 29, 2011, 05:55:01 PM
I would like to ask a question here regarding Monksilver mailing list.  I got an invitation to the Gala and the form indicated to let them know if you want the snowdrop list.  I am not going to the Gala (but hope to go one year) so how do I let him know I want to be on the list?  I emailed Monksilver but the email came back undelivered.  Should I send a handwritten letter?  It sure is hard work getting on these lists  :)  Also do I need to send a stamp for next years postage as I will be too late for this year?

Received a lovely parcel from Black Smith Nursery where I bought Richard Ayers, Sentinel, Sickle, Green Necklace & Jessica.  Lovely bulbs but Jessica had here stem broke.  I put a tiny piece of selloptape around it but it just made the stem heavy - I just want to see the flower!  I almost ordered Ivy Cottage Green Tips from Harveys but read that the green tips rarely show so I plumped for Ivy Cottage Corporal.....and several others of course!  I ordered G plicatus 'Beth Chatto' and am hoping it is the real Beth Chatto as when I went on Beths snowdrop walk last year David Ward said they have stopped selling it for now as the original has got totally muddled with seedlings of the real thing.

Still got lots of 'no shows' but it is so cold I am not surprised they would want to stay underground :)  I am hoping to go the Wisley Garden Snowdrop Splendour tomorrow - wanted to go today but my sister turned up unexpectedly.  They were selling Green Brush but I will stand no chance of getting one on the second day.  Maybe another year....

Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: mark smyth on January 29, 2011, 06:43:30 PM
A hand/computer typed letter would do. No need for a return envelope
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: steve owen on January 30, 2011, 04:44:20 PM
Steve aren't you on Joe's mailing list?
Mark
yes but the post takes longer to get here than Ireland, unless Joe posts them on different days.
Steve
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: mark smyth on January 30, 2011, 04:48:31 PM
Mainland Europe envelopes go one day ahead of those in the UK.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Maggi Young on January 30, 2011, 04:50:14 PM
The post , in every country, it seems, is something of a mystery! Sometimes a letter arrives almost before you've sent it, the next time it sits somewhere, or travels needlessly, to arrive weeks late. The Seed Gang were getting mail last week that was postmarked for early December!
I've got my SRGC Journal but a friend a few miles away has not..... go figure!
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: GoodGrief on January 30, 2011, 07:50:32 PM

>I am hoping to go the Wisley Garden Snowdrop Splendour tomorrow - wanted to go today but my sister turned up unexpectedly.
>They were selling Green Brush but I will stand no chance of getting one on the second day.  Maybe another year....


There were plenty available late on the Sunday...
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: kentish_lass on January 30, 2011, 10:47:41 PM

>I am hoping to go the Wisley Garden Snowdrop Splendour tomorrow - wanted to go today but my sister turned up unexpectedly.
>They were selling Green Brush but I will stand no chance of getting one on the second day.  Maybe another year....


There were plenty available late on the Sunday...

Yes I managed to get there on Sunday for the last lecture and I managed to get a Green Brush  :)  It did not look as green tipped as I expected though from photos I have seen of it.  Good Grief - you must have been there the same time as me?  My eyes could not focus on the labels and I never had my reading glasses so I was in a right flap and had to ask Simon Lockyer to help me find the plants I was after!  How embarrassing.  I took a few photos and if any are decent I will try to post them. 
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: mark smyth on January 30, 2011, 11:03:40 PM
My Green Brushes had minute green tips, were very diseased and died before they went dormant
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: GoodGrief on January 31, 2011, 08:25:45 AM

Yes I managed to get there on Sunday for the last lecture and I managed to get a Green Brush  :)  It did not look as green tipped as I expected though from photos I have seen of it.  Good Grief - you must have been there the same time as me?  My eyes could not focus on the labels and I never had my reading glasses so I was in a right flap and had to ask Simon Lockyer to help me find the plants I was after!  How embarrassing.  I took a few photos and if any are decent I will try to post them. 

I had been hoping to get to the afternoon talk, but the closure of the A3 put paid to that.
I had reserved some plants for the galanthus list, but there was plenty of everything left by the end of Sunday.
My Green Brush plant looks healthy but no flower yet.

They had a couple of other specimens not listed anywhere else, so I'll be curious to see whether they're of any particular interest.

Regards, Malcolm.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Mavers on January 31, 2011, 08:55:46 AM
What's the origin of 'Green Brush'?

It seems to be a lovely snowdrop that's become available without the help of the 'high priests' of the snowdrop world............ie Morley & Mackenzie.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: GoodGrief on January 31, 2011, 09:27:40 AM
What's the origin of 'Green Brush'?

It seems to be a lovely snowdrop that's become available without the help of the 'high priests' of the snowdrop world............ie Morley & Mackenzie.

I wonder whether it's from our continental cousins?

I've seen it listed here...

http://www.sneeuwklokjes.info/Bestelllijst.pdf

Regards, Malcolm.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: emma T on January 31, 2011, 09:35:16 AM
I have ordered a 'Green Brush' from Avon bulbs.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Mavers on January 31, 2011, 10:38:33 AM
Hi Em, Avon soon sold out of 'Green Brush'.

I'm pretty sure I saw it when I visited Avon bulbs last February in one of their frames. They were beautiful but not for sale  :'(

M
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: GoodGrief on January 31, 2011, 10:50:35 AM
Hi Em, Avon soon sold out of 'Green Brush'.

I'm pretty sure I saw it when I visited Avon bulbs last February in one of their frames. They were beautiful but not for sale  :'(

M

W&S Lockyer were supplying Wisley. And they had about 6 or 7 left on the shelf.
Wisley don't do mail order. Not sure about W&S Lockyer.

I've also seen it on the Colesbourne list and Kevock (where it's about half price of everywhere else).

Regards, Malcolm.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: kentish_lass on January 31, 2011, 06:02:37 PM
Hi all
I missed Green Brush and Selbourne Green Tips with Avon - they sold out very quickly.  My Green Tips from Wisley (via W&S Lockyer) look very healthy and I will post a photo when they flower.  I also got G. Charlotte which is supposed to be tinier than Tiny Tim and G Snow White.  The pots had multiple bulbs in some up to 3 bulbs which made up for the rather higher prices.  Does anyone grow these?

On display they had a lovely pot of G Penelope Ann - the flowers were huge.
Jennie
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: mark smyth on January 31, 2011, 06:44:23 PM
I grow Tiny Tim but not Charlotte

Note the height compared to the moss
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Paddy Tobin on January 31, 2011, 06:47:43 PM
Mark,

In contrast to our comments on 'Armine' and 'Beth Chatto', 'Tiny Tim' is one which simply romps away in the garden here, multiplying at a great rate. I recorded "approx. 100 flowers" for last season.

Paddy
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: kentish_lass on January 31, 2011, 06:55:17 PM
Mark - those photos of Tiny Tim are lovely.  I bought 'Tiny' from Beth Chatto last year & it seems there is confusion over 'Tiny Tim' and 'Tiny'.  Does anyone know if they are different or one of the same?  If G nivalis Charlotte is even smaller it must be miniscule  :)
Jennie
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: mark smyth on January 31, 2011, 07:49:22 PM
No sign of my Tinies this year as with most planted in troughs  :(

I think my snowdrops in troughs have drowned. The problem has been after a big freeze with snow like January, November and December 2010. The troughs thaw from the sides to the centre causing the trough to fill with water until the drainage holes thaw. The year I put troughs in the back garden I moved lots of my specials to them
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: mark smyth on January 31, 2011, 07:50:31 PM
Jennie I dont know the difference in the two
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Lesley Cox on January 31, 2011, 09:00:21 PM
Now that's one I DO have, G. 'Tiny' (or TT) I bought it 1993 from, as I remember, Will Ingwersen as 'Tiny' then someone here later said it should be 'Tiny Tim,' but I think she knew the name rather than the plant. It certainly is much smaller than any other I have and small enough, I think, for a trough. As Paddy says, it's very generous, with very small bulbs and very small flowers making good clumps quickly. Dormant here of course, at present.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: fleurbleue on January 31, 2011, 10:32:43 PM
A link I have looked at on a french forum, a long video...

http://vimeo.com/17672185
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Maggi Young on January 31, 2011, 10:58:30 PM
Nice link, Nicole.... I think that other videos by this man ( he is Dutch I think) were either posted here or in the Flemish Forum some time ago.... showing lots of snowdrops in a pretty garden.
 I can't find them now.  :P
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Brian Ellis on February 01, 2011, 08:40:00 AM
Mark - those photos of Tiny Tim are lovely.  I bought 'Tiny' from Beth Chatto last year & it seems there is confusion over 'Tiny Tim' and 'Tiny'.  Does anyone know if they are different or one of the same?  If G nivalis Charlotte is even smaller it must be miniscule  :)
Jennie

Jennie the monograph says of Galanthus nivalis 'Tiny'
Quote
this and 'Tiny Tim'...seem hopelessly muddled...We have not detected any differences between 'Tiny Tim'and 'Tiny'
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: steve owen on February 01, 2011, 09:00:26 AM
I grow both Tiny and Tiny Tim but checked and I don't have library pics to post. I'll make a point of doing so once they are both flowering.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Maren on February 09, 2011, 01:47:47 PM
Galanthus Sophie North anyone? I saw it in someone's garden the other day and fell in love. Nobody seems to have it. I'd love to buy it in the green. Any ideas, please?
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Gerard Oud on February 09, 2011, 04:45:49 PM
I do have Green Brush on ebay but it doesn't show up in the UK :'(
I have sold 50 in the green to Avon so they will be available again this year. ;D
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Alan_b on February 09, 2011, 05:05:36 PM
If G nivalis Charlotte is even smaller it must be miniscule  :)

Last year I received a Galanthus nivalis Charlotte, or at least I thought that was what it is called and I think the label agrees with me, though it's a bit difficult to read.  However this is a poculiform snowdrop, which I'm certain was its distinguishing feature, rather than size (or lack of it).  Can anyone clarify.  I cannot find "Charlotte" in The Book and my Charlotte would be too recent for the current edition, being a contemporary of Green Light found in 2004 and distributed by Joe Sharman.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Gerard Oud on February 09, 2011, 05:09:13 PM
I know that we have a Galanthus nivalis Charlotte over here found by Jan Huisman and named it after his granddaughter. Its a single nivalis which gives a lot of flowers from a the smallest bulbsize! In clumps it looks the best.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: johnw on February 09, 2011, 05:21:19 PM
Gerard  - Is your website down?

johnw
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Alan_b on February 09, 2011, 05:49:37 PM
I know that we have a Galanthus nivalis Charlotte over here found by Jan Huisman and named it after his granddaughter. Its a single nivalis which gives a lot of flowers from a the smallest bulbsize! In clumps it looks the best.

My "Charlotte" was found and named by Joe Sharman; I was there at the time of the discovery.  I checked the label and it definitely says "Charlotte".  I cannot find it in his list for 2009 or 2011 and I cannot find his list for 2010 so I cannot tell if he has ever sold it under that name.     
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Gerard Oud on February 09, 2011, 07:16:25 PM
Gerard  - Is your website down?

johnw
My new website is online if you google on www.sneeuwklokjes.info it should appear.

regards,

Gerard

And i have changed the url on my profile!
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: kentish_lass on February 09, 2011, 09:40:05 PM
If G nivalis Charlotte is even smaller it must be miniscule  :)

Last year I received a Galanthus nivalis Charlotte, or at least I thought that was what it is called and I think the label agrees with me, though it's a bit difficult to read.  However this is a poculiform snowdrop, which I'm certain was its distinguishing feature, rather than size (or lack of it).  Can anyone clarify.  I cannot find "Charlotte" in The Book and my Charlotte would be too recent for the current edition, being a contemporary of Green Light found in 2004 and distributed by Joe Sharman.

Alan - I bought G nivalis Charlotte at Wisley the other week but the flower has not opened yet.  It is very very tiny I know that.  As soon as it flowers I will post a photo - I had no idea it might be poculiform & will be very excited if it is.  I imagined it to be just a tiny version of nivalis a bit like Tiny Tim but smaller. 
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Alan_b on February 09, 2011, 09:47:17 PM
Jennie, I imagine you have the other Charlotte that Gerard refers to.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Brian Ellis on February 09, 2011, 11:18:57 PM
Here it is Jennie:
http://www.pcnijssen.nl/shop/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=1530
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: kentish_lass on February 10, 2011, 03:02:35 AM
Here it is Jennie:
http://www.pcnijssen.nl/shop/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=1530

Thanks Brian - it does not look anything to get over excited about but I will be interested to see how it compares in size to a normal nivalis.  A cute little one for the edge of one of my raised woodland borders though.

I wonder if anyone can advise me.  Being a plantaholic my shady borders do not have much space :)  Is it advisable to plant snowdrops among named varieties of Anemone nemerosa, Ajuga (the usual purple one), Cardamine quinquefolia (it comes and goes pretty quickly)?  I also have loads of different types of Epimediums (some do not run very quickly and stay clumped ie E sempervirens and davidii) and between clumps of Alchemilla mollis?

If not some plants will have to be moved ???  I am slowly making new areas for snowdrops but would also like to incorporate them into my existing plantings.

thanks Jennie
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: KentGardener on February 10, 2011, 06:17:10 AM
Hi Jenny

I've not tried any of those planting combinations so can't advise with previous knowledge.  But, I always think that as long as you keep an eye on things and are prepared to move them if they don't like - "give anything a go".  Trial all those planting ideas - but if the drops start to look like they don't like it in the coming years then move them to a better place.

Though someone may have already trialled these planting ideas and can share their experiences of how their Galanthus fared with you?
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: RichardW on February 10, 2011, 07:39:06 AM
I've always thought Snowdrops + Ajuga is a great combination, planted a lot of S Arnott to grow though Ajuga last year.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Hans J on February 10, 2011, 09:02:07 AM
Hi all
I missed Green Brush and Selbourne Green Tips with Avon - they sold out very quickly.  My Green Tips from Wisley (via W&S Lockyer) look very healthy and I will post a photo when they flower.  I also got G. Charlotte which is supposed to be tinier than Tiny Tim and G Snow White.  The pots had multiple bulbs in some up to 3 bulbs which made up for the rather higher prices.  Does anyone grow these?

On display they had a lovely pot of G Penelope Ann - the flowers were huge.
Jennie


Hi all ,

a question :

what is G."Snow White" ?
Has maybe anybody a pic ?
In the snowdrop book is G.nivalis "Snow White" .....and in the list from Gerard is a G.elwesii "Snow White"
 ??? ...there is some confusion ...

I know only G.nivalis "Snow White's Gnome"

Hans
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Paddy Tobin on February 10, 2011, 09:14:27 AM
Here it is Jennie:
http://www.pcnijssen.nl/shop/index.php?act=viewProd&productId=1530

Thanks Brian - it does not look anything to get over excited about but I will be interested to see how it compares in size to a normal nivalis.  A cute little one for the edge of one of my raised woodland borders though.

I wonder if anyone can advise me.  Being a plantaholic my shady borders do not have much space :)  Is it advisable to plant snowdrops among named varieties of Anemone nemerosa, Ajuga (the usual purple one), Cardamine quinquefolia (it comes and goes pretty quickly)?  I also have loads of different types of Epimediums (some do not run very quickly and stay clumped ie E sempervirens and davidii) and between clumps of Alchemilla mollis?

If not some plants will have to be moved ???  I am slowly making new areas for snowdrops but would also like to incorporate them into my existing plantings.

thanks Jennie

Jennie,

Epimedium, cardamine and alchemilla would be, in my opinion and experience, very unsuitable companions for snowdrops. They, three, are vigorous, spreading and edimedium and alchemilla have impenetrable root systems and no snowdrop would come through them.

Paddy
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Brian Ellis on February 10, 2011, 10:13:07 AM
Epimedium, cardamine and alchemilla would be, in my opinion and experience, very unsuitable companions for snowdrops. They, three, are vigorous, spreading and edimedium and alchemilla have impenetrable root systems and no snowdrop would come through them.

Paddy

I'm incined to agree with Paddy Jennie, another to add to the not very suitable list is pulmonaria.  It's the root system that causes the problem I think, having said that things like  Epimedium X Warleyense 'orangekonigin' just have to be well curtailed every year.  I should imagine with your size of garden you'd be trying to make less work rather than more.

Brian
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Alan_b on February 10, 2011, 10:15:33 AM
This is Joe Sharman's Charlotte.  I was with him when he found it in 2004; I took one home then but lost it.  Last year he very kindly gave me a replacement.  It arrived on a hot day in April and died back very shortly after I planted it so I was a little worried but it has popped up and flowered this year.  I think he told me it was (or was to be) named after a relative of his, but if there is already another Charlotte then I guess he will have to think again.  As you can see, it is a nice poculiform nivalis (getting a little wet in the light rain we have here now).  
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Michael J Campbell on February 10, 2011, 10:22:11 AM
Quote
Galanthus Sophie North anyone?

Maren,I have a Sophie North,it is just above the ground, I will check in a few days if there is a spare bulb.

Cheers.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Paddy Tobin on February 10, 2011, 10:31:55 AM
A very slim flower, Alan.

Elegant!

Paddy
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Maggi Young on February 10, 2011, 11:02:34 AM
............. As you can see, it is a nice poculiform nivalis......

I can see that the inners are more or less white, but they seem distinctly shorter than the outers, and with a sinus.... so not truly poculiform?
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Alan_b on February 10, 2011, 11:14:22 AM
.... so not truly poculiform?

You're becoming a bit of a snowdrop perfectionist, Maggi.  The term poculiform tends to be used loosely for any snowdrop that is semi or wholly poculiform.  For example, Galanthus Angelique is frequently described as poculiform, despite being a good deal less so than this one.

Actually, referring to an authority here http://johngrimshawsgardendiary.blogspot.com/2010/03/poculiform-snowdrops.html , maybe I should have written "Poculiformis Group"?    
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Maggi Young on February 10, 2011, 11:24:50 AM
.... so not truly poculiform?

You're becoming a bit of a snowdrop perfectionist, Maggi.  The term poculiform tends to be used loosely for any snowdrop that is semi or wholly poculiform.  For example, Galanthus Angelique is frequently described as poculiform, despite being a good deal less so than this one.

Actually, referring to an authority here http://johngrimshawsgardendiary.blogspot.com/2010/03/poculiform-snowdrops.html , maybe I should have written "Poculiformis Group"?    


 :D :D :D Well, since the 'drop fiends are so keen on tiny details it seems logical to press for some exactitude in these matters, eh?  ;D

 Though when in the case of marking these seem to be entirely random from year to year and garden to garden then perhaps I am being too picky for the pocs!
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Alan_b on February 10, 2011, 04:48:39 PM
...Avon soon sold out of 'Green Brush'.

Gerard Oud has some examples of Green Brush for sale on eBay.  He is the source of this cultivar, I believe.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Sean Fox on February 10, 2011, 05:13:34 PM
...Avon soon sold out of 'Green Brush'.

Gerard Oud has some examples of Green Brush for sale on eBay.  He is the source of this cultivar, I believe.

Yes I'm sure I read somewhere that he supplied 50 Green Brush to Avon bulbs last year. Avon where selling them for £15 before they sold out. Wonder how much they'll go for on e-bay?
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Maggi Young on February 10, 2011, 06:24:30 PM
...Avon soon sold out of 'Green Brush'.

Gerard Oud has some examples of Green Brush for sale on eBay.  He is the source of this cultivar, I believe.

Yes I'm sure I read somewhere that he supplied 50 Green Brush to Avon bulbs last year. Avon where selling them for £15 before they sold out.


Gerard told us that himself yesterday, on page six of this thread ....http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?topic=6179.msg185047#msg185047     ;D
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Gerard Oud on February 10, 2011, 06:55:51 PM
I have sold 50 Green Brush to Avon for this year and i we will meet at Oirlich. So they might be available after Oirlich!
Yes those on Ebay are mine!
I did have some before on Ebay, but i had not noticed UK is no part of Europe according to Ebay!
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: David Nicholson on February 10, 2011, 07:23:51 PM

I did have some before on Ebay, but i had not noticed UK is no part of Europe according to Ebay!

What a very wise Ebay! :P ;D
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Sean Fox on February 10, 2011, 09:33:05 PM
...Avon soon sold out of 'Green Brush'.

Gerard Oud has some examples of Green Brush for sale on eBay.  He is the source of this cultivar, I believe.

Yes I'm sure I read somewhere that he supplied 50 Green Brush to Avon bulbs last year. Avon where selling them for £15 before they sold out.


Gerard told us that himself yesterday, on page six of this thread ....http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?topic=6179.msg185047#msg185047     ;D



He He Maggie, see I told you I'd read it somewhere  ;D ;D ;D
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Maggi Young on February 10, 2011, 09:35:59 PM
So you did, Sean, so you did... there's often a clue, eh?

I see that there is Gerard and another continental selling 'Green Brush' on ebay.

It's very nice.... for a green snowdrop  ;D ;D
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: kentish_lass on February 11, 2011, 01:05:41 AM
I know that we have a Galanthus nivalis Charlotte over here found by Jan Huisman and named it after his granddaughter. Its a single nivalis which gives a lot of flowers from a the smallest bulbsize! In clumps it looks the best.

My "Charlotte" was found and named by Joe Sharman; I was there at the time of the discovery.  I checked the label and it definitely says "Charlotte".  I cannot find it in his list for 2009 or 2011 and I cannot find his list for 2010 so I cannot tell if he has ever sold it under that name.     

Alan, I noticed that MrOHowes was selling Charlotte some time last week on ebay.  However, it had no photo or description and sold for £23.  I wonder which Charlotte that was?  Very confusing and maybe Joe should slightly change the name ie. Elegant Charlotte, Charlotte's Choice etc etc.
Jennie
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: kentish_lass on February 11, 2011, 01:29:01 AM
Thanks everyone for your input to my question about planting companions for snowdrops.  I had a feeling Epimedium and Alchemilla would be a no no...but never knew Pulmonaria was a problem too.  I do have some very nice snowdrops planted with Pulmonaria in front...oh dear....one is P. Opal which does not seem to be doing much at all at the moment - I will keep an eye on it.

Last Sunday John (kentgardener) kindly showed me how to plant up the pond baskets so I will put a few bulbs in those and sink them where I am doubtful and that way they can soon be lifted out if need be.  You are right Brian - I do not need to bring more hard work on myself  :)

Glad to hear Ajuga and snowdrops are happy growing together as I have two patches under shrubs that look very bare and boring at this time of year.  Thanks Richard.

Got my order from Foxgrove Plants today.  I made the order just to buy Greenish.....and guess what.....Greenish was the only one I never got!!  I was happy with G lagodechianus though - what a sweet little snowdrop.  I like the species snowdrops and so far have 5 different ones.
Jennie
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: johnw on February 11, 2011, 03:11:17 AM
Got my order from Foxgrove Plants today.  I made the order just to buy Greenish.....and guess what.....Greenish was the only one I never got!!  I was happy with G lagodechianus though - what a sweet little snowdrop.  I like the species snowdrops and so far have 5 different ones.
Jennie

And just how does one get lagodechianus to flower? Mine multiply like mad but I have never seen a flower.  The book says to plant deeply but while done a year or more ago nothing yet.

johnw
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Alan_b on February 11, 2011, 05:33:18 AM
Alan, I noticed that MrOHowes was selling Charlotte some time last week on ebay .....   I wonder which Charlotte that was?  Very confusing and maybe Joe should slightly change the name ie. Elegant Charlotte, Charlotte's Choice etc etc.

Since MrOHowes is evidently an associate of Joe Sharman, without doubt it would have been Joe Sharman's Charlotte.  I cannot find my copy of his 2010 sales list where I think it may have been described.  Since it appears that the other Charlotte was around first then I think he is going to have to change the name.  I could only think of "Charlotte Church" and that might not suit.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: KentGardener on February 11, 2011, 06:05:01 AM
Alan, I noticed that MrOHowes was selling Charlotte some time last week on ebay .....   I wonder which Charlotte that was?  Very confusing and maybe Joe should slightly change the name ie. Elegant Charlotte, Charlotte's Choice etc etc.

Since MrOHowes is evidently an associate of Joe Sharman, without doubt it would have been Joe Sharman's Charlotte.  I cannot find my copy of his 2010 sales list where I think it may have been described.

I have scans of Joe's list on my laptop Alan and 'Charlotte' has not been described, as far as I can see, in either 2010 or 2011 list.  I have found this photograph in my files of a bag of the other 'Charlotte' that suggests a plant height of 15-20cm.



Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: KentGardener on February 11, 2011, 06:19:24 AM
Continuing on from the 'Green Brush' chatter.  I can't offer a photograph from my garden as the one I purchased last year didn't survive until this year  :'(    But here are a couple of photographs I took of 'Green Brush' yesterday.

1 - how I would expect 'Green Brush' to look.  Wonderful dark green solid mark on the tip of the outers.  A highly desirable snowdrop that I would love to own.

2 - how many of them looked.  Now I, and a few others were gathered around these wondering "is this difference because the bulb needs to settle down to show it's full potential or is this how some of them will always look?". 

I have asked the person who purchased both of these plants if they would kindly plant them separately and let me know how they look next year. 
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Hagen Engelmann on February 11, 2011, 06:22:12 AM
John, my GREEN BRUSH looks like the first pic.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Gerard Oud on February 11, 2011, 10:13:11 AM
The Green Brush is at its best when the bulb is fullgrown, the small offspring sometimes show a bit diffrent flower but when they are mature its good.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Martin Baxendale on February 11, 2011, 11:33:14 AM
Gerard, is Green Brush definitely a clone, and not a seed strain or a grex? Mine bought last year were also variable in the markings.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Gerard Oud on February 11, 2011, 11:54:28 AM
I dont know for sure because its not mine, but what i know its grown from seed. Elwesii are rather variable, but last year i bought the biggest bulbs he had grown and they were all good!
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: art600 on February 11, 2011, 11:55:46 AM
Not sure where else this could be posted.

On EBay someone is trying to sell the Snowdrop 'bible' for £82.45 plus postage.  WHY  ???   On Amazon a new copy can be obtained for £45.

Even more curious is that "The Genus Galanthus: A "Botanical Magazine" Monograph - Hardcover (15 Sep 1999) by Aaron P. Davis and Christabel King" is new at £130 and used at £109.85.  Has the world gone mad  :o :o :o
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Maggi Young on February 11, 2011, 12:03:31 PM
Quote
On Amazon a new copy can be obtained for £45.

When I looked recently for a friend, I could only find the cheapest on Amazon for £82  :-X   She decided she wasn't that bothered!
We're lucky in the Aberdeen group, we have one in our local group library.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Martin Baxendale on February 11, 2011, 12:12:08 PM
I dont know for sure because its not mine, but what i know its grown from seed. Elwesii are rather variable, but last year i bought the biggest bulbs he had grown and they were all good!

Gerard, am I correct in thinking that you're saying Green Brush IS a seed-grown strain and NOT a clone?
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Paddy Tobin on February 11, 2011, 12:56:38 PM
Do I hear alarm bell ringing?

Paddy
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Martin Baxendale on February 11, 2011, 01:50:07 PM
I dont know for sure because its not mine, but what i know its grown from seed. Elwesii are rather variable, but last year i bought the biggest bulbs he had grown and they were all good!

Gerard, am I correct in thinking that you're saying Green Brush IS a seed-grown strain and NOT a clone?

Gerard, if that is what you're saying, that should have been made clear when you were selling the bulbs. I for one wouldn't have paid what I did for bulbs of a variable strain or grex that might or might not match the "best" photos used to promote them. I certainly assumed, as I'm sure did everyone else, that Green Brush was a consistent clone which, when settled, would look like the photos we've previously been shown of it. If Green Brush is a strain, as suggested by your last comment here, did you make Avon Bulbs aware of that when you sold to them?
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Alan_b on February 11, 2011, 03:23:05 PM
Are any bulbs actually raised from seed?  I would not have thought this was an efficient mode of propagation, even if they came true from seed (which in itself would be very rare)
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Martin Baxendale on February 11, 2011, 03:33:48 PM
Are any bulbs actually raised from seed?  I would not have thought this was an efficient mode of propagation, even if they came true from seed (which in itself would be very rare)

Nurserymen do raise bulbs from seed. Janis certainly does. No problem with that so long as people are aware that they're not buying a clone. My problem with Green Brush is that it everyone seemed to be under the impression that it was a consistent clone and there was never any suggestion that it was a variable seed strain or grex, which Gerard's comment seems to suggest it is. Can you clarify that, Gerard?
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Alan_b on February 11, 2011, 03:46:00 PM
I perhaps didn't make myself clear? If you are growing bulb species then there is no reason why you could not do this from seed.  But you wouldn't do this with daffodil or tulip cultivars (except, possibly, the species) because it wouldn't work.  So it doesn't seem very likely anyone has succeeded in finding/breeding a snowdrop cultivar that comes remotely true from seed.  It would surely take decades of work if you set out to do this deliberately?
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Maggi Young on February 11, 2011, 03:49:44 PM
Are any bulbs actually raised from seed?  I would not have thought this was an efficient mode of propagation, even if they came true from seed (which in itself would be very rare)
A great many bulbs come true from seed and it is one of the best ways to keep a healthy population and keep vigour in one's bulb collection to keep raising them from seed.... not to mention the benefit in cleaning up any stocks one has the misfortune to get with a virus. And, of course, the fact that seed raised plants of any kind will tend, by each generation, to be more adapted to your conditions.
Once a stable population is established then a percentage acceptable to cultivar recogniton can also be found.That's something which does not appear to be the case with many snowdrops, for sure, but something that the likes of Martin B is breeding for, I think.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Maggi Young on February 11, 2011, 03:56:34 PM
  So it doesn't seem very likely anyone has succeeded in finding/breeding a snowdrop cultivar that comes remotely true from seed. 

 A cynical person (such as myself ::) ) might opine that it seems darned hard to get a stable snowdrop from vegetative propagation, let alone seed  :-X
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Alan_b on February 11, 2011, 04:00:56 PM
Once a stable population is established then a percentage acceptable to cultivar recogniton can also be found.That's something which does not appear to be the case with many snowdrops,

I couldn't think of any.  Possibly some of the long-established green-tipped nivalis varieties like viridipice?  But I don't know that, just speculating.  I completely agree about all the benefits if it could be done.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Martin Baxendale on February 11, 2011, 05:52:11 PM
Alan, I was answering the question you asked, although it did seem a rather odd one:
 
Are any bulbs actually raised from seed?  I would not have thought this was an efficient mode of propagation, even if they came true from seed (which in itself would be very rare)

If you're talking about named cultivars, then no of course they're almost exclusively propagated vegetatively from a single clone - unless they're a grex, a group of seedlings from the same parentage that look virtually identical, close enough to each other to be treated virtually like a clone. The snowdrop 'Fieldgate Prelude' is an example of this.

Of course the grex does have to be very constant, with the various seedlings in it virtually impossible to tell apart. It would be possible for someone to raise a bunch of snowdrop seedlings which were close enough to each other to be treated as a grex, then the various seedlings could be mixed together and propagated vegetatively and sold under one name.

The problem would be if  the seedlings were not identical enough or some were not as constant in appearance as others (this might not be immediately noticeable without trials in different gardens). If they were mixed and chipped and grown on as a mixed grex but later turned out to not all look the same then there would be an obious problem. This is the sort of scenario I'm thinking of in my query to Gerard - whether this might be the case with 'Green Brush' or if it is definitely a single clone.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Martin Baxendale on February 11, 2011, 07:27:12 PM
It's also possible that someone might continue to raise seedlings from the same cross that produced a good snowdrop seedling ir batch of seedings, or from a seed parent that they found regularly produced seedlings similar to itself, selecting and rogueing to produce a strain. But again, the big question is over the efficiency of the selecting and rogueing, and whether the seedlings remain constant in different soils and situations.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Martin Baxendale on February 11, 2011, 07:29:26 PM
It would be very helpful if Gerard could clarify what he said earlier:

"I dont know for sure because its not mine, but what i know its grown from seed. Elwesii are rather variable, but last year i bought the biggest bulbs he had grown and they were all good!"

I'm not sure if I'm reading it correctly.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: kentish_lass on February 11, 2011, 09:50:57 PM
Continuing on from the 'Green Brush' chatter.  I can't offer a photograph from my garden as the one I purchased last year didn't survive until this year  :'(    But here are a couple of photographs I took of 'Green Brush' yesterday.


Here is a photo I took today of the G elwesii Green Brush that I bought at Wisley at the Snowdrop Splendour weekend so this was supplied by Simon Lockyer. I believe Avon bulbs and Simon bought them at the same time from the same supplier??  It has a very green inner marking.  I hope I do not lose mine - however at the checkout at Wisley they told me to keep my receipt and all labels with barcodes as the snowdrops are under guarantee for 2 years.  I was quite surprised at this.....and happy :)
Jennie
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: kentish_lass on February 11, 2011, 10:00:36 PM
Someone was asking about G elwesii Snow White the other day but I cannot find the thread.

I bought G elwesii Snow White at Wisley the other weekend and here is a photo of it taken today.  It is a small rounded flower.  Also see the second photograph - is this Stag?  If so, what do I do?  I have moved it away from the other snowdrops until I find out.  :(
thanks Jennie
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: loes on February 11, 2011, 10:07:24 PM
last year I bought 2 'Green Brush' ,both with the good solid mark.One did not survive and the other has no flower so no photo`s from me.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Gerard Oud on February 11, 2011, 10:07:38 PM
Martin I dont know exactly about the English breedingterms and words you use. But what i was told, my colleage got it from his friends father who did Galanthus and Lillie breeding. Green Brush is the product of breeding and is no clone but a hybride. They selected the seedlings and Green Brush was found. The Green Brush from Avon were supplied by Dix export.
If they had bought them from me, they would have had the biggest and best ;D
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Gerard Oud on February 11, 2011, 10:11:22 PM
Here is the real elwesii Snowwhite found by Jan Huisman who is one of the exhibitors next weekend near the Zaanse Schans.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Martin Baxendale on February 11, 2011, 10:18:32 PM
Martin I dont know exactly about the English breedingterms and words you use. But what i was told, my colleage got it from his friends father who did Galanthus and Lillie breeding. Green Brush is the product of breeding and is no clone but a hybride. They selected the seedlings and Green Brush was found. The Green Brush from Avon were supplied by Dix export.
If they had bought them from me, they would have had the biggest and best ;D

I thought you said earlier in this thread that you'd sold 50 Green Brush to Avon Bulbs, but checking back I see you say you sold them 50 bulbs this year. So last year's bulbs were from Dix?

I realise Green Brush must be a selection from elwesii seedlings. What I'm asking is was Green Brush originally just one selected seedling which has been propagated by division or chipping, so that all the Green Brush bulbs being sold now come originally from just that one single bulb (that is what a clone means in English). Or were a number of similar-looking bulbs originally selected and then propagated by division or chipping, so that the Green Brush bulbs being sold now originally came from a number of seedlings which looked much the same as each other? (that would be a grex, and not a clone).

I hope my reading of your original comment is wrong and that Green Brush is a clone originating from a single selected seedling, not from a number of selected seedlings. And I think other forumists would also be interested to know the answer to that if you know it or can find out for us. Thanks.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Gerard Oud on February 11, 2011, 10:26:10 PM
Now i know what you mean Martin! All Green brush are from one single bulb!
If you read it well i said indeed this year and not last year!
I hope everything is clear now ;D

everyone a nice weekend ;D
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Alan_b on February 11, 2011, 10:35:27 PM
is this Stag? 

You need to inspect the bulb.  A healthy bulb should look white if you wash it and rub off the dead outer layers as necessary.  And it should have a good root system.  A bulb with Stagonospora will not come completely clean or will be stained.  It will probably have few roots.  In a bad case the ends of the leaves look as if they have been burned.

Stag will tend to cause the outer layers of the bulb to rot away but if you isolate the bulb in a pot and change the compost each year, washing the bulb when you do, then I think some bulbs can be saved.  Remove as much as you can of the infected material.  This requires a lot of effort, so if you believe time is money then it might well be more economic to throw away infected bulbs. 
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Martin Baxendale on February 11, 2011, 10:37:11 PM
Now i know what you mean Martin! All Green brush are from one single bulb!
If you read it well i said indeed this year and not last year!
I hope everything is clear now ;D

everyone a nice weekend ;D

I did read all your posts very carefully Gerard, thank you. You wrote that you sold the bulbs to Avon "for this year" which suggests that you sold them for sale by them this year. Also your post about the origins of Green Brush was quite confusing, although I did read it very carefully and a number of times.

Anyway, I'm happy to hear that Green Brush is indeed a clone and not a variable grex. Hopefully that means that it will flower as seen in the photos once it settled into people's gardens. Thanks for your help.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: kentish_lass on February 11, 2011, 10:41:23 PM
is this Stag? 

You need to inspect the bulb.  A healthy bulb should look white if you wash it and rub off the dead outer layers as necessary.  And it should have a good root system.  A bulb with Stagonospora will not come completely clean or will be stained.  It will probably have few roots.  In a bad case the ends of the leaves look as if they have been burned.


Thanks Alan for your help.  I was worried sick when I saw it as it is a brand new acquisition....and from Wisley.  Should I wash the soil off the bulb now?

Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Warren Desmond on February 11, 2011, 10:42:31 PM
Hi All

Loving all the Galanthus images... :)

Brian...the detail you have managed to capture of the flower is phenomenal...especially with the close up ones...I thought the only way to capture the sheen on a flower needed to be taken outside in the sunshine...but you live and learn  :)
but
Here are a few of mine...

1) daglinworth
2) diggory
3) nothing special
4) pat mason...been after that one since Paddy I think posted an image last year...
5) flower bed done last year

Regards

Warren
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Alan_b on February 16, 2011, 07:15:10 AM
Here is a picture of the Galanthus nivalis "Charlotte" on display at the W & S Lockyer stand at the RHS Show.  I consulted (or maybe 'buttonholed') Joe Sharman about it but we both thought it seemed to be a perfectly ordinary nivalis without any distinguishing features.  The distinguishing feature it is supposed to have, an extra white inner petal, was not present on any of the flowers we examined. 
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: KentGardener on February 16, 2011, 07:30:36 AM
Hi Alan

An English translation of the Dutch suppliers information is:

Quote from: Translation
Galanthus nivalis 'Charlotte'
Belongs to: 8 Galanthus Imperial Group.
An incredible flowering form of the
common snowdrop. The bulbs
verklisteren rapidly and flower as early as one
small bulb size. The photo is of a clump
that after a few years originated from only
a sphere. Because of this habit creates
no large bulbs, but you will of course
the greatest. Height: 15-20 cm.

So sounds like an ordinary looking nivalis that builds into a clump quickly  :-\
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Alan_b on February 16, 2011, 07:58:11 AM
Hmmm?  Maybe kentish_lass will post to tell us she has 10 already?  The description I read (courtesy of the link Brian Ellis gave on Page 7 of this thread) says:

Quote
Belongs to: 8 Galanthus Imperial Group. The still find onbenaamde immediately caught my attention. The inner green, white-edged petals grow an extra white petal. Curious and fun together. Healthy growth, strong gray-green leaves with pollen. Height: 25 cm. Flowering time: February to March.

I'm actually much in favour of cultivating snowdrops that are 'just good doers'; Joe Sharman has his "nothing special" in that category, for example.  But as a marketing strategy it seems a bit risky.  I wonder how extensively "Charlotte" has been tested?
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Maggi Young on February 16, 2011, 01:30:22 PM
Quote
I'm actually much in favour of cultivating snowdrops that are 'just good doers'; Joe Sharman has his "nothing special" in that category, for example.  But as a marketing strategy it seems a bit risky.  I wonder how extensively "Charlotte" has been tested?

 I've said this before but I will say it again... how many of the named 'drops have been 'tested' in the sense of having a good number of years of growing in ordinary garden conditions to prove their worth, constitution and stability?  Precious few.  :-X
"New " types are named and seized upon as by ravening wolves and then there is disappointment when the 'drops either die fast or change their markings.....the whole thing is daft. ???
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: johnw on February 16, 2011, 01:55:47 PM
Maggi - Hopefully Martin's approach will lead to very vigorous and dependable snowdrops.

re: unstable markings I think Green Brush is getting bad press prematurely. As I recall the book says wait a few years until a bulb is fully established and has gained some size before it exhibits its true potential. As well greenhouse culture throws markings out of whack. "In the green" torture surely doesn't help matters.  And Gerard clearly stated in response to Martin that it is a selected cultivar.

Look at magnolias and 'Vulcan' in particular, a gorgeous red in NZ. In BC it took over 10 years to flower red, previously it was a dirty pink then a ho-hum pink. Will it continue on red, who knows? Maybe our climates will never produce the same colour as the NZ climate & sun does. Even the understock has been implicated. It is still a disappointment in many parts of the UK and on the east coast of North America but everyone seems willing to wait it out. Perhaps after 25 years we will be able to determine what it requires but no one I know is ready to toss it.  BTW seedling magnolias are never judged until the 3 or 4th year of flowering and the changes can be dramatic.             

Patience. Patience. Patience, fellow wolves

johnw
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Brian Ellis on February 16, 2011, 02:32:43 PM
I've said this before but I will say it again... how many of the named 'drops have been 'tested' in the sense of having a good number of years of growing in ordinary garden conditions to prove their worth, constitution and stability?  Precious few.  :-X

That is surely the good thing about the monograph, details are given of when the plant was first found or introduced so it gives you some idea which are the good long-lasting plants.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Paddy Tobin on February 16, 2011, 02:39:08 PM
I have to agree with Maggi that, at present, we are experiencing a wave of hysterical interest in snowdrops. There are great profits to be made in feeding this hysteria and the introduction and production of newly named varieties is the commodity which provides these profits. Newly identified cultivars are, it seems to me, being bulked up in the fastest way possible, brought to flowering size as quickly as possible and then sold at as high a price as the market will bear. It is my belief that the methods of production are led by profit and not by a consideration of how best to produce a top-quality plant for the garden. Now, I am perfectly sure that such comments do not apply to all involved in the cultivation and sale of snowdrops and I am grateful for that.

Comments that a bulb will "settle down" and show its true characteristics after a few years in the garden or, worse, when the bulbs reach a mature size - people selling immature bulbs at high prices - surely indicate that snowdrops are being sold which are not fit for purpose and not true to description. What is that piece of consumer legislation called - Trades Description Act?

Of course, there is another side to this - there are hordes of people driving this trade, the people who are willing to seek out and spend large sums of money on these untried snowdrops. "Caveat emptor" still holds true.

Paddy
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Mavers on February 16, 2011, 02:52:05 PM
I hope this mania doesn't spoil a delightful hobby.

'The love of money is the root of all sorts injurious things'
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Paddy Tobin on February 16, 2011, 03:01:39 PM
I hope this mania doesn't spoil a delightful hobby.

'The love of money is the root of all sorts injurious things'

Oh, Mike, certainly not.

Above all else snowdrops to me are a constant reminder of kindness, generosity and great friendship. Financially, and being of a certain outlook, I cannot and will not spend vast amounts on snowdrops yet I have in my garden several of these much vaunted and highly expensive cultivars, given as gifts and treasured for their personal connections rather than their monetary value.

Paddy
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: johnw on February 16, 2011, 04:06:25 PM
I think we'd all agree with Maggi that a cultivar should be thoroughly tested before it's finally named and released. The Magnolia & Rhododendron worlds are plagued by the same problems.

johnw
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Mavers on February 16, 2011, 04:09:57 PM
I now what you mean Paddy, the ones I treasure most have personal connections with snowdrop growing friends.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Alan_b on February 16, 2011, 04:58:12 PM
... how many of the named 'drops have been 'tested' in the sense of having a good number of years of growing in ordinary garden conditions to prove their worth, constitution and stability?  Precious few.  :-X

Talking to Joe Sharman, my impression is that he keeps the parent bulb under observation whilst chipping/twin scaling the daughter bulbs.  That way he gets some idea of the constitution and stability whilst bulking up the numbers quite rapidly.  Of course his results only pertain to his own garden conditions, probably with frequent fungicide and insecticide treatments (which seem to be standard for nurseries).  Possibly he presumes that the chipped bulbs will perform identically to the parent.  But that must mean he has least one example under observation for at least four years before selling any.

Please note this is just conjecture on my part, based on a very brief conversation.  My point being, yes, new snowdrops are being brought to market very quickly but this does not have to preclude the due diligence of several years under observation.      
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Lesley Cox on February 16, 2011, 09:26:01 PM
'The love of money is the root of all sorts injurious things'

My late mother always contended that it was the LACK of money rather than the love of it that was the root of aa good bit of evil. ;D

John, re Magnolia 'Vulcan.' I'm sorry it isn't doing as it oughter in the north. I don't have it myself but there is a superb specimen along the road from me and I gaze in wonder at it every year. The climate throughout NZ seems to suit them really well, even the dry east coast though it and its fellow cultivars were bred in the wet of west coast North Island by the Juries, father and son. There's at least one now even closer to true red, can't remember its name. We buy them in the garden centres as grafted plants about a metre high or a bit more and already with buds. If treated reasonably well and kept well watered for the first year or two they just go on flowering regularly from birth, as it were. M. campbellii from germination to flowering takes only 8-10 years in NZ, around 25 I believe in the UK.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: johnw on February 16, 2011, 10:53:16 PM
Lesley - Sadly the other red Jury hybrids are also not exhibiting their advertised colour in the UK and elsewhere. Even a North American hybrid, Phil's Masterpiece flowered dark pink here in the east. Maybe our winters are too severe or we lack sun though others further south on the east coast report the same.

This testing business is tricky stuff and fraught with minefields.  We've all heard about the plant that does well in one's yard but impossible next door. A few other examples:

a. a friend here who was a rhodo hybridizer had a brilliant strong firey orange with red stripes in his woodland. We had watched it for over 25 years & finally he gave me a cutting. I planted it out in full sun and it's flowered pale salmon with pink stripes ever since.

b. I was told in the 70's evergreen azaleas would not grow here. A digusted enthusiast gave me a brilliant red called Stewartstonian that was close to deaththough reputed to be hardy to -15F. For seven years it froze to the ground here. The next year it took off and was totally undamaged after the worst winter we have ever seen, flowering head to toe since 1980-ish. Now over my head and 2 metres wide.

c. The German Hachmann rhodo hybrids were touted as being very hardy and very compact. In North American they were cutting grown and not grafted as in Europe.  On their own roots they are very lanky in most of N. America.  Many hopelessly tender on mild Long Island, NY. There are only a half dozen growable here.

d. A Scottish rhodo hybrid Wren is one of my favourites. It was cautiously rated as being a bit tender as the cranky, miffy, nasty beautiful ludlowii was father. Many here find it an exceedingly diffuclt plant to grow, it is hopeless further south in the summer heat. The one in my yard is in the worst possible spot, under a greedy Whych Elm. It is by far the best one I've ever seen - 4-5ft across, prostrate and never misses a year.

e. During a garden tour locally we happened upon a yellow unnamed hybrid with huge flowers opening from apricot buds. We went bananas. The next year we took a crowd round to see it, it was flowering very pale lavender with a yellowish centre. After that it flowered normally.

f. Should yellow Galanthus not be sold? They seem to lack vigour here and some are quite greenish. They can perform admirably as Ian showed us. I guess we will never have cultivars that perform superbly everywhere.  

Point is once you open your mouth and make a pronouncement on a plant it will turn around and do the exact opposite just to prove how stupid we are. Still no excuse for Galanthus cultivars to be hitting the sales tables before they are carefully watched and deemed worthy.

johnw - now with feet bared we are off to press some E A Bowles for a trial batch of bubbly.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Brian Ellis on February 17, 2011, 10:15:36 AM
Quote
johnw - now with feet bared we are off to press some E A Bowles for a trial batch of bubbly.

Tee hee, add some Green Tear for added fizz 8)
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: johnw on February 17, 2011, 11:57:40 AM
Quote
johnw - now with feet bared we are off to press some E A Bowles for a trial batch of bubbly.

Tee hee, add some Green Tear for added fizz 8)

Or a green tear latte?

johnw
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Mavers on February 17, 2011, 03:16:30 PM
Hi Lesley, seems like your mother could be wiser than the bloke wot rote wot I kwoted.  ;D

 I would love to see the magnolias in New Zealand. Is the soil in NZ predominantly low pH?
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Lesley Cox on February 17, 2011, 11:07:52 PM
Mike, the soil is low pH in some areas especially. One is Taranaki on the west coast of the North Island where these Magnolias were bred and there is an outstanding Rhododendron garden there, at New Plymouth, called Pukeiti, almost in the shadow of a lovely mountain, cone-shaped like Fujiama, called Mt Egmont or more nowadays, by its Maori name of Mt Taranaki. Another low pH area is Dunedin, my home town and its environs and again known for its rhodos. We have big Rhododenron festivals both here and at Pukeiti. A lot of the west coast of the South Island is also very peaty and much wetter than on my side of the island. About 6-8 METRES of rain per year!!

My mother was very hot on quotations being correct and drummed into me that "A little learning is a dangerous thing" (not knowledge) and that pride goeth before destruction not a fall. "Pride goeth before destruction and a haughty spirit before a fall." All things to do with the English language she held as almost sacred and the first line of your above post has her spinning in her grave. ;D

On the other hand, she and my late brother had this thing going on whereby they mis-quoted literary things to each other, always very clever and witty and I, brought up with these, often produced them in school English classes, to get a good laugh for the wit but also to get in trouble for being wrong.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Brian Ellis on February 18, 2011, 11:15:50 AM
Lesley do you know what the rhododendron garden on the Hawera side of Mount Egmont is called.  David can't remember ???
...and to put it straight he has now found his slides and it was Pukeiti, he last visited it in Oct 1976.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Brian Ellis on February 18, 2011, 12:01:15 PM
Wading through the mountains of slides he has found Pukekura Park too and is now waxing lyrical about them ;D
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Maggi Young on February 18, 2011, 12:03:18 PM
Lesley do you know what the rhododendron garden on the Hawera side of Mount Egmont is called.  David can't remember ???
...and to put it straight he has now found his slides and it was Pukeiti, he last visited it in Oct 1976.
Holy Moly! David was able to find slides from 1976 so fast? IIf we could locate that sort of thing inside six months we'd be celebrating..... mind you, the storage system here is a little..... how shall we put this?..... "informal"... yes, that'll do, informal!!  ;D ;D
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Brian Ellis on February 18, 2011, 12:07:36 PM
Lesley do you know what the rhododendron garden on the Hawera side of Mount Egmont is called.  David can't remember ???
...and to put it straight he has now found his slides and it was Pukeiti, he last visited it in Oct 1976.
Holy Moly! David was able to find slides from 1976 so fast? IIf we could locate that sort of thing inside six months we'd be celebrating..... mind you, the storage system here is a little..... how shall we put this?..... "informal"... yes, that'll do, informal!!  ;D ;D

Tee hee,  ;D ;D King Edward Park in Hawera looks nice too :) David's system is 'informal' too, but they were brought out some years ago to look at and we haven't got round to it.  They were to hand, as it were :D
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Maggi Young on February 18, 2011, 12:45:24 PM
Quote
David's system is 'informal' too, but they were brought out some years ago  to look at and we haven't got round to it.  They were to hand, as it were Cheesy

 Oh, thank goodness for that.... you've saved me from a seriously depressed afternoon.  :D
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Lesley Cox on February 19, 2011, 09:13:00 PM
Nothiong comes to mind Brian on the drier side. Hawera is not on my radar particularly except as a Narcissus var and there's a cheese factory there. To digress, the evils of centralising important community services is illustrated by the incident a few years ago when someone dialled 111 (999 to you) for an ambulance to go urgently to Lake Hawea in the lower part of the South Island, only to have it sent to an address in Hawera, west coast North Island. I don't remember the outcome but there was national outrage from the public. We have it all the time. Mt Wellington (known to Anthony now), is actually in Aucland and Palmerston is in Otago near me but Palmerston North is in the North Island, the "north" bit, always omitted by broadcasters and weatherforecasters so no wonder confusion occurs. Likewise, a gentleman from Germany some years ago asked me for the locations of various mega herbs as he was planning a trip to Auckland and wanted to see them. Said mega herbs are on the Auckland Islands, in the great southern ocean.  ;D

If I think of the rhodo garden I'll let you know. Pukekura Park, though small as cricket grounds go, was voted a couple of years back by international commentators as the prettiest cricket goind in the world. :D
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: Brian Ellis on February 20, 2011, 12:08:26 AM
Sorry Lesley you missed my update, he was mistaken:
Quote
...and to put it straight he has now found his slides and it was Pukeiti, he last visited it in Oct 1976.
Title: Re: 2010/11 catalogues
Post by: JimF on February 21, 2011, 08:44:43 PM
Colors do change in many genera due to pH, richness or lack of fertility in soil, sun or shade exposure, and other factors.

I work at a retail nursery (garden center) in Seattle/Bellevue, WA and we have noticed over 40 years the following cultural and production technique changes made in cultivars and genera.

Japanese maples will not show autumn color properly for the first two or three years if you water them those 2-3 years, as you should, to establish them, or if they are planted in rich soil. Life is too good. The leaves simply brown come and dry up come late autumn. Once the roots begin finding less food and water the autumn color is brilliant. Natural stress increases the color on most trees - drought, colder days, heat.  Also if the maple is planted in the middle of a lawn fed with nitrogen - serious loss of autumn color and an unwillingness to go dormant.

Hydrangeas are typical chameleons due to pH. Rhododendron flower color, we find, may be affected by pH, but more by UV rays depending on latitude, altitude, and plain old "hot" sun with dryish soils. (I grew up in Alaska where flower colors were brighter then "down here."

Some witch hazels cultivars take a year or two to settle down to true flower color. Many retain their leaves through winter like beech when grafted onto clonal stock with that propensity. My suspicion is that H. autumnalis won't cause leaf retention. When grafted onto Parrotia, as many witch hazels are here to create standards, there is no leave retention.

Hosta varieties which most often are sports are no longer tissued cultured here because they sport again and again in the initial chopping up step, so mutable are the cells. Many rose cultivars "drift" when budded by the 100,000s in the US so within 4-5 years 'Iceberg' on sale is not like the original plant, though the differences are sometimes subtle. Hence a modern techinque to go back to the original stock every ten years to correct for this drift and senility.

So if a snowdrop is chipped and twinned and pushed through feeding to get as many bulbs as soon as possible, and the cultivar is a mutation to begin with, which I suspect a good number of findlings may be, then it would follow that assembly line production will produce changes subtle to major. Something to be said for patience.

I have had many old seedling "stable" cultivars of galanthus look "untrue" the first year in pots (how I grow all of mine) or if a only single bulb in a pot making for lots of food for the little bugger. By year two or three they/it settled down and "match" the description. I expect my experience of this is from a "kinder" culture in a pot vs tough love under beech trees, etc. pH is sometimes mentioned as decreasing or increasing the yellow in the yellows, which are mutable in some such as 'Lady E.'.

So to repeat so many of you, patience in all things, especially these little bulbs which have grabbed us hook, line, and sinker.

Jim
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