Trillium 2011

[bulborum]

Welcome here Larry

Fantastic collection Kurabayashii's
I just have 3 different ones
Red , Dark red and almost black
never seen a yellow , white or a bi-coloured one

Roland

[kalle-k.dk]

Welcome to the forum Larry, a week ago I planted several pots with seedlings of Trillium albidum and kurabayashii out into my garden, I hope they will be just as beautiful as yours Larry

Knud; Svend Aage has still a fantastic nurserie and garden.

Several Trillium got flowers and I must look at them every day. One of them I got as Trillium kojima and I've tried to find out what it is: it is a Trillium coming from the Japanese island Kojima and it is described as Trillium amabile var. atropurpureocarpum and the name amabile is a synonym for smallii, so it must be Trillium smallii var. atropurpureocarpum.

For the first time I have flowers in the rare Trillium x miyabeanum, it is sterile so no seeds.

Trillium pusillum giving me trouble, just the variety ozarkanum grows very well for me. Last year I got the variety monticulum and I am very pleased that it already bloom this year.

[John Aipassa]

......It is fortunate, too, that the Trillium seem to bloom before the bears come out of hibernation!  Two old guys with bad knees (Richard) and bad feet (me) gimping along the roadsides, looking at flowers!  At least Ben got to sit in his nice lab in the Netherlands for his part of it.  Richard and I even had a couple cars of park rangers worried that we were going to fall over at their feet on one occasion, on a back road at high elevation.  We were a little out of breath, but we managed to stay upright........

Maybe the bears did see you, but out of pity they didn't bother you...

[John Aipassa]

........We are all three retired, and this is 100% un-funded, so it may not get finished the way I'd like to see it.........

Jim,

Here is one that would like to join in the research. Work has prevented me from taking time to go to the States and see the gems in the wild. There is a chance that next year I will be able to go so maybe it is time to join in as you have mentioned before.

Best,

[John Aipassa]

......For this post I'm attaching pics of 7 forms of wild T. kurabayshii taken in the last few weeks in Humboult Conty, CA. Enjoy.....

Welcome Larry and thank you for sharing these pictures of beautiful wild specimens of my favourite Trillium.

Cheers,

[John Aipassa]

Variations of albidum in my garden. All of them bought as albidum but, when I look at their ovaries (not visible in the pictures) the first two are most probably hybrids.

[John Aipassa]

Group planting of albidum and kurabayashii

[John Aipassa]

A few garden impressions with my Trilliums

1. cuneatum
2. cuneatum
3. ovatum
4. albidum and anemone nemorosa
5. albidum and Helleborus

[Larry Neel]

Variations of albidum in my garden. All of them bought as albidum but, when I look at their ovaries (not visible in the pictures) the first two are most probably hybrids.

John,

The more time I spend in the woods the less sure I am about species ID. The plant I called a white form of T. kurabayashii is visually identical to T. albidum. T. albidum however usually colonizes in suitable locations and when it does grow near T. kurabayashii or T. chloropetalum there can be hybrids. I've attached a picture of such a plant from the only location I know where T. albidum and T. kurabayashii overlap, taken in 2009. Unfortunately when I revisited the site to try and collect seeds, elk had trampled the area and I couldn't find the hybrids in 2010.

The white and yellow forms of T. kurabayashii occur at about 1 plant per 200 of the standard Burgundy and pop up here and there, never as a group. Additionally all the wild T. albidum I've observed have a sweet apple like fragrance. The white Kura's have a rotten fetid smell which attracts a predatory type pollinator who ignore all the other blooming plants which probably accounts for the fact there are no intermediate colors between these two in the wild. I hope to change this with my paintbrush. Attached is a picture of the pollinator mentioned above.

Last but not least there are differences in similar plants growing in the same general area as shown in the last two attached pictures. One plant has what I will call conventional stamens and anthers for T. kurabayashii while the other plant has yellow stamens and anthers.

My suspicion is that the people responsible for giving us the keys for the western species were primarily "Road Hunters" and never got back to their rigs after an hour or two in the brush, muddy, bloody, with more ticks on their bodies than when they left the road and in a couple of days were in trouble because some of that vegetation used to pull yourself up those steep unwalkable slopes; well that was poison oak.

Irregardless of what they are it's nice to see and grow them.

[jshields]

........We are all three retired, and this is 100% un-funded, so it may not get finished the way I'd like to see it.........

Jim,

Here is one that would like to join in the research. Work has prevented me from taking time to go to the States and see the gems in the wild. There is a chance that next year I will be able to go so maybe it is time to join in as you have mentioned before.

Best,

John,

The invitation still stands.  We are not going into the field this year, but we hope to collect T. erectum next year from just north of the Great Smoky Mountains National Park northward on into Pennsylvania.  We want to see how the nuclear DNA amounts there, far from any T. simile, compare to those inside the National Park.  If we do make the trip, it will most likely be in the latter half of April.  I need to check with local Trillium folks for localities and bloom dates.  Anybody care to suggest best bloom dates and possible collection sites?  We collect three live specimens per colony, usually.  We may take more herbarium specimens, but usually without the rhizome and roots.

If you can get over here for 10 days or so when we go, we can start out showing you the Trillium species as they grow inside the National Park, then head north to collect the other specimens.

Jim

[John Aipassa]

...... Additionally all the wild T. albidum I've observed have a sweet apple like fragrance. The white Kura's have a rotten fetid smell which attracts a predatory type pollinator who ignore all the other blooming plants which probably accounts for the fact there are no intermediate colors between these two in the wild. I hope to change this with my paintbrush. Attached is a picture of the pollinator mentioned above.....
.........

Hi Larry,

And what about the ovaries. Is there no difference in the colour between albidum and kurabayashii. I believe kurabayashii has a dark purple one and albidum has whitish to whitish pink? Or is this too a garden observation?

Since you hunt for these gems off the beaten track, besides the ticks aren't you scared for mountain lions or bears?

Another question about leaf pattern. Russ Graham showed me a kurabayashii from the Brookings area once with superb leaf colours and leaf mottling. Is this typical for 'northern' types or do you find them lets say in Humboldt county or Klamath area too?

Cheers,
John

[John Aipassa]

.....The invitation still stands.....

OK Jim,

If the opportunity will really come for me next year, than count me in.


Cheers,

[Larry Neel]

Hi John,

The burgundy form of grayish is purple. The yellow or white forms can be purple, light pink, or green. Jepson says album is usually light but purple forms exist. Russ Graham called out PBS last week over some new pictures they posted as . Some very responsible people went back out in the field with four books to help key things out, visited two different populations and concluded there was too much variation for a positive ID as album or .

Range cattle are worse. I've been chased by bulls a couple of times. Our local black bears are as scared of us as we are of them. With the exception of young animals driven close to humans because of range conflicts, lions are basically invisible. Their senses are so keen that they see you but you never see them. I've seen their tracks and stumbled on a half dozen of their kills but after thousands of hours in the woods and mountains, the only ones I've seen are driving mountain roads at night. It amazes me that an animal that large could be so elusive.

Grayish by my observation is the most consistent of the western sessiles when it comes to mottling. As I'm sure you're aware, the mottling fades with age. T. album is the least consistent. I've attached some pictures from a wonderfull place called Big Meadows in Siskiyou County CA which has a cream colored albibum that grows as high as 7000'. Also attached are a picture of a plain leafed but bright white flowered form from Salmon River CA and a pic of a mottled form from Bald Hills, in Humboldt County CA. I'll post some pics of grayish from my garden when the flowers open. (Spring still hasn't sprung here.)

Regards,
Larry

[Larry Neel]

Somehow the word kurabayashii got changed to grayish on my post and I didn't get your qoutes right. Sorry, I'll learn.

Larry           

[Maggi Young]

Hello Larry, welcome to the Forum.... sorry it took me so long to say "hi" but I'm just back from the Alpines 2011 conference .

...great photos you are all showing here.... happily, the dual Foreest and Farrer Medal for the most meritorius plant in the Confercen Show was won by a magnificent pot of Trillium grandiflorum, over 20 years old, always pot grown, byt Chris Lilley... see Cliff Booker's  photos of this great plant here :

http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?topic=2751.msg197562#msg197562