Rhodo ID's or clues

[nicheplanthead]

This late fall I transplanted this two rhodo from large pots but I have lost my labels.

I'm not sure if there are even on my records but I have included what I have here
that might help somebody to recognize by associating with my list. I don't think they
are from my seedlist grown plants but I should also check as the list seems to be
missing a few..

I think its time for me to get John Greer's book or if anyone has a better recommendation.

Rhodo  hanceanum nanum   2005
Rhodo Aborescens   2005
Rhodo Algo   2001
Rhodo autumn velvet   2006
Rhodo canadensis   2005
Rhodo complexum   2004
Rhodo counterpoint   2005
Rhodo fastiagatum DD   2001
Rhodo ferrungineum DD   2001
Rhodo Girard's Hot shot   2006
Rhodo groendlanicum   2004?
Rhodo Hellikki   2004
Rhodo impeditum DD   2001
Rhodo impeditum DD   2005
Rhodo intricatum   2005
Rhodo July Joy   2005
Rhodo Kermesina Rose   2006
Rhodo kiusianum   2001
Rhodo kiusianum purple DDform   2001
Rhodo Lemon Drop   2005
Rhodo mucronolatum   2005
Rhodo mucronulatum   2005
Rhodo mucronulatum Cheiju Isl   2003
Rhodo Nova Zembla   2007
Rhodo narcissiflora   2006
Rhodo patty bee   2005
Rhodo Pink dawn   2006
Rhodo Pink Discovery   /
Rhodo PJM compacta   2000
Rhodo pohjola's daughterDD   2004
Rhodo popsicle DD   2001
Rhodo prunifolia   2004
Rhodo Sericho   2004
Rhodo Thunder   2006
Rhodo Towhead DD   2005
Rhodo wren DD   2001
Rhodo x Apricot suprise   2004
Rhodo x NorthernStarburstDD   2004
Rhodo x Oudijiks favourite   2005
Rhodo x patty bee   2005
Rhodo x Pink Discovery    2005?
Rhodo x Starburst DD   2004
Rhodo Yak Ken Janek   2001
R REX ARIZELUM          2007
R.TOMENTOSUM SSP TOMENTOSUM  2007

I'm slowly becoming a rhodoholic after joining the local club at the montreal botanical garden and
the american rhodo society..

pics were taken today

many thanks,

Stuart Hechinger
Beaconsfield Quebec Canada -3C

[johnw]

Stuart - The best I can do is eliminate the ones on your list that are definitely not in the running for the proper id. So this list below shows what they could be.

They appear to be in Lapponica Subsection, these are notoriously difficult to id without a hand lens to examine the scales etc. and still difficult. Also they grow so differently in your climate I can't make any pronouncements. Maybe others might make an attempt.


Rhodo complexum   2004
Rhodo fastiagatum DD   2001
Rhodo impeditum DD   2001
Rhodo impeditum DD   2005
Rhodo intricatum   2005

johnw

[Maggi Young]

John is correct, these things are tricky..... and your plants  seem to be suffering a bit.... I imagine it's because you've been getting -3 temperatures... the leaves are in what I would call "cold mode".... rather rolled at the edges.... there may be an element of stress too, if they have only recently been released from their pots, and are a bit dry...... not that I suggest watering them when it's minus 3 degrees!!
My comments which follow are based on what I would surmise if confronted by your plants in my garden conditons.........
I'm going to go a little further than John, though....... I don't choose complexum  because the leaf tips of yours seem a little too rounded......
I'm passing on  fastigiatum and impeditum because their growth tends to be more compact and congested....which leaves me with intricatum.... this does make a plant with slighty taller, twigy appearance. When in full prime condition, the leaves should have a grey-blue appearance and be very scaly.

So, that's my contribution... hope it helps!

[nicheplanthead]

Thanks John and Magii you are real both a whiz

did not know they were of the Lapponica group

my memory has been jogged as it is likely complexum
and intricatum

I was hoping to rely on the listing on the american rhodo society website but the genus is so large that I guess I need to get a decent text to find which one is which now!!

I'm happy that I can grow these small ones as I killed a few fastigatum's and var. rupicola but I now grow them on better better soil mixes than I used to. I still think my soil is deficient just by comparing the leaves of others I have seen on the web. I am using some powdered sulpher to get acidity from 6.5 to a bit lower. Maybe its the vaccinium minus stealing nutrients.

I had to chop some roots to make them fit but it has been relatively damp this fall, and temperature will get down to -20C for a week in winter and possibly lower so I am just happy to keep them.

Stuart Hechinger now -6C Beaconsfield Quebec

[nicheplanthead]

Here is my records from zero experience to now modest success..
 hardiness from greers book whatever the spelling
at -20C or worse sometimes it lasts for a week and gets even colder
I'm pushing the limit of what can be grown

Rhodo  hanceanum nanum   2005   bvc   1' 0F    died               
Rhodo Aborescens   2005                        
Rhodo Algo   2001   two cuttings planted left of daphne mez in back medium shiny leaf      upright sun tolrrance 3' minus v minus               
Rhodo autumn velvet   2006   plant sale large pot                     
Rhodo canadensis   2005   comments -25F Early compact upright bushy flowers new growth                     
Rhodo complexum   2004   s. lapponicum 1' -10F earlyMay average                     
Rhodo counterpoint   2005   lepidote 4' -20F E semi-dbl pink weston nursery similar to pjm                  -06 aug 6" new growth    
Rhodo fastiagatum DD   2001   C -15F mid season   2004 died in protected pot                  
Rhodo ferrungineum DD   2001   lost??   2' -15F mid Alpine rose takes some sun perfect drainage                  
Rhodo Girard's Hot shot   2006   rsociety in lpot      2" aug new groth               
Rhodo groendlanicum   2004?   2006 dieback ? too dry                     
Rhodo Hellikki   2004   1.8mx1.8m   in back                   
Rhodo impeditum DD   2001   1' -15F    died 2002 spring      replaced 2002      severe damage 2003 spring      
Rhodo impeditum DD   2005   bvc   2006 died in trough in spring            
Rhodo intricatum   2005   bvc   2' -15F   24"x24         
Rhodo July Joy   2005   blooms July!' -06 new growth yellow                
Rhodo Kermesina Rose   2006   large pot               
Rhodo kiusianum   2001   seedling   2' -10F   in back in front cedar small leaf         
Rhodo kiusianum purple DDform   2001   2004 died or near death in covered pot               
Rhodo Lemon Drop   2005   -06 by august 1'+ new growth               
Rhodo mucronolatum   2005   5' -15F    ?Cheju form hardy            
Rhodo mucronulatum   2005   rwoc?   aug 1'            
Rhodo mucronulatum Cheiju Isl   2003   garden near cedars in front of small leaf kiusianum -06 half branches gone?               
Rhodo Nova Zembla   2007                  
Rhodo narcissiflora   2006   plant sale large pot      aug little growth leaf brown spots white tips         
Rhodo patty bee   2005   dieback spring august died               
Rhodo Pink dawn   2006   plant sale   3" aug new growth            
Rhodo Pink Discovery   /                  
Rhodo PJM compacta   2000   18" upright leaves lite yel shud be dark grn 39"x4"               4' -25F minus var minus Carolinanum grp x dauricum
Rhodo pohjola's daughterDD   2004   died in ground dried up                           
Rhodo popsicle DD   2001   hot pink   leafs out late no flwr 02 died         2003 died               
Rhodo prunifolia   2004   4' -15F                           
Rhodo Sericho   2004   in back growing flat -06                           
Rhodo Thunder   2006   soc sale in lpot      3-4" aug  new growth                      
Rhodo Towhead DD   2005   2006 died   suspect pot                        
Rhodo wren DD   2001   1' 0F   died?                        
Rhodo x Apricot suprise   2004   in front of cedars at end         large leafs opposite -06 circles cut out by insect                  
Rhodo x NorthernStarburstDD   2004   JP died                           
Rhodo x Oudijiks favourite   2005   bvc   3' -10F angustini hybrid                        
Rhodo x patty bee   2005   bvc   18" -10F keiskei   died 2006                      
Rhodo x Pink Discovery    2005?   front tip dieback -06                           

[nicheplanthead]

Here are some pix on how I over winter rhodo seedlings in a climate where we have winter defrost cycles and rains, freezing ice storms, and sometimes >6' of snow cover and heavy loading. at least -20C and windy. The building is my wind break 

If I would put them in a covered cold frame the melt down period still would cause water accumulation up to the pots rim, then freezing. I know of nursery man here that puts all his plants on the side and then covers them with a large tarpalin until spring. He get a fair bit of branch damage from the snow loading and it must be real messy in spring time.

[johnw]

Stuart - Here is a friend's coldframe for seedlings, it could easily be adapted to hold pots in wood chips.  Note the heavy 2x4's for snowload.

As she is in the mild southern area of Nova Scotia she says she doesn't require the white plastic but instead uses shade cloth.  We have argued about this as I am a firm believer in the white plastic covering in December (here). The shade cloth keeps snow out which is sometimes much needed, the plastic stabilizes temperature fluctuations much more and prevents the frame from drying out over the long winter.

johnw 

[Martin Baxendale]

Can anyone help with the name of a rhodo that I bought from Glendoick years ago? It's a very large-flowered, large-leaved highly scented hybrid, huge frilly white flowers, straggly habit, smooth leaves, quite tender. I lost the label ages ago, but seem to recall that its name was  (something) Waves, perhaps White Waves. I've been hoping Glendoick would list it again so I could confirm the name but they haven't offered it since and I can't find it on their website. Can't find it in any of my rhodo books either and online searches come up with nothing. Maybe it had a name change.

If anyone can help, that'd be great. Otherwise I guess I'll have to write to Glendoick.

[Maggi Young]

Can't think off hand, Martin, but a cup of hot chocolate and a biscuit may aid the thought processes..... off I go....

[johnw]

Martin - White Waves is the name. It is [nuttallii (lindleyi x dalhousiae)]. Hybridizer HJ Braafladt. Named by GF Smith. Reistered by GF Smith  1999. 2 x 1.8m in 15 years. This from The Int Rhodo.Register & Checklist.  Can scan and send to you. Basically, 5 wavy edged lobes, rose red fading on opening to creamy white with pink flush aging to white.Dark brown anthers.

johnw

PS - Coming here tomorrow rain, heavy snow, freezing rain, wind.   That about covers most bases.

[Maggi Young]

Well done, John, I may not have a complete set, but I can't find White Waves!! Thanks!

[Martin Baxendale]

Thanks, John. That's the one. Any mention of hardiness? I think it was Glendoick's hardiness category H-1 (tender, mild frosts only, okay outside only in mildest parts of UK, such as West Coast Islands and western coastline) i.e. only really for glasshouse for most of us. I was wondering about minimum temps. as it's getting quite big now and a sheltered wall outside would be a good option if there's a chance it won't mind too much, though I suspect it would at least need a lot of protection.

[johnw]

Martin - No mention of hardiness and I think it would be a real asset if they had given hardiness ratings for the hybrids. I know this is difficult to do and most often the plants are hardier than the conditions in the hybridizer's / grower's garden.  Sometimes the reverse. We find the UK hardiness ratings h1-h5 too broad but at least it's a start.

Given the parentage of White Waves I'd say -3 to -5c would be a good guess, maybe -7c for some of the hardier spp. of Maddenias of which this is not one. There are always surprises though, here usually nasty ones. Sounds like a hybrid for planting out at Brodick & the like, otherwise a tub plant.

Here's a Maddenia hybrid we grew from seed, may be close to your WW. Big tub and have to cart it in for the winter. Nice fragrance. May have posted this before  .  Rhododendron {nuttallii  x  <[(dalhousiae  x  taggianum)  x  (dalhousiae  x  nuttallii)]  x  lindleyi>} Any more complex and we would run out of bracket types.

johnw

[Maggi Young]

Oooh! Big, glorious creature! 

Martin, if yours is getting a bit too leggy, why not try a little bit of cutting back, one branch at a time, to see if it will break again...that will keep it a wee bit easier to move in and out in the pot......

[Martin Baxendale]

Thanks John. I was guessing only tolerant of light frosts, although yesterday and last night its pot froze solid for a few hours before I got it under cover and it's looking okay. It's the nutallii blood that makes me think it probably won't tolerate enough frost to plant out here. So into a bigger pot it'll have to be.

Maggi, eventually I'll have to cut back the two ridiculously long straggly main shoots but I'm loathe to lose them. There are smaller shoots below that would immediately grow up and make a better, more compact plant, but the two straggly ones each produce a hudge bud and a truss of flowers every year, so I'd lose a year's flowering. Wonder if I could root the tips of the main  shoots, then I could tell myself I'm propagating rather than pruning?

Will have to post a pic when the buds burst. It really is a glorious flower. Really huge. And the scent is fantastic.

That, by the way, is a lovely seedling you have there. I'm a real sucker for Maddenia hybrids. Just bought last autumn a plant of Martha Wright from Glendoick, supposed to be an improved Fragrantissimum, which I've grown for years along with Lady Alice Fitzwilliam, and others.