Evolution of a Crocus Garden

[Ragged Robin]

Thrilling Paul - no wonder you're so chuffed - can't wait 'til the next chapter 

[tonyg]

Howdy All,

An interesting side effect of my new crocus garden...... I have had seed set this year.  Up until now I have only ever seen seed set on C. laevigatus and C. tommasinianus, but this year there is laevigatus, pulchellus, tournefortii, sieberi ssp sieberi, mathewii (the seeds of this last one are massive compared to the others) and cvijicii (I bought a second clone this year, and it obviously worked.... there are pods below ground as I checked today, but they're still below ground so I will leave them alone).  Very, very cool.    I have no idea what hybridisation is possible amongst the crocus I had out in flower so I would imagine that some at least are hybrids.  I guess I'll find out in a few years when they flower.
So, I wonder if there will be any others that I haven't found as yet.  It is amazing how some pods emerge to just at the ground level, while others shoot up on a tall stem.  Very, very cool.

Great news Paul!  From the species you list I would be surprised if any are hybrids.  Yes, the sativus group (which includes C mathewii do have some of the largest seeds of any crocus (C pestalozzae has the smallest btw, much smaller than C sieberi which are quite wee!)  Getting a different clone for intraspecific (within species) hybridisation can make a huge difference to seeed set.  
Interested that you have C cvijicii outside, how hot/dry does it get?  I have never had many and am loath to risk them in the garden although they should do OK.  

[Paul T]

Thanks Robin.

Tony,

I have always grown cvijicii in a pot up until making this garden, so it got a lot hotter corm-wise than it does now.  I have always kept them slightly damp and a little more shaded though.  Since putting them into the garden they have gone crazy, multiplying like they never have before.  Far more flowers this year.  They are in the corner of the garden (far left in the main shots of the garden) where they get some summer shading (not much, but it helps) from the weeping apricot next to the garden.  They also do get an occasional watering during summer, whereas the rest of the garden gets nothing except rain on the rare occasions it happens.    Summer temps here get to around 40'C at least once in summer, with plenty of above 35'C.  I think the sand mulch on top helps to keep as much heat as possible out of the ground too.

I had a lot of different crocus in flower at the same time this year (so many of them flowered for so much longer than they ever had before, I think because of the size benefits of growing them in the garden now instead of pots), so there was a lot of overlap.  Lots of bees around too.  Not entirely sure what will cross with what, so I have no idea whether suitable partners were open at the same time.  Still, if what I have listed seed of don't have that many that will cross with them, it bodes well.  I was pleased to check and discover another seed pod below ground on the sieberi ssp seiberi this morning.  It is the nice form with the dark outside.... now my seed count went from 2 seeds to 9 of them.  Not much, but better than the 2 only that I had found yesterday. 

[Ragged Robin]

Paul, it all sounds such fun with the new seed pod discoveries - can you show us 'uninitiated' a sample at some stage when you next look?

[Paul T]

Robin,

The only seedpods that are still in place are the cvijicii, as they are still underground.  What I'll do is carefully scrape back the surface again and photograph them, then photograph them when they start to emerge.  They still have their leaves on them as they're a bit later than many of the species that are already heading into dormancy (i.e the autumn and early winter ones).  I'll try to remember to do that tomorrow.... a bit murky at the moment as heading towards 7pm here now.

[Ragged Robin]

Look forward to that 

[Paddy Tobin]

Paul,

I have my eye on a spot in the garden where I could very easily make a crocus bed in your style. To date I haven't been a crocus fan, just the odd clump of the sturdy cultivars here and there in the garden but I am impressed by your success and am very tempted to give it a try. However, there is a long list of "jobs" to be done in the garden and it will have to wait its turn.

Paddy

[Lesley Cox]

It seems to be a good year for crocus seed here too, with pods on a number of species that haven't given any before.  Haven't looked on the cvijicii as it's just a single clone, but here are first C. sieberi sublimis tricolor with 2 pods and 3 for C. longiflorus. There are about 20 pods altogether on the patch of longiflorus.




The pod stems will lengthen to about 2 cms before they open.

Is it correct Tony, that C. sativus is always sterile? I know the cultivated corms seem to be, but what about from the wild? You'd think that with that long and flashy stigma, it would be begging for it.

[Paul T]

Lesley,

I had some pods (laevigatus for example) that were open at ground level, and others that had pods on around a 7cm stem.  Obviously some try to put the seeds right around the parent, while the others send them higher so that they topple over and spread the seed a few inches from the parent?  I can only assume that is the reason, anyway?

Paddy,

In that case it was well worthwhile having posted my garden this way.  If it inspires anyone to grow Crocus then fan-bleedin-tastic!! 

[Janis Ruksans]

 
Interested that you have C cvijicii outside, how hot/dry does it get?  I have never had many and am loath to risk them in the garden although they should do OK.  

I grew cvijicii for many years outside without any problems and only recently replaced stocks to pots where they don't feel so well as in open garden, but I must do so for safety from rodents. All residual stocks in open garden were eated by them. For this reason it disappear from my catalogue at present but now stocks again raise up. It well splits and very well set seeds.
Janis

[Paul T]

Janis,

It sets seed well when you have more than one clone.  That is why mine has finally set seed.... I bought another clone from Marcus H in Tas (my original came from elsewhere, a gift from a friend who had grown his from seed).  I tried pollinating every year where possible but never had seed set, whereas this year with the cross pollination between the two I have 3 seedpods set.  I adore this species, and am very happy that mine is now multiplying well in the ground AND now setting seed for me to start more.

[Janis Ruksans]

Janis,

It sets seed well when you have more than one clone.  That is why mine has finally set seed.... I bought another clone from Marcus H in Tas (my original came from elsewhere, a gift from a friend who had grown his from seed).  I tried pollinating every year where possible but never had seed set, whereas this year with the cross pollination between the two I have 3 seedpods set.  I adore this species, and am very happy that mine is now multiplying well in the ground AND now setting seed for me to start more.

Yes, I have several clones inclusive creamy white and between seedlings appear even purest white but in other aspects typical cvijicii. Some years ago in AGS bulletin was note that during full day was found 3 pure white specimens in wild between millions of bright yellow. Excellent plant which need some water in summer. One of my favourites.
Janis

[Paul T]

Janis,

Yes, I've admired your creamy forms when you've posted pics of them before.  I hope they'll make it to Australia one day, but I realise I'm going to have to wait quite a while yet. 

[Otto Fauser]

Paul , Crocus caspius always ripens the seedpods below ground here in my garden - so I
 usually forget to collect it's seeds . Iris histrio v. aintabensis also ripens it's seedpot below
 ground .
  The last Crocus that flowered yesterday - a full month after all others - was a seedling
 of C. veluchensis alba , not a very exciting shade of pale mauve-pink .

[Paul T]

Wow, Otto.  Crocuses STILL going?    Has been ages since my last Crocus flower here.  But that was a purchase of veluchensis from Marcus this year, so it fits the timing cycle.  Has been at least a couple of weeks since any sign of anything flower-wise though.

I've only ever had one pod on the retic type irises, that being a histrio pod last year.  It was very visible above ground for quite some time.  Despite pollinating between the retics on a number of occasions this year, it appears that none set seed unfortunately.