Chelsea Chop on bulbs?

[annew]

Another grower, Suzy Wert in America, has told me of an interesting experiment you might like to try (Ian Y I'm thinking of you!) - in her words:

I found a really cool idea on an ONION website from an agricultural university here in the US. This is important because the research money, the BIG research money, goes to the agricultural schools here. It said that when first-year onion seedlings are 3" tall, cut the foliage back to 1" to promote bulb and root growth.  They do this in the field with a mower.  Yes, that is what it says, and I may as well state here and now that NO ONE here in the US thinks it has any merit, though John Reed said he will try it with a set of one of his million standard-seedlings.   

So I did it last February 2015 on one of six pots of N. cordubensis seedlings that had been sown under lights in Dec. 2014.  I meant to keep a control pot and take photos, but what happened was about 3 days after cutting, the foliage started thickening to what I think was three times its diameter (I have no way to measure such small increments, but to my eye it looked 3x thicker). I cut 4 more pots and still kept a control pot.   It was at this time I started telling other hybridizers here about the idea, but they had absolutely no interest in cutting off their foliage.  When we reached March 14 - Pi Day, I realized what I was seeing.  I had cut off 2/3 (66%) yes, but the foliage thickened 3x, but because of Pi, it actually may have increased the surface area of the green.  (1/3 (33% remaining green) x 3 (amount increase in diameter) x 3.14 Pi = 3).  Meanwhile, the control pot kept growing and growing and I thought the foliage was going to fall over and I ended up cutting it, too!  Bye bye control pot.     The cut foliage keeps growing in length, BTW, but it never gets to the point where it falls over because of the stabilizing influence of the thicker diameter.

Once my downunder miniatures arrived, I needed those lights, so I had to do some moving around.  I was surprised to see the roots on the N. cordubensis were long out of the pots, curled under the pots in the dark where they got the most water, and out of the pots about 2 - 3" and very thick -- you know that contractile root is always thick - except these were over 5 1/2" long, possibly 6" (from the bulb).  AND because that foliage was so much thicker, it never, ever fell over, and stayed green a long time, well, I still have one pot with a lot of green foliage in it.   

Here's what I'm saying. If you have a more open mind than my people here and a pot of seeds, a duplicate of something else, try this; When the foliage is 3" tall, cut it back to 1".  Cut the foliage of every bulb in the pot, because I believe senescence comes later to bulbs who have had the cutting, and you don't want to water the green if you have dried bulbs in the same pot. Keep everything else the same, fertilizer, water, light, etc., and see if this is not a great thing. I believe when all is said and done, you can shave one year off time-to-bloom. Harold Koopowitz is worried about virus transference and suggests pinching not cutting, but my thought is that once your fingers are infected, what difference does it make? Another fella here, now deceased, used a new razor blade for each daffodil flower he cut for show. Maybe that is the better option if virus is a problem for you. (Harold is in a southern California greenhouse, think Mediterranean, and grows many different things, not just daffodils or spring-blooming bulbs).

[Matt T]

Coo! That sounds interesting, thanks Anne. Such a bad year for seed here there's not much hope of having enough of anything for two pots, but maybe next year.

[Ian Y]

This does sound very interesting Anne but I am not sure that I fully agree with the surface area argument however I will have a go but I am in the same position as Matt with little Narcissus seed set this year.

[ChrisB]

This is so interesting. Do you think it will work with all bulbs or just onions and narcissus?  I have a pot of germinated Acis autumnale. They are congested so I could split them into two to try. I've also got a pot of seedlings of dierama igneum that I could have a go with, what do you think folks?

[fermi de Sousa]

Thank Goodness!
I saw the topic and wondered if the Chelsea Flower Show was sick of the Bulb people winning all the gold and were banning them!

... Do you think it will work with all bulbs or just onions and narcissus?  I have a pot of germinated Acis autumnale. They are congested so I could split them into two to try. I've also got a pot of seedlings of dierama igneum that I could have a go with, what do you think folks?

I'd definitely try  it with the Acis - not sure about irids like dierama but "nothing ventured..."
The concern about virus occurred to me as well but proper hygiene would include sterilising the cutting blade between cuts, I think.
If I remember when I have some narcissus or allium seedlings I might try it!
cheers
fermi
cheers
fermi

[Lesley Cox]

Onions are Liliaceae aren't they? and Narcissus are Amaryllidaceae so maybe it would work for other genera in those families? Not so sure about the Dierama or those South Africans with sort of stringy or flat leaves. If one had plenty seed of anything choice I suppose it would be worth a go? How would the snow-drop people feel about cutting off their seedling foliage? A case of "wash your mouth out" I should imagine.

I take it Anne that Suzy means the seedling leaves, I mean the thin, needle-like first leaf that comes through from the seed and not the next season's ACTUAL leaf?

[annew]

I think that's what she means. I haven't even looked at my seeds yet, but if I have  lot of something I'll sow 2 pots so i can have a go.
Re virus - not sure this would be a problem if we're talking seedlings, unless you're worried that the seeds may have carried the virus through, so long as a clean blade was used at the start.

[Maggi Young]

If you're going to try this with both allium and narcissus, it's best not to mix up which trimmings  you chop  into your mashed potato......

[annew]

 

[annew]

Did anyone try this experiment? I must confess I forgot all about it until Suzy reminded me. I'll try and remember to try a controlled experiment next year.