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Author Topic: March Narcissus 2011  (Read 26321 times)

Gerry Webster

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Re: March Narcissus 2011
« Reply #45 on: March 13, 2011, 12:21:01 AM »
Tony & Roma - Thanks for  your comments on summer treatment of  N. rupicola subsp. watieri. Jim Archibald advises never to bake but I can't make up my mind on the best way to deal with them.  In previous years I've kept some of them completely dry but relatively cool & kept others in an open frame. It didn't seem to make any difference as regards flowering, so last summer I left them all in the open frame &  no flowers at all  this year. Too damp?
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Gerdk

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Re: March Narcissus 2011
« Reply #46 on: March 13, 2011, 02:19:15 PM »
Thanks Anne, David & Gerry -
I think it is fair to pass the compliments to the donor from El Espinar
also.

Gerd
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Gerd Knoche, Solingen
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David Nicholson

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Re: March Narcissus 2011
« Reply #47 on: March 13, 2011, 08:12:57 PM »
Yesterday we visited Knightshayes Court (the camera stayed behind-inadvertantly ::) ) and I was struck by the drifts of Daffs and rushed into print elsewhere with a description of drifts of Narcissus obvallaris. I was speaking with someone today who took the view that they were unlikely to be obvallaris and much more likely to be N. pseudonarcissus ssp. lobularis.

Now, this has thrown me a bit since I can find no reference to lobularis in Blanchard or in the RHS Botanical Classification. Someone put David right please!
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David Nicholson
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"Victims of satire who are overly defensive, who cry "foul" or just winge to high heaven, might take pause and consider what exactly it is that leaves them so sensitive, when they were happy with satire when they were on the side dishing it out"

Gerry Webster

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Re: March Narcissus 2011
« Reply #48 on: March 13, 2011, 08:23:18 PM »
David -  see Blanchard p192: "N. lobularis Hort = N. nanus Spach" (unlikely I presume); "N. lobularius Schultes = N. obvallaris Salisb."
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David Nicholson

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Re: March Narcissus 2011
« Reply #49 on: March 13, 2011, 08:32:51 PM »
Gerry, many thanks for that, I had only looked in the main index (I rarely find anything I'm looking for in the main index!!). So, they are one and the same?
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David Nicholson
in Devon, UK  Zone 9b
"Victims of satire who are overly defensive, who cry "foul" or just winge to high heaven, might take pause and consider what exactly it is that leaves them so sensitive, when they were happy with satire when they were on the side dishing it out"

Gerry Webster

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Re: March Narcissus 2011
« Reply #50 on: March 14, 2011, 04:57:46 PM »
Narcissus bulbocodium

From a collection by Bob & Rannveig Wallis (RRW 8832), Tahanout, High Atlas, Morocco.
The relatively large flowers open on scapes only 5-6 cm long.
« Last Edit: March 14, 2011, 04:59:21 PM by Gerry Webster »
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ashley

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Re: March Narcissus 2011
« Reply #51 on: March 14, 2011, 05:42:33 PM »
That's a beauty Gerry.  Obviously you managed them very successfully through the cold period last December.
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Ashley Allshire, Cork, Ireland

Gerry Webster

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Re: March Narcissus 2011
« Reply #52 on: March 14, 2011, 08:26:34 PM »
Thanks Ashley. Although  I lost a few crocus, Narcissus were unscathed despite being in an unprotected sand plunge.
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Luc Gilgemyn

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Re: March Narcissus 2011
« Reply #53 on: March 14, 2011, 08:31:58 PM »
A great plant Gerry !

I have Narcissus x cyclamineus "The Usurper" in flower right now !  :D
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Luc Gilgemyn
Harelbeke - Belgium

David Nicholson

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Re: March Narcissus 2011
« Reply #54 on: March 14, 2011, 08:35:38 PM »
Very nice Gerry.

I like "The Usurper" Luc, what's it's history?

Some of mine:-

The first three are Narcissus bulbocodium from Brian Duncan under his code SEL2847,

and the next two a pot of Narcissus obvallaris, that I got as Lobularis, that I'm bulking up for the garden.

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David Nicholson
in Devon, UK  Zone 9b
"Victims of satire who are overly defensive, who cry "foul" or just winge to high heaven, might take pause and consider what exactly it is that leaves them so sensitive, when they were happy with satire when they were on the side dishing it out"

Armin

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Re: March Narcissus 2011
« Reply #55 on: March 15, 2011, 01:36:23 PM »
very nice daffodils from everbody 8)

David,
why do you call your 'lobularis' 'obvallaris'?

This is the typical wild form (N. pseudonarcissus ssp. pseudonarcissus (syn. N. lobularis of trade)) from the Eifel.
http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?topic=3424.0
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Maggi Young

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Re: March Narcissus 2011
« Reply #56 on: March 15, 2011, 01:49:57 PM »
Quote from: Armin on March 15, 2011, 01:36:23 PM

David,
why do you call your 'lobularis' 'obvallaris'?



Following the information on the various synonyms and publication dates, we can see that 'obvallaris' is the oldest name........

http://www.theplantlist.org/tpl/record/kew-311002


Narcissus lobularis Schult. & Schult.f. is a synonym of Narcissus pseudonarcissus subsp. major (Curtis) Baker
original publication details: Syst. Veg. 7: 1732 1830

Narcissus pseudonarcissus f. lobularis (Haw.) Voss is a synonym of Narcissus pseudonarcissus subsp. pseudonarcissus
 original publication details: Vilm. Blumengärtn. ed. 3 1: 1023 1895

Narcissus pseudonarcissus f. obvallaris (Salisb.) Voss is a synonym of Narcissus pseudonarcissus subsp. major (Curtis) Baker
original publication details: Vilm. Blumengärtn. ed. 3 1: 1023 1895

Narcissus obvallaris Salisb. is a synonym of Narcissus pseudonarcissus subsp. major (Curtis) Baker
original publication details: Prodr. Stirp. Chap. Allerton 221 1796.
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Margaret Young in Aberdeen, North East Scotland Zone 7 -ish!

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Gerry Webster

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Re: March Narcissus 2011
« Reply #57 on: March 15, 2011, 02:16:00 PM »
"N. lobularius Schultes = N. obvallaris Salisb."

See my reply 48 above
Quote from: Gerry Webster on March 13, 2011, 08:23:18 PM
David -  see Blanchard p192: "N. lobularis Hort = N. nanus Spach" (unlikely I presume); "N. lobularius Schultes = N. obvallaris Salisb."
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Armin

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Re: March Narcissus 2011
« Reply #58 on: March 15, 2011, 10:13:19 PM »
Ladies & Gents!
Many thanks I expected this reply... ::)

For me N. xxx lobularis of trade (=The Lent Lily) and N. obvallaris (=The Tenby Daffodil) remain still two different species...
I support Narcissus pseudonarcissus f. lobularis (Haw.) Voss is a (obsolete) synonym of Narcissus pseudonarcissus subsp. pseudonarcissus

I found also in Plantago:
Narcissus pseudonarcissus subsp. major=
Auteurs:   (Curtis) Baker
Synoniemen:   Narcissus confusus Pugsley, Narcissus hispanicus Gouan, Narcissus major Curtis, Narcissus maximus Hort.

Narcissus pseudonarcissus subsp. obvallaris=
Auteurs:   (Salisb.) A.Fern.
Synoniemen:   Narcissus obvallaris Salisb., Narcissus pseudonarcissus subsp. lobularis

Narcissus pseudonarcissus=
Auteurs:   L.
Synoniem:   Narcissus lobularis

Confused?  ;D
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Michael J Campbell

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Re: March Narcissus 2011
« Reply #59 on: March 15, 2011, 10:16:32 PM »
Narcissus obesus x triand, thanks Anne
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