Scottish Rock Garden Club Forum
Bulbs => Galanthus => Topic started by: mark smyth on December 09, 2008, 07:43:33 PM
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There has been some debate recently on whether a snowdrop looks good or isnt worth growing. I wont be doing the stats at the end but .....
From the snowdrops in your collection, species and hybrids, what would be in your top 5?
Please don't let this fall in to a slagging match and don't rub it in my naming the rarest in your collection. Give it some thought and let it be snowdrops that are freely available from mail order catalogues, snowdrop events and the internet.
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plicatus 'Three Ships'
'Alison Hilary'
plicatus 'Wendy's Gold'
Mighty Atom Group
'John Long'
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nahmd Mark,
it`s a good idea to ask in the forum.
THREE SHIPS
BOHEMIA WHITE
MERLIN
LAPWING
WENDY`S GOLD
So we can bridge the time until the spring season ;D
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Mark, I don`t know ALISON HILARY as original plant. Why do you mean AH is better then the old MERLIN??
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How do you define 'freely available snowdrops', Mark? Under £40? Under £20? Under £15? Under £10? I might think 'Primrose Warburg', for example is freely available, but it could still cost someone £25 to buy. I think we need some guidance on this and some sort of cut-off point otherwise everyone will interperet it in their own way and might feel they can't include a snowdrop someone else feels it's okay to include.
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:-\ .... I've reworded it
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I have a little problem, or a big? My interest for the list is, to find out some other drops, because other galanthophile have good experience with them (they look fine and they grow well - my most important things). The price should be secondary. Also the availability today. We all can wait, must wait for good drops.
The list can give me information's of new good galanthus. So I understand Mark`s new topic!?
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My choices would probably be five of my (so far) un-named seedlings, which I guess doesn't help anyone.
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You would help me, when you would show these 5 for us. Then I could cultivate a feeling, how fine they are. May be (I`m sure it is so) your drops would be a dream for me!!!
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You would help me, when you would show these 5 for us. Then I could cultivate a feeling, how fine they are. May be (I`m sure it is so) your drops would be a dream for me!!!
Hagen, I don't know exactly which 5 they would be. So many of my seedlings are still growing back to flowering size after being chipped to make them into clumps. I think I can decide on maybe two or three, but there will be others I can't remember until they get back to flowering. I did post some seedling photos last year. Did you see those? I not, I can see if I can find some of them and re-post them here.
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Galanthus 'Poll' is not in my top five yet .... have you a picture? ;)
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No, sorry can't reduce the 10 aforementioned (Re: Top of the 'drops
« Reply #7 on: December 08, 2008, 01:32:50 PM »)to 5 :-\
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Hagen, I don't know exactly which 5 they would be. So many of my seedlings are still growing back to flowering size after being chipped to make them into clumps. I think I can decide on maybe two or three, but there will be others I can't remember until they get back to flowering. I did post some seedling photos last year. Did you see those? I not, I can see if I can find some of them and re-post them here.
I woke up early today and had a look throught the January 2008 thread. There were 68 pages! So I have collected all of Martin's seedling photos together and put them below (hope that was OK Martin - let me know if you want me to remove the pictures from here).
elwesii seedling
(http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=947.0;attach=36656;image)
(http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=947.0;attach=36750;image)
plicatus X gracilis cross
(http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=947.0;attach=40665;image)
(http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=947.0;attach=40667;image)
a different plicatus x gracilis
(http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=947.0;attach=40669;image)
another plicatus x gracilis
(http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=947.0;attach=40671;image)
Quote 'One of my best older seedlings'
(http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=947.0;attach=40699;image)
Quote 'Worth chipping this plicatus x gracilis'
(http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=947.0;attach=40756;image)
Quote 'Not good enough to chip but is fertile so will be used in further breeding'
(http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=947.0;attach=40758;image)
A 'Kite' seedling
(http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=947.0;attach=40760;image)
Then Martin had a nice sunny day and took lots of pictures showing some of his seedlings: :D
(http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=947.0;attach=41136;image)
(http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=947.0;attach=41138;image)
(http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=947.0;attach=41140;image)
(http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=947.0;attach=41142;image)
(http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=947.0;attach=41144;image)
(http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=947.0;attach=41146;image)
(http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=947.0;attach=41148;image)
(http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=947.0;attach=41150;image)
(http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=947.0;attach=41152;image)
John
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John, I am quite sure Martin won't mind... and I am delighted.... you've saved me a task there.... thanks!! :-*
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Thanks Maggi,
I did almost give up half way through as it took a LOT longer than I expected it would! ::)
Nice to have them all in one place though - hopefully Martin will then be able to see if any are missing and post some more...... please ;D
Regards
John
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Thank you John, now we can see the big amplitude of Martin`s breeding program - and fine results. It`s the way to tetraploid galanthus.
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Nice pictures John, mine top 5 is
Primrose warburg
Flocon de neige
Wasp
elwesii monostictus the 3ploid one
White magic
But it can also be many others
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Thanks, John. I think there were one or two others. I'll have a look when I've a moment to spare but, as you say, Jan 2008 has a lot of pages! These were also just a few of many seedlings that I managed to get quick pics of. There are lots more in the chipping pipeline that I didn't get around to taking pics of.
My favourite 'commonplace' (i.e. not very expensive and very well established) or classic snowdrops would probably be (not in order of preference):
S. Arnott
Ketton
Bertram Anderson
John Gray
Merlin
Atom
Sorry, couldn't cut one to make it 5.
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OK - I shall give it a go.
In no particular order (and I am sure it would be a different 5 if I was asked the same question next week or in a different way - ie Diggory, Godfrey Owen, Pat Mason and David Baker would be in there - but I guess they are not common enough).
Mrs Wrightsons Double
Sutton Courtenay
Merlin
Tilebarn Jamie (because it is the start of my season 8))
Walrus
As I say though - that list could be different depending on the mood I am in. My favorites are usually the ones that are in flower at the time. ;D
cheers
John
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I see 'Merlin' appearing regularly and I like it. I like krasnovii because of its inner petal shape and delicate outers, but it is a rarity and I lost a couple to bulb fly in 2007. I saw 'Wasp' at Kingsbarns and like it too, but my favourite standard snowdrop must be 'Sophie North'. 'Little Ben' would be up there too.
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Just one would make my day, Sophie North. I did have it years ago but gave someone a bulb and mine did not appear the following spring.
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I don't see 'Rosemary Burnham' on these lists, but then I think it is difficult to grow over here?
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I don't see 'Rosemary Burnham' on these lists, but then I think it is difficult to grow over here?
I hear the elves plan to rough her up this Spring.
johnw
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I don't see 'Rosemary Burnham' on these lists, but then I think it is difficult to grow over here?
I wouldn't know - I have been trying for three years to get one. ::)
John
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I hear the elves plan to rough her up this Spring.
Well done the elves!
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I hear the elves plan to rough her up this Spring.
Please help a dumb German. What do the elves plan ???
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I hear the elves plan to rough her up this Spring.
Please help a dumb German. What do the elves plan ???
Hans. I too have no idea! ::)
John
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A gardener plans to chop 'Rosemary Burnham' up and chip her to increase the numbers available :D
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much better. Do you mean, it`s only a dream? elves aren`t real? :-\ But snowdrop company are elves?
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Here it is Rob,
I found it last winter is a poculoform Flore pleno.
I take a second chance for another top 5
Trym
Platyphyllus
Colossus
Angelique
Heffalump
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Gerard - Remind me in the summer and Santa will send you a Heffalump (not as in "half a lump of coal").
Okay, here's my impossible five:
Casaba (Daglingworth)
Caspar
Cowhouse Green
Dickerchen
South Hayes
If Santa can't get financing from the Bank of Iceland for the above then:
Alanja (who's gone missing)
Merlin (who the flies got)
Mighty Atom (")
Primrose Warburg
Galatea (who refuses to persist)
Now who's to start the Twelve Days of Christmas with Galanthus vars.? ;)
johnw
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What(who) is ALANJA ? Where did you see this drop???
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What(who) is ALANJA ? Where did you see this drop???
could this be G. elwesii alanya-yayla?
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Chris, are you saying there is a plant called this.....G. elwesii alanya-yayla ? what a tongue-twister .... is it a Turkish name?
goodness me, yes, and here it is......
first in the elwesii lists.... http://www.oirlicher-blumengarten.de/galanthus/elwesii.html
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How Chris says, it is one of the best G. elwesii -types, they circulate in Germany. An other name is ALANYA YAYLA. There are different clones. Very great and good flowers. Some times they are named under MAGDEBURGER RIESEN. But now they are also known in Nova Scotia???
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But now they are also known in Nova Scotia???
I think that maybe John has been looking at the website of Günter Waldorf
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much better. Do you mean, it`s only a dream? elves aren`t real? :-\ But snowdrop company are elves?
I hope the national elf service is looking after their wellbeing?
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What(who) is ALANJA ? Where did you see this drop???
Hagen
Galanthus elwesii 'Alanja' - I saw it here! In 2003 I got it from a friend in Germany who is a galanthophile, he says a good, very big elwesii. Indeed it's circulating in Germany according to records. My notes say "32-34 cm, 10.1, fl 25mm, supervolute, very big". Saw it bloom once but no pot found this summer or label - damn. Have 1 pot labelled 'Lola' but think that is a missing 'Robin Hood' from Foxgrove. Also a 'Nola', I guess we all have lots of those.
Maybe the elves are making off with these drops and heading north.
johnw
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A ' Yayla ' is an alpine pasture or alp or shieling (according my online dictionary).
In German ' Alm'.
So ' Alanya Yayla ' denotes a lovely part in the mountains above Alanya - still much cooler and quieter than the town itself. There are also some snowdrops growing.
Gerd
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After the description of Galanthus elwesii 'Alanja' from Chris I might have to change my mind ;D
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Gerard your 'poc' is lovely but it's not a poc. It needs to have all petals equal length and white
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much better. Do you mean, it`s only a dream? elves aren`t real? :-\
Elves are not real??!!!! Of course elves are real.... you must have met some of these elves...... ;)
there are Alpine Elves, https://listserv.surfnet.nl/archives/alpine-l.html
Trillium Elves, https://listserv.surfnet.nl/scripts/wa.cgi?A0=trillium-l
Arisaema Elves, https://listserv.surfnet.nl/scripts/wa.cgi?A0=arisaema-l&D=0&F=&H=0&O=T&S=&T=0
all sorts of Elves....... ;D
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much better. Do you mean, it`s only a dream? elves aren`t real? :-\
Elves are not real??!!!! Of course elves are real.... you must have met some of these elves...... ;)
there are Alpine Elves,all sorts of Elves....... ;D
And Icelandic elves. Maggi, you can listen to this but you will have to scroll to the relevant part. I know it's these Icelandic ones that are taking the Galanthus.
http://www.cbc.ca/tapestry/archives/2008/120708.html
johnw
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For anyone who has doubts about the existence of elves, may I suggest you follow this link......
http://elfyourself.jibjab.com/view/HuaNN9n2ruW9Vv5F
Or this one, which shows the elves enjoying a barn dance.... elves LOVE barn dances!.....
http://elfyourself.jibjab.com/view/0uk8OQDPehD4Etyq
....conclusive proof, I think 8)
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I have never read any discription of a "double" Poculoformis in any book, could be new! The innners and the outers do not have the exact equal lenght but i didnot know this should be a measurement for Poculoformis.
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Gerard,
I agree with you in your last comment on your double snowdrops shown earlier. To the best of my knowledge a poculiformed snowdrop is one where the inner segments are approximately equal to the outer ones. Any definitions of the term I have read have said that the inner segments are "almost equal to the outer". Also, "poculiform" is a description of shape (cup-shaped) and not of colour. So, I believe, your suggestion that your snowdrop might be descriped as poculiformed is a very reasonable one.
To illustrate, I quote from Alan Leslie in the "Daffodil, Snowdrop and Tulip Yearbook 2007 -2008" :
‘Angelique’ is a near poculiform selection
from G. nivalis, discovered in a derelict chateau
garden at Perriers, near Rouen, by Mme Gloria
de Bellegard in 1995, and named after her
daughter. It is poculiform in that its inner
segments are almost the same length as the
outers but those inners have a delicate vshaped
mark at the apex, sometimes reduced to
just a small green pip on either side of the
apical sinus (the inner segments are all-white in
a ‘pure’ poculiform snowdrop). It is a delicate,
slender thing and even in the heat of the Hall
resisted any temptation to lift up its outer
segments.
It is a very fortunate find and an interesting snowdrop.
Paddy
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Thank you Paddy, i dont know any other group where i can place it. Poculoformis will be the best i think, but i am not a Charles Darwin,
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Gerard, I would take it to the filled drops (Doubles are half filled, like GODFREY OWEN). If you are interested, I would send you an uncomplicated classification system for the drops, witch isn`t botanical overloaded.
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Hagen,
It would be interesting to see that information posted here.
Paddy
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I am looking forward to it Hagen, please send me that information.
thanks
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Sorry guys ,
but Hagen is really busy in the next days - he is building a runway for elves 8)
please be patient :P
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Thanks be to goodness that the elves may now run away.
Paddy
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Sorry guys ,
but Hagen is really busy in the next days - he is building a runway for elves 8)
please be patient :P
Hey man, the Forum is more important, so tell Hagen not to be so elfish. ::)
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Hi all ,
is this not a nice poculiform Galanthus ?
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now that is a real nice one!has she`s got a name?
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Indeed it is Hans, and two flowers to the scape too - super 8)
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Hi Loes ,
it has not a cultivar name until ...but I could name it "Hans Surprise" ....has anyone better ideas ?
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Hi all ,
is this not a nice poculiform Galanthus ?
I think Hans is pulling our legs a little. Looks like a leucojum/acis to me (note the spathe and the multiple flowers, etc).
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Have a good look.... not two flowers but three to the scape......... :o.
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Martin ,
thats a very good plant ....maybe I would sell it ( one bulb ) for 200 Euro ;D
Would you have some pollen from it ?
so your crosses have maybe also three flowers per scape :P
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Have a good look.... not two flowers but three to the scape......... :o.
Exactly.
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She is beautiful what ever her heritage is :-* :P
Hans - do please tell us what is her family name?
Cheers
John
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You know, I thought that maybe it was this :
[attachthumb=1]
but I'm wrong...... :'(
Thank you, Ann, for alllowing me to use the photo!
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..... even though it looks like this.......it is really........
[attachthumb=1]
poculiform galanthus and........
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No problem Maggie. What a beautiful snowdrop. Not long until the season starts :)
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Maggi, another non-poculiform Galanthus. Without any inner tepales.
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Hagan's snowdrop---- resized to avoid the need for scrolling
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Hagen,
have you been carefully removing the inners with tweezers? ;D
(Sorry - I couldn't resist joking). ::)
John
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Hi all ,
I have to clear up my joke from yesterday :
this is not a poculiform Galanthus -it is Acis tingitana ;D
for more pics look here :
http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?topic=2784.0
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Hans, deswegen hab ich ja auch eins ohne Innereien eingestellt. (mine is also without inner segments, Hans) ;D :-*
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John, I can work like a chirurg/surgeon . ;)
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Yes Hans the flowers all from one scape were a bit of a giveaway 8)
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Thanks for your pooled knowledge folks.
The clear winner is Merlin with 4 votes.
The other top 5s got two votes.
2 plicatus 'Three Ships'
2 Primrose Warburg
2 plicatus 'Wendy's Gold'
2 Mighty Atom
Since I don't grow any of these its useful info!!
Tim DH
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Those who are not members of the Cottage Garden Society may be interested in the result of their poll - 93 entries listing 210 varieties
Top Ten
1. S.Arnott - 42 votes
2. Trym - 32
3. Augustus - 29
4. Wendy's Gold - 28
5. John Gray - 26
6. Mrs Macnamara 25
7. Diggory - 23
7. Magnet - 23
9. G. nivalis - 17
10. Merlin - 15
10. Lady Elphinstone - 15
runners up 14 - Three Ships, Mrs Thompson
13 Primrose Warburg, Lapwing, South Hayes
12 Blewbury Tart, Lady Beatrix Stanley
11 G. gracilis
10 Bill Bishop, Hil Poe, G. reginae-olgae, St Anne's, Galatea
A most interesting result I thought, showing the value of the older plants.