Scottish Rock Garden Club Forum
Bulbs => Crocus => Topic started by: Lesley Cox on July 10, 2008, 10:14:24 PM
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Crocus growth has slowed here in the last week or so, the weather generally being very cold and miserable, a lot of rain and snow. Yesterday though, these opened.
Crocus vitellinus is really tiny but full of colour. It will go into a trough in the summer. New this year from Marcus Harvey.
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From MH last year and enough now to plant out in the garden, C. korolkowii 'Golden Nugget.'
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Likewise, C. korolkowii, dark throat.
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And some more seedlings of the C. cvijicii/veluchensis cross. The bronzy one looks good. These are seedlings from a single pod.
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All lovely, Lesley. One of my korolkowii from Marcus has a flower open, but so cold here that it hasn't properly opened enough yet to see properly. I say it is "open" because it is fully up and would be if there was any actual sun here. ::) Love those last hybrids. Lovely mix.
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Lesley,
I love C. korolkowii dark throat ! Beautiful !
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Lesley.... Im curious wether you did the Crocus cvijicii x veluchensis cross yourself. I did the same cross a few years ago now and have quite similar plants. I guess since the seed was offered by Archibalds some years ago.... it explains the availability of C cvijicii.
I have found the plants to be more vigrous than either parents and the flowers a little larger.
Mat
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Welcome to the Forum, Mat,
(or should we now refer to you as 'im outdoors?)
Have you got pics of your crocus?
cheers
fermi
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Hi fermi... many thanks.... Yes I do have a pic of it.... Ill post it when I get home and upload it.... Its very nice.. Almost like shot silk.. yellow ground with a translucent wash of lavender on it
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Hi, Mat, welcome! Good to have another Aussie join in 8)
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Welcome Mat. Great to have you with us. Are you the person by that name that I know from the Blue Mountains (although it has been a few years at least since we last "spoke")?
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I guess you're Matt from Mt Tomah Bot Garden? I met you in 2003 in that case.
I didn't do the cross myself. Both species were (still are) in a hypertufa trough and I collected seed from C. cvijicii, expecting the seedlings to be the same. But they were obviously hybrids and there have been a couple of batches since. Neither species sets seed for me in isolation and I've not had anything on C. veluchensis in the trough either but I have just single clones of each. I'll go on with the seed as long as it's produced as they're all nice and an occasional one is superb, especially the apricot to bronze forms. In general they're quite large flowered but it's the colouring that interests me more. Some are almost white, just a little lemony/cream shading and there's a good yellow with strong lavender tips.
I'll be staying over the road from the gardens again in Sept for a few days.
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Hi there all... Yes I am the Mat you guys are referring to. Thanks for the lovely welcome to the forum.... I have never seriously looked at it before. Although I read Ians bulb log frequently..
Attached find a pic of the Crocus cross I referred to earlier. Mine was a deliberate cross. I knew they were in the same section as each other and that severla other members of the section crossed. So thought Id give it a go. I think its quite nice.
I have also crossed several other members of the section with cvijicii... the seedlings are progressing well and Im curious to see whats going to be produced. particulary with my C cvijicii X C sieberi ssp sublimis Tricolor.
I crossed tricolor some years ago with siberi ssp sieberi. The progeny were very nice indeed. Like super large tricolors but with much deeper yellows and purples.
Cheers
Mat
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Mat,
Lovely!! So have you ever got seed by selfing cvijicii? Is yours grown from seed? I have only the one clone, and it is self infertile, so I am hoping that someone out there gets pure seeds somewhere along the line. Then again, if the hybrids look that nice they're worth a go to. Must get veluchensis by the look of it so I can hybridise. ;)
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Hi Mat
Hope all is well with you.
Good to have another Crocus enthusiast onboard. If the SH numbers keep on growing I may have to emigrate :)
Best wishes
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Tony,
We'd welcome you. Your collection would be spending some time in quarantine though, unfortunately. ::) We'd still welcome you!! ;D
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Welcome Mat!
Great to know there are more of "us" ;D
Love your article in the Crocus group bulletin!!
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Exactly the same as some of mine Mat. I haven't tried to cross with any others but some seedlings from C. s. 'Bowles' White' have had a look of cvijicii about them, with soft yellow colouring. I get quite a bit of seed from C. s. sublimis tricolor and some of those are very large-flowered so maybe there's hybrid blood in there too.
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Thomas, I sent you a note a few days ago about the Pilous list. Did you get it?
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Thomas, I sent you a note a few days ago about the Pilous list. Did you get it?
No I didn't - I'm not at work, please send a PM via SRGC!
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Thanks again for the warm welcome!!
Lesley... yes it looks very similar. Curious that you had such variation.. Mine are all very similar. Im wondering if perhaps another crocus was involved??
From my understanding of genetics. The first hybrids are intermediate between the parents. If selfed. The next generation is often a whole range of colours and forms.....
Thomas.. Glad you enjoyed my article... I hope not too many eyebrows were raised by my "procurment" of my very first Crocus!!
Paul... mine are raised from seed. I have a few plants so they set seed here. If I pollinate them. Veluchensis is DEFINATLY worth growing. I think its one of the nicest of the species. Given a cool, moist yet sunny position it does well. It doesnt like to dry out.
Cheers
Mat
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Thomas.. Glad you enjoyed my article... I hope not too many eyebrows were raised by my "procurment" of my very first Crocus!!
Hi Mat!
I'm still searching for a translation for "procurment" but I think you know what I mean.
Generally I don't like the big vernus-monsters, but Pickwick is really the "best of the worse" 8) ;)
Seems like we two are the only people on this forum collecting cultivars :-\
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Thomas .. Procurement means acquisition........Beschaffung is close!
Glad you enjoyed my article... I hope not too many eyebrows were raised by my "procurment" of my very first Crocus!!
Mat, I thought you were brave to own up! Luckily, I think there may be a statute of limitations on corm snaffling!! ;) ::) :-X
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Thomas .. Procurement means acquisition........Beschaffung is close!
Thanks for your help, Maggi - good to know you're always there when I need you :D
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I like all crocus. Also many of the cultivars are "selected"forms of species. I think thats OK.
Although Im a collector... Im also a gardener. So, if it looks good in a garden. Im interested. I find the large vernus and chrysanthus cultivars are what people most comment on. They do well... so they are in!
Thanks for the translation Maggi ;)
I wrote about that to show the DESIRE these plants bring to me. Amazing after over 20 years later I stil lget just as excited over them!!
Mat
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The weather isn't encouraging many crocuses to open fully right now. More days of cold winds and not much sun. I had to bring these inside to open, then rush them out again to take pictures. If the sun would warm a little, CC. abantensis, biflorus ssp. alexandri and alatavicus would all be in full glory. Can't bring them in as they're planted in a raised bed.
I'm thrilled at last to have the true C. chrysanthus 'Zwanenburg Bronze' (from MH). I had it 40 years ago from Van Tubergen in Holland, but since then, everything sold in NZ as ZB has been the variety 'Fusco-tinctus' with brown feathering, not the lovely solid bronze wash.
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Crocus gargaricus is one of the brightest. The pic doesn't really do it justice, a really rich, orangey yellow - best free-range egg yolk colour. :)
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And this little honey is Crocus cyprius. It is quite small compared with most but makes up for that in delightful colouring, more lavender than in the pics, not white at all. The dark base to the flower is very dramatic as is the orangey throat and red stigma.
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In the summer, 'Zwanenburg Bronze' will go into the garden and the others into troughs.
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All lovely, Lesley. Particularly that cyprius. Wonderful colouration!!
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I'm thrilled at last to have the true C. chrysanthus 'Zwanenburg Bronze' (from MH).
Lesley, not too bad for a Crocus which received a AM at RHS in 1938 :D
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Flowering here at the moment are Crocus corsicus and imperatii ssp suavoleons, both in the new crocus garden. The latter, in the main garden has finished flowering, as the crocus garden individuals are just starting. More sun in that spot in the open garden. Also a number of things popping up buds today after the rain we had over the weekend.
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Thomas .. Procurement means acquisition........Beschaffung is close!
Glad you enjoyed my article... I hope not too many eyebrows were raised by my "procurment" of my very first Crocus!!
Mat, I thought you were brave to own up! Luckily, I think there may be a statute of limitations on corm snaffling!! ;) ::) :-X
Hello Maggi and Thomas [hope you are enjoying your holiday] , maybe "aneignen " could also describe Mat's wandering hands .
Mat I lost my extremely dark coloured form of Crocus veluchensis -the one you admired in bloom some years ago in my garden , in last summers heat and drought , I should have known better [ old age does'nt always bestow wisdom] and should have planted it in a cool andslightly moist position, one that my Cr. banaticus revels in. Many Corydalis are starting to bloom now . Hopefully some may still be in flower when you come down to Melbourne in September for the lecture .
Ciao Otto.
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Otto, yes, "aneigen" is much better...meaning " to appropriate" 8) I am too rusty!
Nearest we are getting to crocus here at the minute are fat corms full of promise!!
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Ah, so I'll get to meet Mat as well. Excellent!!
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Hi Lesley,
beautiful C.cyprius and C.gargarius. It makes me appetite for autuum crocus flower season in the northern hemisphere. :)
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Some Crocus that are flowering here at the moment.....
The first of the tommies have started this week, which is a bit earlier than usual. Also flowering now are Crocus corsicus which is a favourite species of mine. I just love the markings. I've posted a pic showing a bit more of the clump in my crocus garden thread. And lastly an unknown yellow, which I think someone identified for me last year. Lovely pure golden splash of sunshine! ;D
Enjoy.
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First impressions is C flavus for the yellow one. The anthers are quite distinctive.
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It's probably one of the hybrids like Yellow Mammoth or something like that I'd hazard. I haven't had flavus in many years, so if it IS that, then it came in as something else. ;D Always possible of course. This was probably a bulb I had left over when repotting at some point, i.e I found it in the mix after sorting everything, so didn't know what it was and then put it into one of the big tubs where it didn't matter but could be enjoyed. It is quite a large flower, and for some reason I thought, perhaps incorrectly, that flavus were small?
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Here's a couple of today's flowers. The 'Crocus sieberi 'Violet Queen' was open in the sun but the sieberi ssp sieberi was closed at the time. later on when I checked I could see it had been open but was closing as the sun had gone off it. A shame as tomorrow may be cloudy and drizzling and if so it won't open. The ssp sieberi came as a surprise in a package from Otto over the summer. Apparently I had commented how nice it was when he posted pictures of it last year (the normal ssp sieberi we get here is this wishy washy thing that is OK, but nothing to write home about) so he filed it away in memory and sent me one in summer. I couldn't remember it at all at the time, and didn't go looking it up so that it would be a surprise when it flowered..... it's a real beauty!! VERY pleased to have such a nice form, and I haven't even seen it actually open as yet. ;D Thanks Otto!!!!!! 8) 8) 8)
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It's probably one of the hybrids like Yellow Mammoth or something like that I'd hazard. I haven't had flavus in many years, so if it IS that, then it came in as something else. ;D It is quite a large flower, and for some reason I thought, perhaps incorrectly, that flavus were small?
True C flavus are certainly smaller than Yellow Mammoth and have a more starry shape. You are probably right in your choice of name :)
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Tony,
It was only a rough guess, as I know I have had that before. It is definitely a large flower, not a small one. Larger than the chrysanthus types, but smaller than the big vernus like 'Pickwick' etc.
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Great show Paul ! Mouthwatering C. Sieberi !!!! :o
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Deeply frustrating weather here, means that many crocuses and now reticulate irises are failing to open. More than a week of rain, drizzle, fog with snow at intervals, winds and general beastliness, with day temps to about 6 or 7C. 'Katharine Hodgkin' has a dozen flowers trying to open and I have 9(!!!) yellow buds on I. danfordiae which are just candle-flame shape, can't get any further. I'm afraid they may all rot as the forecast is for more days of the same. Never known a winter like this one. The I. danfordiae are from a local garden centre, 3rd attempt. Ist year they were 'Harmony', last year not one came up, all rotted and this year I have all these buds but still may not see them open. Crocus danfordiae and others are going the same way.
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Bummer, Lesley!! Not fun at all. You're well ahead of us here, with virtually no signs of buds on the retics as yet. Only just had leaves up this last couple of weeks. I expect much better flowering next year anyway, after they've had a year in the garden with better spring insulation. Trying to have some sun peep out here at the moment, so might still get that lovely form from Otto to open and photograph it today. Good luck with yours. Congrats on the danfordiae..... they just divide constantly here, never flowering. Another thing I am hoping will benefit from the insulation in the crocus garden. Would be lovely to actually have some flowers on them after all these years. ::)
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A couple of pics of the Crocus sieberi ssp sieberi, that opened today. The contrasts are just glorious, particularly in the sunshine.
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What fantastic colours,, that is a Crocus I have to look for.
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Magnar,
It's only it's first year here with me, so I would be doubting I'd have any to spare at the end of this season..... but if any seed sets you're welcome to it? Can't guarantee if it will be true or not, but possibly worth a try? You'll have to remind me though. Bear in mind that that subspecies is quite variable. The others I have of it (the "usual" one here in Aus) are much paler washed on the outside, nowhere near as striking as this one. Good flowerers though, which makes them a pleasure in themselves. Just not quite on par with this one. ;)
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A little pic of a little crocus, C. danfordiae. I had it bring it into the house for a day's warmth to make it open. The label is 19mm wide, the crocus a little bit less!
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Paul....
I think Crocus sieberi ssp sieberi is one of the nicest of all the species. Interesting that its flowering for you now..... Mine are WAY gone. Its the very first of the sieberi ssp to flower for me. The last is, sieberi tricolor.
I saw it amongst the snow melt in the white mountains of Crete some years ago. Very beautiful.
Be warned.... it isnt long lived in cultivation. Perhaps 3-4 years and it seems to dwindle away. Raise it from seed if you can. It also likes it a little drier in summer than the other ssp of sieberi. Its a relatively easy one for us aussies.... altho it isnt considered very hardy in the colder areas of Europe and North America.
I have used it as a parent with tricolor for some seedlings. Which are similar markings ot tricolor,,,, but much richer in the purple and yellow. Plus also a LOT larger than both the parents.
Lesley.. noticed your post earlier on Crocus chrysanthus "Zwanenberg Bronze" I had the same issue. All the times i ordered it from suppliers it was something totaly different. I was very happy that the plant from Marcus finaly was true to type. PHEW!!
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Mat,
I find that the usual form we have here in Aus (or that I've seen anyway) is too washed out for my liking. As a clump it looks great, but as individual flowers they're a bit insipid, or they have been when flowering here in Canberra anyway. I have seen here on the SRGC forums others posting pics overseas of much better forms, which is where I found out that there WERE better forms, and then Otto's posting of his. So much better. ;)
I didn't realise that they were short lived. I've had mine for more than 10 years with ups and downs in population over that time, but I rarely get seed set on any of my crocus unless I hand pollinate (the exceptions being laeviagatus and tommasinianus). I'll have to try hand pollinating some of these and see what happens. The otehr probably I have is that most of mine were bought as a single bulb, so they are all the one clone, which so often minimises seed production anyway.
Your hybrids sound lovely. I don't suppose you have pictures you can post? Or send them to me and I'll prepare and post them for you if you'd like?
I'll have to keep an eye on the normal ssp siberi I have and see what they're doing this year. I think they're on the way back up from dwindling a couple of years ago, but they do seem to cycle. maybe I somehow managed to pull them through with my neglect while I was sick? ;) Thanks for the info. Always good to learn something knew.
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I've just had the first flower on Crocus flavus from seed, but the flower was lying on the ground due to the frost this morning!
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Maybe it'll still be around by the weekend when I can take a pic of the flower open? Maybe not!
cheers
fermi
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Fermi,
Congratulations!! Well done. Lovely picture of the frost on the leaf too. I think that the rain of last week has brought some things on crocus-wise.... I've had C. saturnus pop up and open this week out of nowhere, and C. minimus put up buds on Monday (they weren't there on Sunday) but they still haven't fully opened as yet. This was particularly pleasing for me as I nearly lost minimus a couple of years back when about 90% of the corms died off one year. Having it back to flowering again is a big relief. Not quite the same as first time from seed though Fermi!! You must be pleased! 8)
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Poor old 'Hubert Edelsten' just can't open up because of continual drenching. Isn't there a song that goes "The rain it raineth every day?" Well it sure doth.
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Good luck Lesley. No signs of Hubert here yet, although I haven't checked tags on other varieties that have leaves but no buds as yet. Still only got one and a bit corms of him, so will be many many years before I ever get a display like yours, sunshine or no sunshine!!
Sunshine here the last couple of days has finally matured the Crocus minimusbuds that appeared overnight on Sunday night. Finally got them to open today. One of my absolute favourite species because of the outer markings, and I just love that from the outside when closed you'd expect it to perhaps be white, when it is actually such a strong lavender colouration. Beautiful!!!!! particularly satisfying as I nearly lost it a few years ago and have managed to build it back up to flowering size now. Hopefully will thrive and get lots of flowers next year.
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Beautiful crocuses everyone; thanks for sharing them with us.
Paul, those minimus and corsicus are exquisite. Well done too on the new bulb garden 8)
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Lovely to see the SH crocuses folks. Sorry to see you are getting a lot of Devon weather Lesley. It started raining here at lunchtime yesterday and hasn't stopped yet!
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Paul,
indeed a very beautiful C.minimus.
Lesley,
hope you will get more sunshine so that Hubert Edelsten will open buds. Very beautiful.