Scottish Rock Garden Club Forum
Specific Families and Genera => Amaryllidaceae => Topic started by: johnw on July 04, 2008, 09:24:14 PM
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Wonder if anyone can tell if my Clivia is Vico Gold or Vico Yellow? The photo colour is quite accurate.
I've found these Clivias, when buds are detected, must be watered heavily almost daily to prevent the merging buds from getting snagged between leaves. They are real pot smashers and when requiring transplanting they seem to have consumed everything which was once a mix - save for the perlite.
johnw
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I cannot answer your question, John. I can only say that it is a very fine cultivar, far nicer than my lemon version 8) which does not havea name as far as I know :-\
All of which reminds me that all the Clivias need attention and new pots and compost!
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John, I would need to see it flowering in my greenhouse to be sure of the ID. ;D
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I actually spied the tip of a label at the rim of the pot. I tied in vain to yank it out and finally lifted the entire plant to get it out with pliers and brute force. Seems Clivia eat labels too. It is 'Vico Yellow'.
johnw
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Thats a very nice yellow,really substantial. Here is mine an un-named seedling which I think I bought years ago from Thompson and Morgan and two seedlings I got by crossing it with a red one.
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Re the watering when buds are detected - I don't grow Clivias but a friend has several in her bathroom and to get in the bath, one has to fight through a jungle of massive foliage and flower stems. Obviously high humidity and spashing are appreciated.
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Thats a very nice yellow,really substantial. Here is mine an un-named seedling which I think I bought years ago from Thompson and Morgan and two seedlings I got by crossing it with a red one.
Beautiful red one there Tony.
I selfed all the flowers on Vico Yellow. If they take I can send seed to interested parties. Just drop me a note.
johnw
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Vico Yellow was outside for the summer and is in bloom again.
Very much paler than July's flowers. Selfed again.
johnw
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I've found these Clivias, when buds are detected, must be watered heavily almost daily to prevent the merging buds from getting snagged between leaves.
johnw
John, thanks god I found your advice - so I immediately will change my watering regime from twice a week to a more frequent way!
Gerd
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Gerd - Indeed they seem to require heavy watering as the stalks emerge but remember mine are in clay pots in the house so the soil dries rather quickly. At other times of the year we only water when dry and June-October they get rainfall plus supplemental watering.
In the past we lost countless buds from being pinched between the lower leaves and then they would rot before opening.
The wind has died down at last and up to -1c but a cold night predicted.
johnw
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Gerd - Indeed they seem to require heavy watering as the stalks emerge but remember mine are in clay pots in the house so the soil dries rather quickly. At other times of the year we only water when dry and June-October they get rainfall plus supplemental watering.
In the past we lost countless buds from being pinched between the lower leaves and then they would rot before opening.
johnw
John, my one and only plant (an unexiting yellow) is in a clay pot also.
It was outside until the beginning of November and is starting to develope
a flower stalk much earlier than last year.
Gerd
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Hi Gerd,
it seems as a lot of Clivias are earlier, this year. I never had so much flowering in december than this year. Ok, the winter flowering ones like Clivia gardenii but I also had some Clivia miniatas which usually are flowering in February or March.
C.miniata Hybrid
Clivia gardenii, orange
C.x cyrtanthiflora, pink.
Clivia x cyrtanthiflora, pink, short flowers
Clivia miniata var. citrina.
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Hi John,
great pictures of your `Vico Yellow´, it is a wonderful colour.
Your experiences with watering them so much is interesting. I think it depends indeed from the claypot. In a plastic pot they can rot really fast getting just a bit too much water. I have some plants in claypots and a lot in plastic pots and these in the plastic pots I have to water really carefully.
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They are all wherry nice. I love Clivia.
In Norway it is hard to get any off this.
There is an old one that has gone from house to house. Picture under.
I have sown a couple of Clivias the pasts years. Her is some with marmeld leafs. The seeds are from China.
I am sowing any seeds I can get.
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Hi Gerd,
it seems as a lot of Clivias are earlier, this year. I never had so much flowering in december than this year.
Renate,
Yes, very early - but the flowers last longer than previously!
This is my one and only Clivia - don't know what cultivar (for me ' an ordinary yellow one ').
Gerd
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Renate,that first pic ,miniata hyb, is a real beauty.
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Renate - You are entirely correct, I too had to be very careful watering when the Clivias were in plastic pots. It is amazing how they withstand drought.
Some fantastic new colours on this site!
johnw
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Renate,does that Miniata hyb set any seed or is it sterile ?
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Anne Karin,
I like your Norway one, looks really special. The last pic seem to be a `Light of Buddha´.
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Gerd,
yes, they seem to last longer.
I think yours is Clivia miniata var.citrina. It has nice, big flowers. There are not a lot of leafes to see on the picture but it looks as it has a good habit. Some of them grow like a quirl (I am not sure about this word, maybe someone can help), the leaves grow in all directions what means that you need a lot of space for one plant.
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Michael,
it seems to be selfsteril. Last year I got some seed from it (don´t know what was the other parent) and this year I tried to self it and got not one fruit.
The seedlings from the last year grow good. It is a funny plant because the flowers last year look really different, much more orange. Not as much as a usual one but more than this year.
Clivia colours seem to depend more from the growing conditions like other plants.
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John,
the drough tolerance is really amazing. I have to keep my plants in winter in a greenhouse where the temperatures often go down to 3°, but sometimes also down to 1,5° for a short time when it is really cold outside and if you keep them really dry it is no problem. Sometimes there is a leaf to cut but thats all.
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Anne Karin,
I like your Norway one, looks really special. The last pic seem to be a `Light of Buddha´.
Yes it may be Light of Buddha. I am curios on the flowers.
Ill try to get seeds on the Norwegian one next time it flower. Last tame I cut them down. ::)
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I grow 30-40 here, with several different variegations and a number of dwarf plants included. Most are single growth plants at the moment...I haven't had any for a long period of time. All are in plastic and I haven't had too much of a problem with rotting (except on the seedlings...I have lost some of those). They receive very little water from November to March--although I am thinking I should start watering earlier.
Renate and others...what are your particular problems (diseases, pests, virus etc.) with the genus and how are you handling them? I have occasional mealy bug which I control by hand (paint brush and isopropyl alcohol). I also have an issue from time to time with what appears to be a blackish mess between leaves--I don't believe it's a rotting leaf and it is not fatal to the plants. I try to avoid watering from overhead since I think there may be a relation between it and this problem.
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Carlo - I too have had mealy bug on the Clivias and they are hard to get rid of. I have tried alcohol and a coarse spray of Orthene, both worked after several treatment. Mealy bugs at the base of the Phormiums is another matter.
Two years ago I had scale that slithered over from a Mediterranean fan palm. Imidichloprid cleared them up but what a gooey mess they make.
johnw
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Carlo,
I also use Imidichloprid against mealy bugs. Once or twice I had red spider but it is not realy a problem because a ususal insecticide kill them, in summer I put those plants outside (protected from rain) and the red spiders die fast. Also I don´t water them from above.
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My Clivia plants are sorely neglected..... today I found a flower waiting to open and I never spotted it the shoot coming :-[ It's on a lemon flowered C. miniata.... it won't make a photo, even when it opens, it is a sparsely flowered stem..... but very welcome because they plant has been so abused by my lack of attention. It's a scruffy looking thing, but it managed to make me feel REALLY gulity :-[ :-X
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They need lots more water when it's blooming time (otherwise the flowers don't bloom away from the leaves)...mine are just starting.
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I feel really bad about this poor lemon clivia..... it hasn't had ANY water for weeks and yet has defied the odds to put up this flower spike.... only a few buds on it, but amazing in the circumstances that it has managed any buds at all, let alone extend the stem.....must have been very determined to show me what it can do. :-\ They are so badly done by that a couple have given up the ghost over the last few months. They're tucked away on a window sill where they get forgotten, poor things. I have apologised to the plants and promised to take better care of them in future!
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first flowering of one of my seedlings. Sorry it is too large its my first test of a new system of resizing to get better quality
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Tony, a perfect size of photo.... lovely sharp quality and a super Clivia.... a winner on all counts, methinks!
How long do they take to flower from seed?
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Maggi
as you will see I am now home from my visit to the wilds of Scotland following the show at Dunblane.
Sown in December 03 but the others from that sowing flowered last year.
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Thanks, Tony.... I was curious because I have never had seed from my plants..... got plenty fat pods developing but my Dad always cut them off before they ripened properly, despite my best efforts to prevent him doing so :'(
Always wondered what I was missing..... it'll be interesting to see if I get any seed from the two pale lemon yellow plants I have coming into flower now. :-\ I'll need to do some paintbrush work though... no insects at the minute.
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My other three seedlings are a cross between my yellow one and a deep red.I bought the yellow one which is not very good flower shape and which was very expensive but my red is seedling of a seedling over quite a few years.The red colour is dominant.They are in fact self fertile but the seeds seem to take forever to ripen.
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A week or two ago I collected a few seeds from C. 'Bog-standard' ;). You're welcome to them if you want, Maggi.
Others sown in December are beginning to germinate at last.
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Ashley,
What's 'Bog-Standard' (and why the wink?).
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A kind offer, Ashley, thankyou but I want to try for my own seeds.
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What's 'Bog-Standard' (and why the wink?).
The usual or common form Carlo. 'Bog-standard' as a cultivar name was meant to be ironic; hence the wink.
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Hello!
Some pictures of my clivia, blooming and frutifying at the moment.
The first one, i presume is a 12 y old C. miniata, and the others are hybrids.
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They are very nice Michael. Do you have seeds on the hybrids? They seam to be heavy bloomers.
I bought a new on last week. It has big flowers.
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Hi!
Yes, the hybrids set a lot of seeds, the species too. I usually dispose of them, because i already have too much plants, but can send some when they are mature, if you are interested :)
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Yes, the hybrids set a lot of seeds, the species too.
Michael - Your warm weather must help. I self-pollinated Clivia 'Vico Yellow' for two forumists and I count 12 fallen pods that aborted and only two pods that have stayed on and plumped up. This is the first time it has ever set seed.
johnw
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Hi!
Yes, the hybrids set a lot of seeds, the species too. I usually dispose of them, because i already have too much plants, but can send some when they are mature, if you are interested :)
Yes thank you very much. :) It is not easy to get hold on seeds in Norway.
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Michael - Your warm weather must help. I self-pollinated Clivia 'Vico Yellow' for two forumists and I count 12 fallen pods that aborted and only two pods that have stayed on and plumped up. This is the first time it has ever set seed.
Hi John.
Yes the climate must help, but i guess the clone itself has also some influence, regarding fertility. Those 12 pods were all on the same spike?
@Akoen
No problem, i'll let you know when they mature!
Here are two more pictures of Clivia nobilis :D
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Michael - Your warm weather must help. I self-pollinated Clivia 'Vico Yellow' for two forumists and I count 12 fallen pods that aborted and only two pods that have stayed on and plumped up. This is the first time it has ever set seed.
Hi John.
Yes the climate must help, but i guess the clone itself has also some influence, regarding fertility. Those 12 pods were all on the same spike?
Yes, same spike.
johnw
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here are some summer shots of my yellow Clivia. I currently have seedlings sprouting from a selfing. I don't know if this is typical of yellows, but this one tends to bloom twice a year, although it didn't bloom this Winter. I have quite a few orange C. miniata from seed, but have never managed to grow any of the other species. Is there a trick to C. caulescens or C. nobilis?
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You have a rather nice yellow clone Jamie. How old is it?
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Michael,
I think it is 5 or 6 years old, but no older. I rather like the narrow tepals with the sepals narrower than the petals.
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I actually like it because of the colour, as i find that yellow tone appealing. Here you just find in orange and red.
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Michael,
PM me your address. I'll send you the few seed that are now ripening. Probably only three, but better than none. ;)
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Thanks Jamie!
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Here now some Clivias from my collection ( I have to confess .....)
First is a Clivia minata 'Sweet Sixteen group'
I have received this plant from a nice person from this forum -she told me it is a very interesting plant -because this group has flowered after sixteen month :o
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The next is a other Clivia minita form from England
Clivia miniata 'Tony'
named after a nice friend who gives me this plant
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here is a yellow flowering form ( bougth from a gardencenter before some years )
Clivia miniata f. citrina
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Hi Hans,
now you should cross the C.min., Sweet Sixteen Group with your C.min.var.citrina - maybe you get a yellow one which is able to flower at the age of one and a half year.
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Renate ,
would you sow this seeds ?
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Hans,
wouldn't you sow them? It sounds like a good cross. The seedlings from my Belgian miniatas x yellow are just sprouting, but I hope to see bloom in three years. If you make the seed and don't wish to sow it, send it my way! ;D
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Jamie ,
no problem - I will pollinate it tomorrow :D
My personal interest are species of Clivia - not crosses
...a other problem is always to find room for new seedlings .
If the cross is succsessfull I will let you know .
Hans
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The flowers are all beautiful Hans, especially the first one with the overlapping petals. It is special with the very tall scape and nice form.
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Hi Heinie ,
thank you for your friendly words ;D
I hope to see later in year some pics from you fantastic collection !
Jamie :
The flowers are pollinatet now ( sweet 16 x citrina ) + ( citrina x sweet 16 ) ....now we have to wait ....
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Hans,
I think it is worth a try!
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Here new flowers - thats my biggest Clivia miniata ( bought before some years on a charity event )
Clivia miniata 'Big'
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Clivia nobilis now in flower
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Alessandro,
Is that the true nobilis, or the x cyrtanthiflora? I don't know how to tell the difference any more, except that I thought that nobilis was distinctly red and green, rather than all red like yours (we here in Australia have had x cyrtanthiflora masquerading as nobilis for years, which is why I ask). If you grew it from seed how long did it take to flowering. Apparently nobilis itself is just so slow growing compared to the others. I think I have heard 10 years or more to flowering.
Please don't take this post as me saying your plant is incorrectly labelled, as I have no idea how to tell from pics myself. I'm just wanting to learn what the identifying factors are to tell whether you've got the species or the cross? Whatever yours is, it is a lovely flower!! 8) Thanks for posting.
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Hi Paul
this is C. nobilis, I have taken the slid year to it from the United Kingdom, I possess also two C. x cyrtanthiflora, naturally Australian
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Thanks Alessandro. Have to flowered both? What do you see as the differences? I have the x cyrtanthiflora (which I realise can be very variable), and have grown nobilis from seed, but it grows at such a slow rate that it is going to be MANY years before it ever gets anywhere, if it survives that long. For me the seedling sort of gets to a few leaves and just sits there like that for ever, never getting any bigger. I haven't noticed it recently so I am thinking I may have no lost the last seedling too by the look of it. Must go and check to be sure. Too many darn pots at my place to keep track of everything. ::)
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I read this complete topic again due to my primary interest in Clivia of which I have a few thousand growing in the garden as well as my three shade-houses. I see some lovely flowers here. I would like to make a comment on a few posts in the beginning of the topic regarding watering. Clivias are hard to kill by under watering them but are killed easily by over watering. My Clivias are watered every 2 to 3 weeks and we experience temperatures of up to 42C in the shade-house during summer, December and January, when the plants in pots are watered every 2 weeks in the shade-houses. The growing medium is a very loose medium consisting of 70% of 12mm composted pine bark and 30% compost.
There is no need for additional water during flowering to get the flower scape to grow high between the leaves. The actual problem for short scapes is a deficiency in potassium in the plant. I feed my flowering plants with additional potassium from six months prior to the flowering season and two months after flower for seed growth and nutrition. I recommend that you rather use a fertilizer with a high potassium count for your Clivias. One fertilizer that comes to mind is Phostrogen 14-10-27 as advised to Hans for bulbs a while ago. It is made in the UK. I use it for all my bulbous plants.
I hope that you find this long note of interest and assistance for the Clivias with flowers low down between the leaves. I experienced the same problems a number of years ago when I started my high potassium feeding program with huge success. Here is a photo of one of my good Vico yellow crosses and note the high flower growth.
(http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o149/loevenstein/IMG_0432.jpg)
(http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o149/loevenstein/Jap4YellowxVicoYellow.jpg)
This Nobilis flower head with 52 flowers is at least 220mm above the leaves.
(http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o149/loevenstein/Nobilis.jpg)
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Superb flowers, Heinie, and excellent advice.... which I will heed and put into action!
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Thanks Heinie. I've only got about 40 clivias here, but have experienced the short inflorescence problem. Your advice is most appreciated...
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Heinie
I see that your plants are felt to house ;D
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Paul
this is Clivia x cyrtanthiflora
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Alessandro,
Yes, some of the nice flowers find their way to the home environment for a lovely show. There are currently 8 Interspecifics in flower on the back veranda.
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Heinie
as I envy to you, here servants also a little makeshift
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Heinie, Your photos of your Clivia are quite wonderful and they look magnificently helathy (due to you great advice, no doubt), I have a Clivia given to me almost 20 years ago and produces masses of flower each year following a watering technique like yours and putting it outside in summer in light spot - though not direct sun, which can burn the leaves, then in the cool low light for the winter inside - a French woman I met who had fantastic plants once told me she put them in the cellar for a rest period in the dark before flowering, do you agree? You obviously have the magical touch :)
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Paul,
this are two pictures of nobilis leaf tips, typical nobilis leaf tips. The leafes are usual much harder and rough, if you close your eyes and touch the leafes you will feel the difference between nobilis and cyrtanthiflora. I also have a cyrtanthiflora which shows some signs of nobilis but not at all leafs and the leafes are more rough than miniata but not as rough as nobilis. All other cyrtanthiflora´s I have show smoth leafes. Also cyrtanthiflora have more dark green, shining leafes, nobilis leafes are not shining.
nobilis indeed take up to ten years to reach flowering size, cyrtanthiflora as I know are flowering earlier.
And: nobilis grows slowly, very, very slowly.
Another difference is that cyrtanthiflora often flowers two times a year, flowers in winter are often pale. For example I have two different ones which flowers light pink in winter and strongly orange in summer.
Maybe this helps a bit.
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Heini,
"a few thousends in the garden" - I am green with envy.
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Remember, Readers: click the pictures to enlarge them.......
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Heini,
"a few thousends in the garden" - I am green with envy.
Renate ,
are you envy for the clivias or for the room ;)
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Thanks to people the nobilis info. I'll keep it in mind. I love your pink cyrtanthiflora, Renate. Beautiful.
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Renate,
My best Clivias grow in a shade house of about 80m² and I have two smaller shade house with 3 racks each where the seedlings younger than one year will grow.
This is my large shade house.
(http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o149/loevenstein/Shadehouse_1.jpg)
(http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o149/loevenstein/Topview.jpg)
This is the two small shade houses for the seedlings.
(http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o149/loevenstein/IMG_1962-1.jpg)
Seeds planted in July 2008
(http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o149/loevenstein/IMG_0400.jpg)
(http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o149/loevenstein/IMG_0907_1.jpg)
Here is a photo of some Clivias in the garden which are mostly in pots too. The one with the green shirt is called Sebastiaan.
(http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o149/loevenstein/DSCF4449.jpg)
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Renate,
My best Clivias grow in a shade house of about 80m² and I have two smaller shade house with 3 racks each where the seedlings younger than one year will grow.
Here is a photo of some Clivias in the garden[which are mostly in pots too. The one with the green shirt is called Sebastiaan.
Heinie, what an amazing revelation to see your wonderful growing conditions for your Clivia! It's stupendous and your very lucky to have an assistant gardener who is interested in showing them off as well - congratulations :)
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A true Springbock amidst the Clivias ;D ;D
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Ragged Robin,
Thank you for the compliment. I have lots of space in the yard for my plant hobby like Hans mentioned above.
Luc,
Thanks for recognising our Springbok.There is a very sad story about the national rugby team Springbok emblem that used to be on the left hand side of the chest like on my grandson's jersey above until very recently. The players used to grab hold of the Springbok, that existed well over 100 hundred years, on their hearts but the government insisted the Springbok be moved to the right hand side to display our national flower, the Protea, and now the players do not grab hold of their chest any more when our anthem is sung but put their arms around each other. How sad that is after a century to please the politicians.
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Heinie, Ian thinks your little Springbok will be a speedy winger..... 8) I just think Sebastiaan is very cute!
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Maggi,
I do hope that Ian is correct in his judgement. ;) I hope so too. He is our only grand child to date, turning 5 next week, and we adore him. They spent the evening with us and he decided to send his parents home because he wants to stay over with us tonight. Obviously they followed his instructions. He often stays over and that gives his parents a break too. He has 6 of his own Clivia seedlings here and repots them every weekend. ::)
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Heini,
"a few thousends in the garden" - I am green with envy.
Renate ,
are you envy for the clivias or for the room ;)
For both, for both!
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Heini,
great pictures but I think with so much seedlings some day even you will have problems to find enough space for them.
This Clivia `Sebastian´, it is a really fast growing, isn´t it :D
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Renate,
The Sebastiaan specie grows extremely fast. ::)
The seeds and seedlings in the photos are from the 2008 harvest. I already gave about 450 away to Susan from the Clivia Forum for her new nursery. I over pollinated the year before and then had all these seeds to experiment with different germinating methods and various growing mediums. After all that I did not change my established germinating method but found my optimum seedling growing medium mixture from the experiments. I have planted the seedlings I wanted to keep and there are about 300 left to give to people that are just starting to collect Clivia. I threw about 100 away due to slow growing in a bad medium.
This yellow Interspecific is flowering now.
(http://i119.photobucket.com/albums/o149/loevenstein/IMG_0014.jpg)
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Heini,
thats a spectacular Interspecific!!! Is it a named one? It would be worth to get a name.
It is also a success to try new things and then stay by the old method that worked. A lot of new methods are worth to try but not all are better than the old ones and not all "work for me".
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Heinie,
Great to see your growing area. Love that yellow interspecific. Lovely colour and form. 8)
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Renate & Paul,
Thank you for the comments. I have not registered the Interspecific.
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Heinie - Best yellow Clivia I have ever seen! Spectacular.
johnw
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Here is one of Sir Peter Smithers Clivia "Vico Yellow" from a tissue culture project in Japan.
Also a unnamed orange yellow.
Arnold
New Jersey
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Oops here is the Vico Yellow.
arnold
new jersey
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Both beauties in any case Arnold.
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What is the size of the span on that super yellow flower, Arnold? Looks pretty wide....
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Maggi;
Measures 4 inches from petal tip to tip.
Arnold
New Jersey
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Thanks, Arnold.... makes my yellows look pretty scrawny! :-[
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My first flowering of both
Clivia caulescens and
Clivia nobilis
I am a little disappointed by the size of the flower heads in relation to the size of the plants.
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Tony,
I wouldn't be too concerned about flower head size in a FIRST flowering. See what happens. (Then send them to me if you don't like them!)
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I do have a question...
I had a wonderful dwarf clivia from China with a beautiful foliage form (like a fan). It seemed a bit delicate and was finally lost over this past summer. Are the miniature forms more demanding in the cultural requirements?
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Hi Carlo,
I have had problems with the Chinese clivias all along. I suspect there has been a lot of inbreeding. My Japanese clivias have done a bit better, but they too seem to be more sensitive my Solomone plants and the South African ones.
Jim
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It is, of course, the more desirable clones that are the miffiest.