Scottish Rock Garden Club Forum
General Subjects => Travel / Places to Visit => Topic started by: Yann on November 09, 2018, 07:29:12 PM
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Last week end i travelled with LucS and LucG in the nearby of Athens. We were lucky with the weather and plants.
In the Lavrio region the soil contains a huge amount of limestone and clay.
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Colchicum cupanii
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Colchicum cupanii
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Crocus laevigatus
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Crocus cancellatus mazziaricus
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There are more than 450 different minerals in Lavrio, it certainly explains the rich flora.
Crocus cartwrightianus
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Arisarum vulgare
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Crocus laevigatus
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the environment
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and again a laevigatus
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now we're on mount Hymettus, the town is all around but it's a quiet place.
We looked for Colchicum atticum in vain, we were too late.
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Crocus pallasii
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Crocus laevigatus
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Crocus cancellatus mazzariacus
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Further north the mount Parnitha and its abies forest.
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Daphne euboica
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and the big surprise: an Iris attica in bloom
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Acinos graveolens
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Aethionema saxatile
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Centaurea attica
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Cervus elaphus
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Wow, you have seen a great deal - and in great company!
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Back to the east of Athens around Vravrona
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Cyclamen greacum
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Colcichum cupanii
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Prospero autumnale
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A companion :D
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Anemone coronaria
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Cyclamen graecum, albus form not so common
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and a very dark form of c. graecum
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a new jump to the Keratea region
Narcissus serotinus (should we still call it like that regarding the last conversation with Rafa and Karaba)
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Crocus cancellatus mazziaricus
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and a funny tree olive, i can see a face inside it (nose and eye) ;D
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Wow, you have seen a great deal - and in great company!
Agree - and I have to confess I am a little bit envious!
Gerd
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Lovely set of pictures Yann.
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Thanks David, i hope it's not to heavy to load in the browser, myself having a poor dsl connexion.
Some photos are colors burnt due to heavy sun, as always in a trip no time to wait the good light.
I use a m4/3 camera that doesn't have the same sensor as a full frame (i used to use) but it's pretty small and light for travelling.
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Very nice pics, Yann, you have seen a lot of plants, but also some animals.
The deer, they do not seem to be afraid. They are not hunted by the local people?
The turtle is native to that region, I guess?
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Further north the mount Parnitha and its abies forest.
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Daphne euboica
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and the big surprise: an Iris attica in bloom
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Very nice crocus, what species is it?
The iris is a nice bonus in this time of the year.
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laevigatus
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Very nice pics, Yann, you have seen a lot of plants, but also some animals.
The deer, they do not seem to be afraid. They are not hunted by the local people?
The turtle is native to that region, I guess?
The red deer is protected and not hunted, it only survive there and Epirus, those in Rodopes are in small population.
Testudo marginata is very common in Greece. In spring the males are very aggressive, i saw a female ripped in her neck and eyes.
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Fantastic pictures Yann!
Love the olive man-tree :)
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Last week end i travelled with LucS and LucG in the nearby of Athens. We were lucky with the weather and plants.
In the Lavrio region the soil contains a huge amount of limestone and clay.
Nice report, Yann. We have been at the same mountain last week:
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a nice spot, I gave GPS to Razvan who was also in the area with the AGS and Oron also visited the mountains. It's now too crowed :)
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a nice spot, I gave GPS to Razvan who was also in the area with the AGS. It's now too crowed :)
It was a very nice place over there. Unfortunately I am back home again. I would prefer a crowded Crocus place and being still in Greece. We have seen nobody interested in Crocus on the whole trip.
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These pictures are so beautiful - many thanks for showing.
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a few more and i think Stefan gonna complete the post with plants seen in the north Peloponnese
Verbascum graecum (undulatum wasn't any more blooming)
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Scutellaria rupestris ssp. parnassica
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Pollinisators
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Dittrichia viscosa
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And the last one is from Mati where more than 90 peoples died in flames. I visited the village the first time in 2011, 2013 and this spring. The visit was very special to my eyes and life has gone back as you can see.
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I will complete it with the whole trip from Northern Greece to the Peloponnese.
So called FYROM is out of the topic but probably of interest here.
Janis has given me information about a location of Crocus pallasii south of the border from Serbia to FYROM. We have been lucky to discover it at our second attempt at Saturday, morning, 27.10.2018 and were even too early as all flowers have been still closed at the beginning.
Biotope with Crocus pallasii
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Crocus pallasii
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We continued in Greece with the northern slopes of Mt. Olympos and we have found just Crocus mazziaricus there in stony Meadows with Juniperus and Quercus.
Biotope of Crocus mazziaricus and some Ophrys like spruneri, zeusii and others in spring
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Asyneuma limonifolium
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Crocus mazziaricus
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very late Asyneuma, usually they're over end of august
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I have learnt that there are sometimes plants that flower a second time, like your Anemone or Iris for example ;)
I have seen another flowering Asyneuma two days later.
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We crossed the foothills of Mt. Olympos from North to West next morning. In the stony areas were just a few Crocus mazziaricus growing. Then we discovered first Crocus macedonicus from the car, growing in Meadows that were less stony.
Biotope of Crocus macedonicus
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Crocus macedonicus
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Landscape from the western foothills of Mt. Olympos
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Biotope of Crocus macedonicus
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Mt. Olympos
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We have been going then to the Pindus range and found a nice Population of Crocus mazziaricus between Elassona and Deskati.
Biotope of Crocus mazziaricus
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Crocus mazziaricus
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Venetikos river
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We have got a location of Crocus robertianus close to Milea in the Pindus range from a Greek friend, that was our next destination.
It has taken some time till we have found the first plants on a meadow with pine trees and bushes, grazed by cows but finally there were enough plants.
Biotope of Crocus robertianus:
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Crocus robertianus
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A hoverfly approaching Crocus robertianus:
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Crocus robertianus
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Area around Milea:
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We checked the area of the locus classicus of Crocus robertianus in late afternoon but have found closed Crocus hadriaticus only at three places. Altitude, driving distance from Mazia and coordinates did not match and possibly we have been there too early anyway.
I hope Janis, who will be in Greece for the next days is more successful .
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nice catch of that pollinisator! It's very interesting to see different biotopes.
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Next day started cloudy and it was not a successful day concerning Crocuses.
Despite the weather we enjoyed the great landscape there.
View from the Vikos balcony to the gorge:
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It took some time till we have found the first Crocus hellenicus not far from the balcony. There were just a few coming out.
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Zagoria is very nice and there is always much to see like the stone bridges around Kipi:
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or the rocks of Oxia:
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We wanted to see the nice Crocus hadriaticus around Monodendri but we were too early there this year. Fortunately we have found some at two other places by chance.
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Timfi above Monodendri and Vikos village:
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Some last pictures of that day, rather poor in Crocus.
Viscum album
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Scabiosa tenuis
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Asyneuma limonifolium
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I've never been in autumn to Vikos, it looks very dry. The balcony is very different from what is seen in spring.
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Gorgeous landscapes in those mountains Stefan, all in the Pindus range I understand? Very beautiful, I can imagine the richness of the flora out there.
Are these spots that you know about on established trails anyone can follow?
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Are these spots that you know about on established trails anyone can follow?
Some of the tracks are well known to host endemic plants....if you don't fear of heights :)
one of the scariest is near Agia Paraskevi Monastery, you walk along the rock wall.
You can cross other people going the opposite and approaching the void ;D
http://peaklagger.com/hiking-vikos-gorge/ (http://peaklagger.com/hiking-vikos-gorge/)
and about the flora http://www.bioone.org/doi/pdf/10.3372/wi.27.2708 (http://www.bioone.org/doi/pdf/10.3372/wi.27.2708)
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Gabriela, it was all in the Pidus range from Milea with Crocus robertianus on. The area is easily accessible as there are paved roads to all villages and many good forest roads. We have had just one week, the days have been short and there was no time to do long walks through the gorges and mountains. But you could do this of course.
The flora is very rich and there are many endemics in the mountains, Viola for example or on the islands like Campanula.
My favorite site is: https://www.greekmountainflora.info/index.html (https://www.greekmountainflora.info/index.html)
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Breathtaking lanscapes and beautiful flowers - thank you for showing.
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Some of the tracks are well known to host endemic plants....if you don't fear of heights :)
one of the scariest is near Agia Paraskevi Monastery, you walk along the rock wall.
You can cross other people going the opposite and approaching the void ;D
http://peaklagger.com/hiking-vikos-gorge/ (http://peaklagger.com/hiking-vikos-gorge/)
and about the flora http://www.bioone.org/doi/pdf/10.3372/wi.27.2708 (http://www.bioone.org/doi/pdf/10.3372/wi.27.2708)
Thanks Yann; the blogger's hiking story was quite funny :)
Quite an interesting region.
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Gabriela, it was all in the Pidus range from Milea with Crocus robertianus on. The area is easily accessible as there are paved roads to all villages and many good forest roads. We have had just one week, the days have been short and there was no time to do long walks through the gorges and mountains. But you could do this of course.
The flora is very rich and there are many endemics in the mountains, Viola for example or on the islands like Campanula.
My favorite site is: https://www.greekmountainflora.info/index.html (https://www.greekmountainflora.info/index.html)
Thank you Stefan. That's a great website with lots of informations.
Something good to explore even just virtual in the winter time :) I assume that even if in Northern side of Greece these places would be terribly hot somewhere in July.
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Also July is hot at low levels, it could be quite interesting in higher areas for special plants.
I prefer May and June for Northern Greece and March/April for the islands and low levels in Southern Greece.
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We have decided at the Vikos gorge not to look for Crocus hellenicus in western Greece and go straight down to the gulf of Corinth.
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Looking for Crocus robertianus at Moni Varnakova was no pleasure, just two single plants.
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Also just a few Cyclamen hederifolium
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I hope Janis is more successful there at the moment and the weather is not too wet. When looking at the current weather forecast it could be very displeasing.
We then went to the other side of the gulf and have had a good spot with Colchicum peloponnesiacum just above the village of Trapeza.
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Colchicum peloponnesiacum
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Attiki was our next destination to see especially Crocus cartwrightianus in the wild. We climbed a hill south of the airport by car und were just in a Crocus paradise. Yann hasn't promised too much about the abundance of this Crocus there.
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Crocus cartwrightianus first:
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Some more
Crocus cartwrightianus:
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Crocus laevigatus:
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Dense clouds arrived in the evening and it should be a short intermezzo with some rain till next morning.
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Stunning views and very welcome at this time of the year - thank you for taking us with you.
Gerd
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Gerd, this area is easy accessible from the airport and you are in this Crocus wonder world after just half an hour. Even Narcissus obsoletus is growing there but we did not find it.
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It was rainy next morning but the weather get better from the west.
View from Oros Panio from east to west, biotopes in the foreground.
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Cyclamen graecum
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Not easy to select the best pictures of Crocus cartwrightianus:
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Comparison of Crocus cartwrightianus with Crocus laevigatus
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Comparison of Crocus cartwrightianus with Colchicum cupanii
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Crocus laevigatus
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Be careful not to sit on this shrub:
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Colchicum cupanii, biotope of with Crocus mazziaricus
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Arisarum vulgaris
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The last pictures before we leave to the Peloponnese.
Crocus mazziaricus
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Most amazing pictures with C. cartwrightianus!
It's my favourite from the few that can be grown here in the ground. Alas, it didn't get to flower this year because snow came early. I love the way the flowers remain open even in the most cloudy weather.
The pictures with C. mazziaricus are stunning as well. Nothing compares with seeing them flowering in their wild habitats.
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Be careful not to sit on this shrub:
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4 years after a plants trip i still have a small piece of thorn in my knee, i though it'll disappear but it's not the case. The doctor said if nothing is removed it can takes until 8 years before the body "absorb" the thorn!!
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4 years after a plants trip i still have a small piece of thorn in my knee, i though it'll disappear but it's not the case. The doctor said if nothing is removed it can takes until 8 years before the body "absorb" the thorn!!
It sounds dangerous to me Yann, but if you're fine after 4 years, just 4 more to go ;D
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It sounds dangerous to me Yann, but if you're fine after 4 years, just 4 more to go ;D
I saw a surgeon and she said no soucy you can run with it inside :-\ i've no pain.
Back to Greece :D, here're other plants and i let Stefan continue his trip.
Hypericum empetrifolium
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Cephalaria flava subsp. setulifera (forgot to shot under the flower, it's typical)
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Galactites tomentosus
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Cerastium candidissimum (thanks to Stavros Apostolou for for the ID)
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4 years after a plants trip i still have a small piece of thorn in my knee, i though it'll disappear but it's not the case. The doctor said if nothing is removed it can takes until 8 years before the body "absorb" the thorn!!
That sounds also strange to me. I had had a thorn of a Robinia that went under my nail and came out two weeks later at the other side of the nail.
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First stop at the Peloponnese was south of Tripolis. Last year we have had thousands of Crocus hadriaticus and just a few Crocus melantherus. This year it was the other way round. Next possibility to get thorns, the Meadow was full of thistles.
Crocus melantherus
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And some more of this nice Crocus.
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We have found Crocus melantherus further to the south at every place we stopped.
Sternbergia sicula was growing in one south faced location.
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We started the next morning at 1100m and 20°C at sunrise, not too bad for the 1st of November.
We had some Crocus boryi around, the first of this trip but many to follow.
Last year we were rather puzzled of the plants that are growing in the eastern part of the Peloponnese. After seeing Crocus laevigatus in Attiki I am now convinced that we have just seen Crocus boryi. The flowers did never open fully, just cup shaped and they were generally bigger.
Crocus boryi, Biotope at 1100m
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Crocus boryi
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Crocus boryi, Biotope at 200m
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We were driving down in the area south of Leonidi where many Crocus were flowering. Next one we have seen was Crocus niveus, often at the road banks and at the end of flowering time.
The more we went down, the better the plants were.
Crocus niveus
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Landscape around Chouni with many biotopes of Crocus, Colchicum and orchids in spring.
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We have had also many Crocus melantherus, even better than the day before.
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We have seen just a single turtle during this trip and not so many other animals as last year. First orchids rosetts have been out.
Testudo marginata
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Barlia robertiana
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Ophrys spec., probably an Euophrys
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Cyclamen graecum
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I've also noticed that Barlia sprout very early compared to previous autumn, the orchids season will start soon if the winter is mild.
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We have seen much more orchid leaves this year compared to last year. There was rain from August on in Greece and they had enough water also in September and October.
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We continued our trip down to the sea on the one hand to find Colchicum bivonae in the lower Areas on the other hand to take a bath as we have reached nearly 30°C.
But first we discovered many bunches of Crocus boryi while passing a village.
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At the other side of the road:
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We did not find any Colchicum bivonae but other nice things.
Arbutus unedo
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Allium callimischon
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Colchicum cupanii
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Quercus coccifera fruits
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And then finally down to the sea.
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Urginea maritima seeds
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Iris oratoria
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We have found the very last flowering Crocus hadriaticus in late afternoon.
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Thanks for this illustrated report. Very informative on all this lovely autumn crocus. I really don't now them very well and having several nice pictures of each with biotope is very useful.
I'm sure that all these crocus are well identified but can i suggest you Quercus coccifera (instead of Q. ilex) and Iris oratoria (instead of Mantis religiosa) ?
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Thanks for your help Yain, I have changed the names. I do not know insects so well, this name is new to me.
I always confuse the Latin names of these two Quercus species as you have noticed. The German names are totally clear to me.
Don't worry about the Crocus names, they are correct.
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I hope this will give travel ideas to forum's members for the 2019 fall.
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That picture with the mantis is quite something Stefan!
How nice to look at these flowers, especially that it got cold so fast this fall. If my few Sternbergia seedlings survive the winter I shall plant them under a rock :)
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If my few Sternbergia seedlings survive the winter I shall plant them under a rock :)
They like it hot, most grow in south facing places. But this can also be quite high in the mountains. I have seen Sternbergia sicula up to 1500 m asl in Greece.
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Speaking of Sternbergia, the next place we visited close to Lambokambos next morning was full of them but nearly all were faded.
It was the first place of this trip with four Crocus species (boryi, goulimy, melantherus and niveus). We have spent much time there as we did last year. And it is also a good orchid place, friends have been there in April.
Till yesterday I have uploaded pictures till 400KB without any problem. Today it seems to be restricted to 200KB and it took some time to make them all smaller. So it is a rather short report today as I have no more time left for more.
Not possible to upload any picture even smaller 200KB. So I will add them later.
Biotope:
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Crocus goulimyi
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And some more of Crocus goulimyi
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There were lots of Cyclamen hederifolium around.
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Still at the same place a very last Colchicum bivonae
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And another neighboring biotope with Sternbergia sicula in flower
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Crocus melantherus again and again
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Crocus niveus often flowering along the roads and very dry stony places.
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Fascinating trip Stefan.
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Thanks David! We are still happy that we had such a nice weather and so many impressions.
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We have had a short break from the plants around midday and went the street down to the coast at Kiparissi, again 28°C.
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Super beautiful, thanks again for taking the time to post Stefan.
What you mentioned with the size of the pictures happened to me as well, I don't know the reason.
I've been watching a lot of pictures from the wild with Sternbergia and I think it is worth a try. It gets very hot in S Ontario (most summers) and in a full sun/good drainage location the only remaining problem would be to protect them from the cold rains of spring/late fall. You can certainly grow C. hederifolium here.
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It is worth a try Gabriela. They are growing well here for years. My best ones originate from Mt. Menalon in the middle of the Peloponnese at 1500m where it can be quite ugly with many rain in spring and fall.
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We crossed a vast area with low shrubs and nothing but goats and sheep on dirt roads after leaving the coast. There was nothing new but many nice biotopes that could be interesting also in spring.
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We didn't spent much time there as we wanted to visit a location with snowdrops in the Taygetos. It was not the best time of the day and it was already rather dark there under the plane trees but we have found them.
Galanthus reginae-olgae
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Some more Galanthus reginae-olgae
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Cyclamen are sometimes growing everywhere and it is not always possible to stop at the best places which are often road banks. But you can find them also in olive groves.
Cyclamen graecum
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Great report!
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Great report!
Yes! - and excellent photos.
Stefan, can you tell me (us?) please how to differenciate Cyclamen hederifolium from Cyclamen graecum when leaves are absent?
Gerd
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This is difficult Gerd. I have named just plants with leaves to be sure.
Cyclamen graecum is growing at drier and sunnier places in full sun, whereas Cyclamen hederifolium prefers shadier spots. But of course this overlaps. I thought Cyclamen graecum flowers are less eared than Cyclamen hederifolium ones before I was in Greece last autumn but this is obviously often not true.
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Still is the same biotope the only flowering Urginea maritima of the trip.
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and a Cichorium species. I do not know whether it is the same as ours.
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We went further to the west to lake Kaifa and the coast. A few Narcissus obsoletus were growing at the thermal springs.
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And then we wanted to jump in the sea for the last time this trip and year, the temperature was above 25°C again. But we had to stop first as hundreds of Crocus boryi were growing in the dunes.
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Last Crocus boryi of the trip.
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And then the beech finally but just 2 hours left till we had to go to the ferry.
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Departure to Ancona:
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Arrival at Ancona next afternoon:
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And driving home nearly 800 km.
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Thank you for the report Stefan - love those pictures of the crocus on the beach.
Stefan, can you tell me (us?) please how to differenciate Cyclamen hederifolium from Cyclamen graecum when leaves are absent?
Gerd
Quote from Chris Grey-Wilson's book Cyclamen (2002 edition, published by Batsford and highly recommended)
"I have often been asked how to tell C. graecum and C. hederifolium apart in flower in the absence of leaves or tubers. This is not difficult despite the fact that both have similarly coloured flowers of more or less the same size and with prominent auricles. The difference really comes down to the markings at the base of the corolla which are consistently different; in C. hederifolium there are two broad, more or less V-shaped, marks at the base of each petal, whereas in C. graecum there are two similarly coloured thin (pencil line) V-shaped marks with a single thin line between them."
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Thank you for the report Stefan - love those pictures of the crocus on the beach.
Quote from Chris Grey-Wilson's book Cyclamen (2002 edition, published by Batsford and highly recommended)
"I have often been asked how to tell C. graecum and C. hederifolium apart in flower in the absence of leaves or tubers. This is not difficult despite the fact that both have similarly coloured flowers of more or less the same size and with prominent auricles. The difference really comes down to the markings at the base of the corolla which are consistently different; in C. hederifolium there are two broad, more or less V-shaped, marks at the base of each petal, whereas in C. graecum there are two similarly coloured thin (pencil line) V-shaped marks with a single thin line between them."
Thank you Stefan and Gail!
@Gail: - yes ,this helps indeed! - and it can be verified when looking at Stefans pics!
Gerd
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Thanks Gail, that really helps to keep the flowers apart!
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Thanks for the great report, Stefan !! Excellent pictures and great finds !
I was with Yann on the trip he reported from at the beginning of this thread, this is a great supplement and inspiration for future trips ! 8)
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next year? ;)
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next year? ;)
Definitely ! ;D