Scottish Rock Garden Club Forum
Bulbs => Bulbs General => Topic started by: Robert on March 17, 2018, 06:47:59 PM
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The first of the Triteleia laxa to bloom. It is a little roughed-up from the recent stormy weather. This form is typical of the species and is from Lake County, California.
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Wow, Robert,
that seems very early!
Over here we don't expect T. laxa till after daffodil season!
Your pic reminds me of the form called 'The Giant' (or "Giant Ithuriel's Spear")
which is one of the last themid's to bloom here.
Keep them coming regardless ;D
cheers
fermi
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Hi Fermi,
Triteleia laxa is an early blooming species, however you are correct, this is an extremely early blooming specimen. Many species from the Coastal Mountains come into bloom before the same species will bloom in the Sacramento Valley or the Sierra Nevada foothills. In our garden, this Triteleia laxa specimen is far ahead of other accessions I have from the Coastal Mountains. The others are budded, however they will not be blooming for another two weeks or even more. A few local, early blooming patches that I am aware of have not started blooming yet, but they will soon.
I have the same situation with Dichelostemma capitatum. Most of the accessions are showing their flower buds but will not be blooming until early April. I have one seedling selection that consistently starts blooming in early February (the seed was from Southern California). I can extend this variability to Triteleia ixioides. I have high elevation forms of Triteleia ixioides ssp. anilina that emerge from the ground very late. Other forms of Triteleia ixioides ssp. scabra emerge much earlier and the flower buds can now be seen. They will be blooming in April, while the high elevation forms of ssp. anilina will not bloom until May. This certainly extends the blooming season.
This only discusses blooming time. Variation in other traits can be observed, such as flower color. Occasionally, I see nice pink forms of Triteleia laxa and Brodiaea elegans ssp. elegans. There are other variations in flower color too.
Sadly locally, the Themidaceae have been maligned as weedy pests. I guess this is good news for me, as I see tremendous potential within the group and I can work quietly on my own. I am already making progress selecting and breeding superior forms. I will have more to share as the season progresses.
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Triteleia ixioides ssp scabra.
With warm sunny weather this week many more Themedaceae will most likely come into bloom.
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Brodiaea elegans, or at least that is what I think, in flower in a 3l pot in the conservatory. Pictures on the web do not normally show such an abundant 'umbrella' of flowers on a stalk, so maybe this is something else?
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Brodiaea elegans
There appears to be a confusion of Brodiaea and Tritelia. I don't know what the differences are botanically, but they are quite different in appearance. I had T. 'Queen Fabiola' in the garden, but this year it hasn't surfaced so can't compare!
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In both Brodiaea and Triteleia there seem to be quite a few plant which are synonymous with eachother, let alone others in their own genus and Tristagma, etc - I'm confused - hope you find an answer, it's a good plant!
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Hi Bart,
Yes, you indeed have an attractive Brodiaea. With this posting is a photograph of Brodiaea elegans ssp. elegans taken this a.m. at our farm here in El Dorado County, California. I hope that it is clear the difference in the general shape of the perianth, as well as the placement of the staminodes (or lack of) between the two plants and the recurved anthers (your plant). I cannot see enough of the details of your Brodiaea to make a determination to the species level, however it does look a bit like Brodiaea rosea (please check your plant carefully and make your own determination). If the plant is from wild seed, you might try keying it out using Jepson online – http://ucjeps.berkeley.edu/cgi-bin/get_IJM.pl?key=9493 (http://ucjeps.berkeley.edu/cgi-bin/get_IJM.pl?key=9493) Keep in mind that extreme climatic conditions (extreme, relative to its native habitat) can occasionally cause a degree of morphological difference from a plant in its native habitat. In your case, determination to the species level looks straightforward. Also keep in mind that taxonomy is an ever-evolving science and to a degree an art. Even in our part of California there is a considerable amount of fieldwork that needs to be done to clarify taxonomic issues.
It is extremely easy to recognize a Brodiaea, Dichelostemma, or Triteleia, once all grouped together in the genus Brodiaea. There are clear differences, as stated below:
Brodiaea – generally 3 staminodes, sometimes none. Stamens 3 , the anthers are appressed to the style.
Dichelostemma – staminodes generally 0, stamens generally 3, with the filaments forming a crown-like tube outside the anthers.
Triteleia – stamens 6 attached to the perianth tube.
Anyway, congratulation! Your Brodiaea is beautiful and very well grown.
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Thank you Robert and Maggi.
I had a look at the link Robert but quickly became bamboozled by the botanical terms for all the 'bits'. I made a few more pics and also did some measuring.
The whole flower stalk stands at 50cm- That in itself doesn't add up if you look at the key- most of them seem a lot shorter. There are 30 individual flowers that sprout off the main flower stalk at 35cm height; the florets measure 15cm including the ovary and perianth.
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How do you measure the size of the perianth? the coloured bit of the flower is 60mm across and about 30mm high. The ovary is about 20mm high.
there are 3 stamens and 1 stigma that seems to exsert itself as the flower matures. The staminodes are about 20mm x 5mm and have a little inny bit at the top where the two halves meet :).
They appear uniformly coloured and are off-white.
I'll have a careful read through the key, but maybe you can make something of my info? Ah, the plant was not seed-raised but came to me as a 'lucky dip' of bulbils and bulblets of all sorts of bulb debris that would have been binned at a plant centre that did- and does sell all sorts of unusual bulbs, mostly commercial imports from Holland if I remeber rightly.
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Hi Bart,
Thank you for the additional photographs! and information.
Hummmm? You have me asking a lot of questions in my head now. FUN! :)
Now, I have my doubts that the plant is a Brodiaea!
From what you are writing, seems that you are understanding the key well. Your difficulties may stem from the fact that the plant is another member of the Themidaceae. My solution would be to start at the Genus level and make sure that it keys to the correct genus. Often it can even be helpful to go back to the Family level. Think of the whole Boraginaceae - Hydrophyllaceae rearrangement. Since the plant is of cultivated origins all bets are off. A hybrid is possible. In the wild, natural annual Phacelia hybrids can be extremely difficult to sort out. With cultivated plants of potential hybrid origins, the situation becomes even more problematic (i.e. who could mommy and daddy be?).
At least you know that the plant is not Brodiaea elegans ssp. elegans.
Good luck. Please let us know what you discover about this plant. 8)
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Maybe a hybrid involving e.g. Brodiaea californica (http://www.calflora.org/cgi-bin/specieslist.cgi?where-family=THEMIDACEAE)?
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Maybe a hybrid involving e.g. Brodiaea californica (http://www.calflora.org/cgi-bin/specieslist.cgi?where-family=THEMIDACEAE)?
Ashley,
Very 8)
If you are not spot on, you are very close with Brodiaea californica.
Bart,
I hope that you read the description for Brodiaea california and see if it matches.
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Yes, I quickly googled the assortment some Dutch bulb wholesalers carry and Brodiae californica ‘Babylon Pink’ popped up. I know that this selection wasn’t around when I got the bulblet’s but I looked up some pictures and apart from the colour I think it must be close. Thank you both, I do some more homework in the morning and let you know!
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1 & 2) Triteleia ixioides flowering in the garden;
3) Triteleia dudleyi grown from SRGC Seedex 2015; sown 21-05-2016
4 & 5) unnamed Brodiaea which came up in another pot!
cheers
fermi
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Fermi,
It is nice to get a show of the Themidaceae this time of year (here in the north). 8)
When I get time I will check them out closely. I already have questions concerning Triteleia dudleyi which will require more time and examination.
Currently I grow three subspecies of Triteleia ixioides. Subspecies anilina from higher elevations maintains its late blooming sequence even down here in the Sacramento Valley (near sea level). This year I found some high elevation forms of Triteleia hyacinthina and Brodiaea elegans ssp. elegans. Judging from the sites, I believe they arrived at these site via livestock during the period 1860 to 1880. If true, they have certainly adjusted well to the new environment. How they will preform in the garden is an exciting prospect as there are often surprises in these cases.
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Hi Robert,
I'll try to get a couple more pics of the T. dudleyi as the other spikes come into bloom. I had mistakenly thought this was the pot of Triteleia laxa seedlings but they aren't yet flowering size.
More of the Themids will be flowering soon and I'll try to get pics as they come into bloom,
cheers
fermi
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This is what I grew as Brodiaea coronaria var macropoda from NZAGS 2004 seedex.
I think someone has questioned its ID previously so I wonder what it is?
cheers
fermi
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Hi Fermi,
Plant identification can be challenging from posted photographs, however I enjoy the opportunity to keep my mind sharp and my knowledge current. So, thank you for posting the photographs. :) 8)
Firstly, from my research, Brodiaea coronaria var. macropoda is synonymous with Brodiaea terrestris ssp. terrestris. If the tip of the anther has a dentate lobe in notch, then you have a close match. Keep in mind that garden collected seed can be unintended hybrid seed. The resulting hybrids may be beautiful and useful garden plants. In addition, if the parentage of the hybrid is known this can add to our knowledge of the possible origins and relationships of the species in the wild.
As an example, near the El Dorado County farm, Brodiaea elegans ssp. elegans is very common. Nearby there is a serpentine barren where Brodiaea minor grows abundantly. Both species bloom late in the season and natural hybridization is very possible, however I have never observed the phenomena. There are also various Triteleia species found in our area. To date, I have not observed hybridization on the species level, however distinction between some of the subspecies can become a bit blurred in some situations.
Keep in mind odd hybrids do occur, even in the wild. Natural hybrids between Allium campanulatum and A. validum are rare, but do occur. We are also aware of how easily some Calochortus species will cross with each other. Even odd hybrids between Calochortus albus and monophyllus have been reported. I have never seen any and I often see the two species growing and blooming in very close proximity to each other.
By the way, I did look at the previous posting of photographs. It is impossible for me to verify the identity of Triteleia dudleyi. Check the filament tip appendages. If they are forked the plants are most likely Triteleia ixioides. In this case I would be very wary of a hybrid plant; once again, with seed of garden origin there can often be too many questions.
As for the Brodiaea, for me it is too difficult to see the needed details to make an accurate identification. Some Themidaceae produce abundant bulb offsets. They can get spread around very easily.
Thank you again for posting the photographs. I enjoyed checking them out! :) 8)
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Hi Robert,
thanks for your input; I'll have to correct the label at some time.
It's looking even better now!
cheers
fermi
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Triteleia elegans is flowering - leaning over a bit as it's in too much shade I think
cheers
fermi
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Triteleia laxa is probably the most commonly grown themid in Australia, I think.
cheers
fermi
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Some of the Triteleia laxa forms we got from Lambley Nursery - I think sourced from Holland:
Triteleia 'Rudy Kleiner'
Triteleia 'Allure'
Triteleia 'For You'
cheers
fermi
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Hi Fermi,
How are the named clones of Triteleia laxa different or improvements over the species? Is there superior performance, one clone over another? In my experience, the species is generally fairly uniform in the wild. I do encounter odd flower colors from time-to-time. Occasionally I find pink, white, or striped flowered plants.
The early blooming forms of Triteleia laxa have been up in our garden for over a month now. I am always amazed how quickly they advance in growth. We should see the first flowers in late January or February. The first flowers are not that far off. :)
Also, are the photographs posted in blooming sequence? It would be very odd to see Triteleia laxa blooming at the same time as Brodiaea elegans. Triteleia laxa is very early blooming and Brodiaea elegans is among the last to bloom.
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Hi Robert,
these are all in flower now. Triteleia laxa is usually one of the last to flower but that depends on where thye are planted.
Triteleia ixioides is now in seed as are the early brodieas.
The T.laxa selections seem to have been made for the cutflower trade by the Dutch, I think.
The differences are mainly in colour,
cheers
fermi
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Fermi,
This is all very interesting.
I have both early blooming and late blooming forms of Triteleia ixioides. Those from higher elevations bloom later in the season, even at our low elevation Sacramento home.
I have one high elevation form of Triteleia laxa (grown from seed). I will be very curious to find out when they will bloom at our Sacramento home. All the other forms of Triteleia laxa that I grow bloom early in the season, some extremely early.
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My Triteleia ixioides 'Splendens' has well developed leaves now. I don't remember it being in growth at this time. It did not flower in summer and I don't think it produced leaves either. I thought the rabbits had eaten it though I'd usually see some signs of it even if they had. We had a very dry spring and summer which must have confused it.