Scottish Rock Garden Club Forum

Bulbs => Bulbs General => Topic started by: YT on February 18, 2014, 02:27:29 PM

Title: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: YT on February 18, 2014, 02:27:29 PM
Here, the first muscari flower has opened today.
Muscari azureum, ex R.& R.Wallis 93-28.
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Maggi Young on February 18, 2014, 02:44:39 PM
I was surprised to see the muscari so advanced in photos from Ragley Hall in England this weekend :
http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=11423.msg295040#msg295040 (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=11423.msg295040#msg295040)    ( image 7036)
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Maggi Young on February 18, 2014, 02:45:46 PM
Quote
Quote from: ikizzeki on February 15, 2014, 06:37:04 PM

    I am not good at gardening and computing but eager to learn more. Early in the morning I have gone to garden which is 25 km away from  Antalya city centre and almost in the middle of woodland, explored a new muscari in it. Now I am trying to identify it..

The mystery plant :
[attachimg=1]
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Afloden on February 18, 2014, 05:27:10 PM
The mystery one looks like a Bellevalia or Hyacinthella to me. Nice color.


Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Oron Peri on February 19, 2014, 08:14:11 PM
It is Hyacinthella heldreichii
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Maggi Young on February 19, 2014, 08:37:06 PM
Thanks!
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: art600 on February 21, 2014, 10:01:17 PM
In flower now

Muscari from Turkey

Muscari from Turkey

Bellevalia rixii
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: YT on February 26, 2014, 12:47:01 PM
Nice dark coloured muscaris, Art ;)

Here are 2 muscaris from JJA Seeds, today :)

JJA 688.205 Muscari azureum
Turkey, Kahramanmaras, S of Goksun. 1240m. Cultivated field. Ex R.& R.Wallis 93-28

JJA 689.270 Muscari discolor, from the Seed List September, 2008
689.270 : Muscari discolor (Subgen. Botryanthus) Turkey, Mardin, N of Mardin. 1100m. Among talus on steep limestone slopes. (This is the 'true' plant. Haussknecht's type-collection was from Mardin & this taxon appears to be restricted to the hills in southern Urfa & Mardin provinces, along the north edge of the Syrian Desert running towards the Iraqi border. Extremely early flowering (February with us) & about 10cm. tall with racemes of bicolored, open-mouthed bells, the blackish blue of the base contrasting with the white of the apex, which occupies almost half the length of each flower.)
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: krisderaeymaeker on February 26, 2014, 09:29:04 PM
That discolor has amazing colours Tatsuo ! Dark as the night and as always perfectly grown .
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: YT on February 27, 2014, 07:09:31 AM
That discolor has amazing colours Tatsuo ! Dark as the night and as always perfectly grown .

Thank you, Kris :) But I think its height is more or less taller than the last season. From the begining to mid of February, total hours of sunlight here is less than 60% of usual. It drizzle now, as well :(
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Luc Gilgemyn on February 27, 2014, 01:39:43 PM
Gorgeous muscari Tatsuo !  :o :o

I always love the sight of Muscari azureum pushing through the soil !
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: pehe on February 28, 2014, 11:29:45 AM
I was surprised to see the muscari so advanced in photos from Ragley Hall in England this weekend :
http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=11423.msg295040#msg295040 (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=11423.msg295040#msg295040)    ( image 7036)

Maggi, there are some muscari clones, which flowers in the winter/early spring: 'Christmas Pearl' and 'Winter Amethyst' not to mention 'Autumn Glory' which flowers any time between September and March.

Here is 'Christmas Pearl', which has flowered in the open garden since Christmas.

Poul
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Maggi Young on February 28, 2014, 11:44:52 AM
Thanks Poul, 'Christmas Pearl' is pretty with that pale blue.
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Steve Garvie on March 02, 2014, 07:00:46 PM
Muscari chalusicum
(http://farm3.staticflickr.com/2877/12885505454_b721bf717e_o.jpg)
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: ArnoldT on March 02, 2014, 10:04:45 PM
Muscari botryoides
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Oron Peri on March 03, 2014, 07:12:49 PM
Here is Bellevalia mauritanica, syn B. fallax from Tunisia
recived from a good friend.
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: YT on March 04, 2014, 02:21:55 PM
Oron, That is a wild beauty 8)

JJA 688.705 Muscari coeleste
Turkey, Niğde, Kamirkazik Dag, 1700-1750m. Ex. KPPZ 90-318.
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: art600 on March 14, 2014, 07:54:16 PM
An unknown Muscari

Muscari 'Pink Sunrise'
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Mark Griffiths on March 15, 2014, 11:54:06 AM
that unknown one is particularly striking Arthur
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Naoto The Zombie on March 16, 2014, 06:54:22 AM
Bellevalia dubia in bloom!  :)

Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: YT on March 17, 2014, 01:47:32 AM
That's a nice bellevalia, Naoto :)

Heres is Hyacinthella dalmatica 'Grandiflora'. The florets opened before their spikes pushing out the soil :(
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Naoto The Zombie on March 19, 2014, 05:48:35 PM
That's a nice bellevalia, Naoto :)

 :) !
And your Hyacinthella is looking good, too! :)
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Tony Willis on March 23, 2014, 11:37:59 AM
Muscari aucheri from Bolu.

The hyacinthella is delightful
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Oron Peri on March 26, 2014, 05:38:14 PM
An unknown Muscari

Art, with such an open mouth i would say M. anatolicum in a very nice color form.
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Oron Peri on March 26, 2014, 05:46:28 PM
Tony, real beauties, wish i could grow this species...

Here are more species in flower today:

Leopoldia maritima from Tunisia
Leopoldia bicolor from coastal Israel
Muscari spreizenhoferi, endemic to Crete
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: art600 on March 26, 2014, 09:15:39 PM
Art, with such an open mouth i would say M. anatolicum in a very nice color form.

Thanks Oron - thought I had lost it - only the label :)
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: fermi de Sousa on March 27, 2014, 05:58:08 AM
Jon B has already posted a pic of this one - Hyacinthoides lingulata ssp ciliolata ; this is ours - also from Otto!
cheers
fermi
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: johnralphcarpenter on March 30, 2014, 01:05:23 PM
Muscari macrocarpum in the garden now.
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: pehe on April 01, 2014, 10:50:09 AM
Ralph, nice to see. I have never succeded with that species in my garden.

Poul
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: pehe on April 01, 2014, 10:58:45 AM
Some Muscari flowering today.

1. Muscari latifolium
2. Muscari latifolium in front of M. azureum Alba
3. M. latifolium and azureum Alba
4. M. azureum, azureum Alba and latifloium
5. M. armeneicum Christmas Pearl

Poul
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: pehe on April 01, 2014, 11:35:25 AM
Muscari flowering today

1 + 2. Muscari adilii
3. Muscari aucheri Autumn Glory (spring flower, pic from yesterday)
4. Muscari aucheri Autumn Glory (autumn flower, pic from 21. October)
5. Muscari aucheri Autumn Glory seed pod from autumn flower

It is a bit strange that you at the same time can have flowers and almost ripe seed pod on the the same Muscari plant (but normal for Autumn Glory)

Poul
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Maggi Young on April 01, 2014, 04:08:14 PM
Quote
Muscari latifolium in front of M. azureum Alba

 - and how very pretty the plump flowers of   the M. azureum Alba are - always pretty to see flowers in profusion, of course.
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Menai on April 01, 2014, 06:29:53 PM
Please could someone id the Muscari on the right of the picture. I have always assumed the one on the left was M. armeniacum as it came from an old garden in which it was a pest. The other came from a well-known bulb specialist as part of an order for latifolium! It took me some years to separate them out.  He was unapologetic and really quite huffy when I suggested his staff might have muddled my order. I thought they might be azureum as he listed those too but looking at the pictures posted here the foliage is wrong - early and lax.
Thanks

Erle
Anglesey
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: David Nicholson on April 01, 2014, 07:58:26 PM
Muscari macrocarpum
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: pehe on April 01, 2014, 08:23:56 PM
- and how very pretty the plump flowers of   the M. azureum Alba are - always pretty to see flowers in profusion, of course.

I find them pretty too, and unlike many other Muscari they have few and short leaves when they flower. They are easy to grow and come true from seed. The only disadvantage is that they set lots of seeds (but good for the seed exchange), so if you don't deadhead them you will have them all over the garden. But they are easy to weed out as the bulbs grows close to the surface.

If someone is interested, I have lots of spare bulbs and later seeds.

Poul
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Tony Willis on April 01, 2014, 08:26:23 PM
Menai

here is my Muscari latifolium collected in SW Turkey. it is now a weed in my frames


also Muscari sp coll Amasya to Zile in Turkey
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: johnralphcarpenter on April 09, 2014, 03:35:41 PM
Muscari armeniacum 'Valerie Finnis'
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: mark smyth on April 09, 2014, 04:01:37 PM
An unknown Muscari

lovely colour combination
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: mark smyth on April 09, 2014, 04:06:42 PM
If only all Muscari were as prolific as the weedy one. I was given some and assured it wasn't the terrible weed
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Tony Willis on April 09, 2014, 08:20:47 PM
Muscari macrocarpum from Kath Dryden
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Mark Griffiths on April 10, 2014, 06:04:42 PM
lovely plants all - here are a few - actually my entire collection

Muscari muscarimi

Muscari macrocarpum Golden Fragrance

Muscari macrocarpum from Norman Stevens


Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Naoto The Zombie on April 13, 2014, 07:43:19 AM
Hi there!  :)
Jenny Robinson (aka Baby's Breath) and Gul Delight are in bloom in my garden! :)

Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: fermi de Sousa on April 13, 2014, 03:00:15 PM
Flowering in the garden now (autumn) - Muscari parviflorum.
Sorry for the pathetic pic, but it's a wispy thing!
cheers
fermi
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: fermi de Sousa on April 17, 2014, 08:48:28 AM
A better look at the flower-head of Muscari parviflorum,
cheers
fermi
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Maggi Young on April 21, 2014, 08:02:04 PM
Rimmer ( de Vries)  grows a lot of bulbs   ( sensible chap!) - see some of his "little blue bulbs"  here (https://www.flickr.com/photos/32952654@N06/sets/72157644133272573/)
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: fermi de Sousa on August 03, 2014, 03:28:18 PM
Time for the"spring" muscari in our garden!
Two little pots of seedling Muscari inconstrictum, the first grown from AGS Seedex 2009, second flowering and the other is from Kurt Vickery also 2009, first flowering.
You can really get a whiff of violets from the first one! (No, not from the pic - Fred hasn't managed the "sniff" button yet!)
cheers
fermi
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: ashley on August 03, 2014, 09:26:06 PM
Very nice Fermi.   It's one of my favourite muscari but I never realised it was scented.   
Only six or so months to wait ;D
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: dominique on August 14, 2014, 10:40:38 AM
All is very early this year. Scilla autumnalis alba, Scilla numidica and Scilla scilloides born since august 5th
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Maggi Young on August 14, 2014, 01:57:50 PM
All is very early this year. Scilla autumnalis alba, Scilla numidica and Scilla scilloides born since august 5th
So soon?!   :o   Where is the year going?
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: fermi de Sousa on August 16, 2014, 03:23:12 PM
Still (almost) spring down here, Maggi! ;D
Here's one of the seedlings raised from AGS Seedex from Muscari 'Gul (Delight)'
cheers
fermi
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: krisderaeymaeker on August 16, 2014, 04:01:02 PM
Still (almost) spring down here, Maggi! ;D
Here's one of the seedlings raised from AGS Seedex from Muscari 'Gul (Delight)'
cheers
fermi

Delighted to see this tiny little beauty Fermi.
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Yann on August 16, 2014, 08:14:36 PM
Dom do we live in the same country?  :o so soon flowering, mine are just rooting!
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: dominique on August 17, 2014, 05:39:41 AM
yes Yann ! Complicated this year for repotting with a lot of Young root already seen.
All mine grow outdoor in frame or rock garden
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: fermi de Sousa on August 25, 2014, 11:35:45 AM
Some seedlings  grown from seed received as Muscari commutatum - but one has white "teeth" while the other doesn't.
Is this an acceptable variation or have I got two types of muscari here?
cheers
fermi
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: fermi de Sousa on August 25, 2014, 12:26:59 PM
One of my favourites, Muscari muscarima, is just coming into bloom again; still a singleton after a few years :(
cheers
fermi
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: fermi de Sousa on August 25, 2014, 12:31:16 PM
Delighted to see this tiny little beauty Fermi.
Hi Kris,
it's a sweet thing - do you grow it? I believe it originates from Rannweig Wallis. I got the seeds from the AGS Seedex and I think it comes fairly true from seed. This year I bought Muscari 'Pink Surprise' which I'm yet to flower.
Here's another pot of seedlings "ex 'Gul (Delight)',
cheers
fermi
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: johnw on August 25, 2014, 01:14:10 PM
Fermi - I've not had an offset in 17 years.

johnw
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Matt T on August 25, 2014, 01:22:31 PM
One of my favourites, Muscari muscarima, is just coming into bloom again; still a singleton after a few years :(
cheers
fermi

Does it set seed if self-pollinated? If not, are you brave enough to chip it??  :-\
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: fermi de Sousa on August 25, 2014, 01:25:25 PM
... are you brave enough to chip it??  :-\
buk buk buk buk - no one here but us chickens! ;D
I'm waiting to see if some seedlings I have are "true",
cheers
fermi
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Rimmer de Vries on August 31, 2014, 02:11:21 PM
Barnardia scilloides blooming Aug 18 in SE Michigan,

This is the autumn scilla that sends up 0.8cm wide leaves before the flower stems emerge.

this photos show about 6-8 different seed ex lots.  peak day was very windy hence out of focus photo. .

 this is about 1 month earlier than in 2013
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: fermi de Sousa on September 06, 2014, 12:38:32 PM
Grew this from SRGC Seedex 2010 as Bellevalia ciliata, first flowers open this morning,
cheers
fermi
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Maggi Young on September 06, 2014, 12:44:05 PM
Looks like it has slightly hairy leaf margins  - but isn't colour meant to be more lilac on opening , turning greenish later?

I'm not sure how much variation there is in these plants.  :-\
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: ashley on September 06, 2014, 11:25:51 PM
Interesting to see Fermi.  My plants from this seed may still be a year off flowering.
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: fermi de Sousa on September 12, 2014, 01:28:57 AM
Thanks for your comments, Maggi and Ashley,
I 'll see what it flowers like next year - maybe this year it's still immature.
Here are some of the seedlings we raised from the AGS Seedex a few years ago "ex Muscari 'Valerie Finnis'
The blue pellets were necessary as the slugs were chewing the leaves off at ground level as they emerged!
cheers
fermi
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: pehe on September 14, 2014, 09:06:52 AM
Muscari parviflorum, the tiny autumn flowering muscari.

Poul
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: fermi de Sousa on September 15, 2014, 01:50:45 PM
This was grown from NARGS Seedex 2007 as Bellevalia pycnantha which I believe has been renamed B. paradoxa,
cheers
fermi
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: ashley on September 15, 2014, 10:33:12 PM
Yes B. pycnantha was reduced to a synonym of B. paradoxa about 10 years ago but they are maintained separately as Muscari paradoxum & M. pycnanthum in the International Plant Names Index ;)

In his book 'Buried Treasures' (p. 339) Jānis says that B. paradoxa occurs at higher altitudes and in drier places than B. pycnantha.  Morphologically he distinguishes B. pycnantha as having lighter perianth lobes and leaves of different shape to B. paradoxa.  Others claim that there are no significant morphological differences and the two were lumped based on karyotype analysis.  However I don't know whether any DNA sequence comparison has been done. 
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: fermi de Sousa on September 16, 2014, 10:14:48 AM
Hi Ashley,
it will be interesting to see if what I've received as B. paradoxa looks any different to what I've received as B. pycnantha! The first lot I ever grew labelled B. pycnantha turned out to be B. romana!
Here's later pics of the Bellevalia "possibly" ciliata
cheers
fermi
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: fermi de Sousa on September 16, 2014, 12:37:07 PM
I think I got this white muscari as M. armeniacum "Album" or M. argaei album.
It's not rare but not really common,
cheers
fermi
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: pehe on September 21, 2014, 05:26:13 PM
Different forms of Muscari parviflorum.
I think form 2 is worth growing, but far less showy than the spring flowering ones.

Poul
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: pehe on October 07, 2014, 03:11:41 PM
The other autumn flowering Muscari growing in an open frame:

Muscari aucheri 'Autumn Glory'

Poul
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: ruben on October 07, 2014, 07:47:50 PM
Stunning form Poul that aucheri 'Autumn Glory'
Is this one hardy in open garden?
In which nursery is this one available? I'm very interested in.
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: pehe on October 08, 2014, 03:19:02 AM
Thank you Ruben!
Yes, it is hardy in the open garden according to Ray Cobb, from whom I got my bulbs, but I have only very few so until they have multiplied I keep them in pots. To my knowledge they are not available in any nursery.

Poul
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: fermi de Sousa on October 08, 2014, 12:11:30 PM
Poul,
it would be interesting to see if you could cross your two autumn flowerers!
We still have a couple of spring flowerers in bloom:
Muscari leucostomum
Muscari (Leopoldia) weissii x 2 pics
cheers
fermi
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: pehe on October 08, 2014, 08:24:55 PM
Poul,
it would be interesting to see if you could cross your two autumn flowerers!

cheers
fermi

Fermi, I have tried last year without any luck. This year parviflorum has finished flowering before Autumn Glory has started.

Poul
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Oron Peri on October 10, 2014, 11:44:43 AM
Muscari parviflorum starts flowering.
I have decided to grow only this form as it has pink-red leaves and stems when appearing.
Also, it seems every bulb sets a flower stem which is uncommon for this species.
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: pehe on November 16, 2014, 07:59:56 AM
Some autumn flowering Muscari

1. Muscari arm. 'Winter Amethyst'
2. Muscari arm. 'Christmas Pearl'
3 +4. The first flowers of Muscari aucheri 'Autumn Glory' have withered, but new ones are emerging.

Poul
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Oron Peri on November 18, 2014, 04:17:10 PM
Here is Barnardia numidica [syn. Scilla numidica] ex. Ibizza. Flowering after 4 years from seeds.
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: YT on December 13, 2014, 02:25:14 PM
I spot a Muscari anatolicum plant has started to bloom today.
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Oron Peri on December 26, 2014, 08:18:39 AM
A couple from today,

An early flowering form of Hyacinthus orientalis originally from the Galilee Region.
Hyacinthella nervosa originally from the Jordan Valley near the city of Jericho.
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Yann on December 26, 2014, 08:55:08 AM
Lovely
Title: Re: Muscari & relatives 2014
Post by: Maggi Young on August 30, 2015, 12:43:01 PM
An interesting query on a Scilla/Hyacinthella ID  in this thread :
http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=12719.msg339890#msg339890 (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=12719.msg339890#msg339890)  which may tie in to discussions here.
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