Scottish Rock Garden Club Forum
Bulbs => Bulbs General => Topic started by: ashley on January 27, 2013, 04:07:14 PM
-
Hyacinthella heldreichii no data
Muscari azureum ex KPPZ-2241
-
Here Muscari atlanticum RBGG I collected in Corsica starts flowering
Roland
-
Bellevalia sitiaca starts to flower.
It is a very rare, endangered species endemic to Eastern Crete, growing in crevices and rock pockets on high cliffs.
-
Very interesting to see this Oron; thanks.
Is it from seed, and do you find it has any special requirements?
-
Thanks Ashley,
Yes these are from seed, 4 years old , last year i had only one spike which set seeds.
Seeds germinate in a couple of weeks and are fast growing.
I do not treat it in a different way from all my Muscari/Bellevalia group accept it seems to prefer shade.
Probably it is not hardy as it grow at low elevations in the hot, arid part of Crete.
-
Yesterday I went to the Negev Desert to visit a site of Muscari filiforme.
It hasn't flowered in this location for the last 3 years due to the sever drought, but this year after 20mm of water and it is blooming.
-
Oron, thanks to share these photo of plants in habitat, they are very appealing for me
-
Grazie Angelo, mi fa piacere.
Here is Bellevalia desertorum,
it the first Bellevalia species to flower in the desert.
-
Yesterday I went to the Negev Desert to visit a site of Muscari filiforme.
It hasn't flowered in this location for the last 3 years due to the sever drought, but this year after 20mm of water and it is blooming.
Very beautifull! Afraid - will not be hardy here.
Janis
-
Oron,
everytime you post my mouth is wide open ;D ;D
By this cold weather outside, a nice greeting from spring.
-
Here is Bellevalia desertorum,
it the first Bellevalia species to flower in the desert.
Yesterday I went to the Negev Desert to visit a site of Muscari filiforme.
It hasn't flowered in this location for the last 3 years due to the sever drought, but this year after 20mm of water and it is blooming.
"The Living Desert" - thank you, Oron!
Gerd
-
Very nice! Always nice to see a muscari with a rare color.
-
Wonderful species in harsh conditions - seems right for our drought conditions this past 12 months.
-
Thanks every one,
Very beautifull! Afraid - will not be hardy here.
Janis
Janis, i told you already we should swap house and collection... ;)
Oron
-
Thanks every one,
Janis, i told you already we should swap house and collection... ;)
Oron
;) :D ;D :D ;D :'(
Janis
-
Hyacinthella millengresii and H. lineata from the greenhouse today. Lovely little things, but I'm never sure when they are fully open.
-
Yesterday I went to the Negev Desert to visit a site of Muscari filiforme.
It hasn't flowered in this location for the last 3 years due to the sever drought, but this year after 20mm of water and it is blooming.
What a Beauty! Great Pics Oron!
Beautiful Species David! Here H. heldreichii (JJA571.140) and H. lazulina.
-
Could someone tell me the difference between: white rose beauty and white beauty?
and the difference between: pink sunrise, pink sunset and rosy sunrise.
Regards
Erwin
-
Could someone tell me the difference between: white rose beauty and white beauty?
and the difference between: pink sunrise, pink sunset and rosy sunrise.
Regards
Erwin
White-rose Beauty and White Beauty - the same (name White Beauty was applied for it by Michael Hoog because White-rose Beauty not allways in Holland showed pink shade)
Pink Sunrise and Pink Sunset are seedlings of White-rose Beauty - Sunrise is early blooming variety, Sunset - late blooming. Rosy Sunrise - suppose misaplied to one of them or mix of both or someone changed name.
Janis
-
Janis,
Thank you for explaining it to me. I'am surprised by the huge amount of variety in muscari's, didn't know there were so much pink muscari's. I only knew pink sunrise.
Erwin
-
How nice of you, Oron, to share all these unknown treasures with us. Is there a book where we can find them discussed?
-
How nice of you, Oron, to share all these unknown treasures with us. Is there a book where we can find them discussed?
Alberto - I am hoping that these plants will feature in Oron's planned book - I think many of us are waiting eagerly for this!
-
Here H. heldreichii (JJA571.140) and H. lazulina.
Can someone explain the diagnostic distinctions between Hyacinthella heldreichii and H. lazulina?
i have grown both from purchased bulbs and my plants seem to be marked the opposite to Hans' identification.
Thank you
Rimmer
SE Michigan USA
in the deep freeze with no snow cover
-
Great pic of Muscari filiforme . I have seen it in Syria before. Another use and abuse plant. No other way to grow it.
Reichjke
-
Dear Maggi, I am being sarcastic. How long could it take to write a book with a thousand species or so?
-
Thanks every one,
Alberto; good to have you back here... ;)
-
Can someone explain the diagnostic distinctions between Hyacinthella heldreichii and H. lazulina?
Thank you
Rimmer
SE Michigan USA
in the deep freeze with no snow cover
Rimmer, the only visible difference is the color:
H. lazulina heldreichii has a unique, very deep purple/blue color while H. heldreichii lazolina is sky blue with dark blue midrib.
In fact at first H. lazulina was thought to be only a color form of H. heldreichii but chromosome number indicates it to be a different species.
-
Now this is some thing new:
I have received a bulb of this Bellevalia from Janis as Bellevalia sp. RRW9913.
It is doing very well here and has now 5 flower spikes.
After having the exact location from Bob Wallis, it all fitted to Bellevalia densiflora. It is the first time photo of this species is shown. Distributed in NW Syria and NE Lebanon.
This species characterized by very long glaucus leaves [35cm].
Flowers are creamy/yellow and anthers start pale lilac but after few hours they turn yellow which as far as i know is the only Bellevalia species to have yellow anthers.
-
Great pic of Muscari filiforme . I have seen it in Syria before. Another use and abuse plant. No other way to grow it.
Reichjke
Rick,
M. filiforme is endemic to a small area in the Negev desert [S. Israel].
I think you have probably seen Pseudomuscari inconstrictum in Syria, the two species are quite similar.
-
Now this is some thing new:
I have received a bulb of this Bellevalia from Janis as Bellevalia sp. RRW9913.
It is doing very well here and has now 5 flower spikes.
After having the exact location from Bob Wallis, it all fitted to Bellevalia densiflora. It is the first time photo of this species is shown. Distributed in NW Syria and NE Lebanon.
This species characterized by very long glaucus leaves [35cm].
Flowers are creamy/yellow and anthers start pale lilac but after few hours they turn yellow which as far as i know is the only Bellevalia species to have yellow anthers.
This is a slightly odd-looking plant - it is exciting to see it.
-
Rimmer, the only visible difference is the color:
H. lazulina has a unique, very deep purple/blue color while H. heldreichii is sky blue.
In fact at first H. lazulina was thought to be only a color form of H. heldreichii but chromosome number indicates it to be a different species.
Thanks Oron, is the attached picture correctly identified as H. lazulina?
Rimmer
-
Wow, that is a fantastic colour - so intense. :o
-
Rimmer - I think it is correct, apologies for the picture of H. lazulina I posted earlier - I took it with flashlight - without flashlight (but a bit out of focus) it looks similar to yours.
Oron - I know H. heldreichii as deep (violet) blue. ::)
( like this: http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=2883.msg82882#msg82882 (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=2883.msg82882#msg82882) )
-
Rimmer - I think it is correct, apologies for the picture of H. lazulina I posted earlier - I took it with flashlight - without flashlight (but a bit out of focus) it looks similar to yours.
Oron - I know H. heldreichii as deep (violet) blue. ::)
( like this: http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=2883.msg82882#msg82882 (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=2883.msg82882#msg82882) )
Thanks Hans!
I caused a confusion here,
here is how it meant to be:
Rimmer, the only visible difference is the color:
H. lazulina heldreichii has a unique, very deep purple/blue color while H. heldreichii lazolina is sky blue with dark blue midrib.
In fact at first H. lazulina was thought to be only a color form of H. heldreichii but chromosome number indicates it to be a different species.
-
Thanks for your help
Oron, your original post corresponded with my labeling from well know suppliers but your correction has really confused me.
i have Hyacinthella lazulina as the intense deep purple blue color and H. heldreichii as the one with a darker mid rib
is the difference only from DNA or are there some other field attributes to distinguish between the two other than color?
i included 2 photos from last April of what i thought was H. heldreichii showing the dark mid rib with some sun back light- grown in a cold frame
and one photo of Hyacinthella lazulina with glaucous leaves almost prostrate against the soil- grown in a pot in a foam fish box in the open (last winter was not a winter here)
Rimmer
SE Michigan
USA Zone 5
-
I have received a bulb of this Bellevalia from Janis as Bellevalia sp. RRW9913.
After having the exact location from Bob Wallis, it all fitted to Bellevalia densiflora. It is the first time photo of this species is shown. Distributed in NW Syria and NE Lebanon.
Many thanks Oron for identification.
Janis
-
Rimmer,
The color seems to be the only visible difference. As such i think it is problematic to decide by the photos as the Blue color changes much from one camera to the other and appear differently according to light level.
Also we need to consider that with in each population there are darker and lighter color forms.
There are other samples like this where not knowing the original location there is no way you can tell which species it is, such in the Oncocyclus Iris, Romulea and others.
Probably if you put the two species side by side it would be easier to distinguish.
The leaves of both are mostly flat on the ground unless they grow in the shade of a rock etc. then they will be erect as they look for the sun.
-
Muscari adilii as offered by Paul Christian in frame today open to out side temps
Rimmer
-
That s soooo different to mine Rimmer
(http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w481/davey1970/DSCF1859_zps42559fe8.jpg)
-
And a few more.
muscari leucostomum from RRW Collection
(http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w481/davey1970/DSCF1854_zps52e9ebf5.jpg)
muscari coeleste
(http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w481/davey1970/DSCF1860_zpsce0b4b91.jpg)
-
That s soooo different to mine
Davey yours is much farther along and has a bi colour.
mine is just emerging from dormancy
Last year this bulb did not have bi color. the seed pod appears the same as shown in Janis Ruksans Buried Treasures book.
-
I can't remember if mine has swollen pods i think it does,in any case you have super plants
-
My Muscari adilii from Paul Christian also have relative large seed pods, but it looks quite different from M. adilii from Janis Ruksans.
Poul
-
Some other Muscari:
Muscari coeleste
Muscari azureum
Muscari aucheri 'Autumn Glory' with two flowers. The first appeared in October and now another flower is appearing. (Which is normal for this selection)
Poul
-
My Muscari adilii from Paul Christian also have relative large seed pods, but it looks quite different from M. adilii from Janis Ruksans.
and Davey- isn't your plant there the one identified a couple of years ago as NOT being M. adillii?
Janis' as shown here http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=2883.msg87321#msg87321 (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=2883.msg87321#msg87321)
( other examples are to be found in the forum) are, I think, from the locus classicus and are identical to those seen shown in slides by Prof. Guner.
-
Maggie you are right but i showed Ray Cobb it (he has a very large muscari collection)he said it was identical to his,he received his from the chap who discovered the species,all Ray said was has it got inflated seed pods as well and it does ,maybe this sp isn't as uniform as we think,maybe Janis's is just a super form of the sp,my plant is not labeled as adilii but ex pc.Either that or PC is keeping his muscari to close and they are interbreeding and our plants are results of this mess.
The problem is there is no monograph,i have the original paper coming to me from adilii but like with everything we all presume from a described specimen that the sp is the same as this one and that its only found in a small area untill its discovered in a new place.
-
Davey, I am always prepared to believe that any species is MUCH more variable than we sometimes imagine - to think otherwise is foolhardy, I'm sure ;)
But my recollection of the plants shown by Prof. Guner ( the plant was found by his son, I think) and, I think, of the written description, (which I cannot lay hands upon right now) sticks in my mind as the type shown by Janis so I'm having a tough time getting past that !
-
Maggie i am no PC fan as you know :)
-
Of interest : these watercolours by Prof. Guner's daughter...
http://www.isikguner.com/eng/muscari.html (http://www.isikguner.com/eng/muscari.html)
-
Of interest : these watercolours by Prof. Guner's daughter...
http://www.isikguner.com/eng/muscari.html (http://www.isikguner.com/eng/muscari.html)
Very nice Maggie, thanks
The problem is there is no monograph,i have the original paper coming to me from adilii
Can this paper be made available?
Thanks
Rimmer
-
I decided to cut a flower of Muscari leucostomum(which is what i was told my adilii was) and my ex PC'adilii' to compare flower morphology.What do people think.I know what i think.
(http://i1078.photobucket.com/albums/w481/davey1970/DSCF21352_zpsa72c4964.jpg)
not forgetting the leaf and whole plant is very different as well.
-
I've resized the photo a bit, Davey.....
[attachimg=1]
-
Thank you Maggie ;D ;D ;D Thats a lot better
-
Very nice Maggie, thanks
Can this paper be made available?
Thanks
Rimmer
Can I ask for a copy too?
Poul
-
My Muscari adilii from Paul Christian also have relative large seed pods, but it looks quite different from M. adilii from Janis Ruksans.
Poul
I don't know origin of PC plant, but mine is 100% true, collected just on point from where it is described. Collected were seeds because there are only several tenth of specimens in wild at locus classicus. It is rarest Muascari species with fat spikes and large seed pods.
Janis
-
and Davey- isn't your plant there the one identified a couple of years ago as NOT being M. adillii?
Janis' as shown here http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=2883.msg87321#msg87321 (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=2883.msg87321#msg87321)
( other examples are to be found in the forum) are, I think, from the locus classicus and are identical to those seen shown in slides by Prof. Guner.
On this entry plants with seed pods are pictured in locus classicus, those in flowers - in my nursery. It is one of plants about introduction of which I'm very proud. At first - it is growing in spot not easy to find and reach. Second - now it is safe in nature, because it well established in cultivation and it is much easier to receive it from nursery than to search in nature. So natural population is almost 100% protected. And the third - it is one of most beautiful Muscari sp. seen by me.
Janis
-
Of interest : these watercolours by Prof. Guner's daughter...
http://www.isikguner.com/eng/muscari.html (http://www.isikguner.com/eng/muscari.html)
Thanks, Maggi for nice drawings. As you can see they looks identical with mine by shape of flower scape.
Regarding original paper with description - I haven't it present, but we had it during our trip with us and, pity, there were too detailed information about locality, so it was not so difficult to check spot by GPS and by derscription of locality. We passed half day serching for other spots in proximity but without results. Now botanists not more gives so detailed coordinates about new species - just for protection of natural populations. I'm now preparing description of 6 new crocuses but localities is hided in same way as it is done by Erich Pasche.
Janis
-
Maggie you are right but i showed Ray Cobb it (he has a very large muscari collection)he said it was identical to his,he received his from the chap who discovered the species,all Ray said was has it got inflated seed pods as well and it does ,maybe this sp isn't as uniform as we think,maybe Janis's is just a super form of the sp,my plant is not labeled as adilii but ex pc.Either that or PC is keeping his muscari to close and they are interbreeding and our plants are results of this mess.
The problem is there is no monograph,i have the original paper coming to me from adilii but like with everything we all presume from a described specimen that the sp is the same as this one and that its only found in a small area untill its discovered in a new place.
Dave, now I have blooming plants of second generation from seeds received here - they all looks identical, so I don't think that there some hybridising occurs.
Janis
-
I don't know origin of PC plant, but mine is 100% true, collected just on point from where it is described. Collected were seeds because there are only several tenth of specimens in wild at locus classicus. It is rarest Muascari species with fat spikes and large seed pods.
Janis
In his catalogue PC says it is collected close to locus classicus.
Last year my adilii ex PC had a much denser flower spike. I am afraid it went to dormancy too early due to lack of watering, resulting in a smaller flower spike this year. But anyway it was never as fat as adilii ex JR, which I believe is the true species.
Poul
-
Janis i wasn't accusing your stock of hybridising :-[ ,What i will say i dont think PC's plant is leucostomum (not yet untill i get more plant material).
-
Just to add to this three pics the first two are identical to my plant the second pic you can see the plants aren't all uniform plants with a good packed flower stem like Janis's and other plants that aren't, like mine
https://picasaweb.google.com/100501315290075619302/LiliaceaeZambakgiller#5247677412331178498 (https://picasaweb.google.com/100501315290075619302/LiliaceaeZambakgiller#5247677412331178498)
https://picasaweb.google.com/100501315290075619302/LiliaceaeZambakgiller#5247677426046344914 (https://picasaweb.google.com/100501315290075619302/LiliaceaeZambakgiller#5247677426046344914)
https://picasaweb.google.com/100501315290075619302/LiliaceaeZambakgiller#5247677453832527778 (https://picasaweb.google.com/100501315290075619302/LiliaceaeZambakgiller#5247677453832527778)
And here
http://www.turkiyebitkileri.com/english/species-detail.aspx?ID=3230#.UT5FuBzxq3w (http://www.turkiyebitkileri.com/english/species-detail.aspx?ID=3230#.UT5FuBzxq3w)
-
Very interesting discussion ;)
Muscari leucostomum, JJA 689.851
Muscari azureum, JJA 688.205
-
Janis i wasn't accusing your stock of hybridising :-[ ,What i will say i don't think PC's plant is leucostomum (not yet until i get more plant material).
M. leucostomum is variable and very widespread species. I have several stocks of it from various localities. Its spikes are darker and always slender, whilst adilii is very "fat". I don't know source of PC. We were 4 persons in our team - 2 from Gothenburg and 2 from Latvia. I never sent something to PC, from rest 2 denied any contact with him, too. About third - I don't know. May be he is one of PC suppliers.
To find adilii really was not easy - windy and branching dirty roads inside mountains. At each junction discussion and sometimes even voting which turn to take. We found it starting search very close to known GPS coordinates (but in those years GPS was much less accurate). Passed several hours, before I saw first tiny leaf of it and soon in minor gully on steep slope were few plants in seed confirming species. Later Arnis found another one similar minor gully with another few plants. Going down to road we spotted very special mark of locality mentioned in original description. This confirmed that our plant is true (growing some 2-3 hundred meters higher on slope from this mark, as was mentioned in original text).
There are still some undescribed very beautiful Muscari sp. between gatherings of our team during two field seasons in Turkey. I'm not so clever in Muscari, so I'm not ready to describe them. May be sometimes later, together with few other beautiful bulbs. By the way - during those trips we discovered Tulipa koyuncii, described much later by Turkish botanists, too. Only Arnis then collected some bulb, although we saw that it is new one, but... Colchicum lagotis described by Karin Person was found just by our team, too.
Janis
-
Sounds very exciting story, Janis :D :D :D
There are still some undescribed very beautiful Muscari sp. between gatherings of our team during two field seasons in Turkey.
When will they be available at your nursery ??? ;D
-
Sounds very exciting story, Janis :D :D :D
When will they be available at your nursery ??? ;D
When they will be named. One may be will be named by Arnis but he is allways short in time for this. I haven't time for Muscari studies, too. Another (good increaser) may be will be offered in few years as species nova by me. Still multiplying stock.
Janis
-
I must keep away from this thread lest I develop a "thing" about Muscari
-
http://home.tiscali.nl/~hennessy/ Muscari site by Martin Philippo
A labour of love! A wonderful Site and a wonderful resource.
edit by maggi add url
-
nice site Ron. I do actually have a few, M. Golden Fragrance, the "usual" M. macrocarpum and M. muscarimi. But I must admit some of these others are tempting.
-
nice site Ron. I do actually have a few, M. Golden Fragrance, the "usual" M. macrocarpum and M. muscarimi. But I must admit some of these others are tempting.
Do it Mark i think they are superb and never take up to much room.
-
well space is my issue and I'm constantly rotating plants around - small things are definately what I need to go for.
-
Muscari armeniacum, ex. pink form. JJA 688.012. :)
-
that's lovely.
-
Muscari armeniacum, ex. pink form. JJA 688.012. :)
Another charming plant from you, Tatsuo. I have added it to the Archibald Archive section.
-
Tatsuo,
is it normal that the foliage lies on the ground?
edit by maggi - I have removed your double post, Uli.
-
Thanks Mark :)
Tatsuo,
is it normal that the foliage lies on the ground?
Yes, Uli. Its leaves undulate and prostrate on the surface.
Another charming plant from you, Tatsuo. I have added it to the Archibald Archive section.
Thank you Maggi ;)
-
Tatsuo's picture must be the same as this plant in the garden from Rannveig Wallis, Muscari armeniacum 'Gul', which presumably originated from the JJA collection. As details of these Muscari proliferate, I imagine the chance of a monograph recedes, but it would be extremely interesting, along with related groups. In the garden they have always been quite neglected bulbs, with people just thinking of the weedy species. I've always thought they complement other bulbs perfectly.
-
Some other Muscari:
Muscari coeleste
Muscari azureum
Muscari aucheri 'Autumn Glory' with two flowers. The first appeared in October and now another flower is appearing. (Which is normal for this selection)
Poul
A note I received from Ray Cobb about M.aucheri Autumn Glory
'Muscari ‘Autumn Glory’ was selected by me from a group of muscaris given to me by Ron Ginns and which flowered intermittently between October and January, The selection was made in an attempt to produce a clone which flowered reliably in October. This was unsuccessful and Autumn Glory flowers at any time during the late Autumn or early Winter probably depending on the weather in the previous Summer.
The un-cloned population has been supplied to a bulb nursery and I am proposing the name ‘Winter Cheer’ It was said at the time that it had been collected in the wild and is M. aucheri but I think it may be M aucheri x armeniacum.'
-
A note I received from Ray Cobb about M.aucheri Autumn Glory
'Muscari ‘Autumn Glory’ was selected by me from a group of muscaris given to me by Ron Ginns and which flowered intermittently between October and January, The selection was made in an attempt to produce a clone which flowered reliably in October. This was unsuccessful and Autumn Glory flowers at any time during the late Autumn or early Winter probably depending on the weather in the previous Summer.
The un-cloned population has been supplied to a bulb nursery and I am proposing the name ‘Winter Cheer’ It was said at the time that it had been collected in the wild and is M. aucheri but I think it may be M aucheri x armeniacum.'
Tony, thank you for the information! There is very little information to find about this selection so I am grateful for your posting.
I read about Autumn Glory in Rod Leeds book Autumn Bulbs several years ago, and had tried to get hold of it for long time.
Two years ago I got two bulbs from Ray Cobb via a generous forumist. Until now they have flowered reliably in October and again in spring. Martin Philippo (Muscari pages) has told me that the ones he has tried only flowered the first autumn.
Maybe the weather in Denmark suit them better. Anyway I hope they will continue flowering in the autumn.
I have been pollinating them without any luck every year, so maybe it is a sterile hybrid as Ray suggest.
Here is the spring flower as it look today.
Poul
-
Pics from today: Muscari adilii from Janis Ruksans and Paul Christian
Poul
-
Pics from today: Muscari adilii from Janis Ruksans and Paul Christian
Poul
They are too different. I don't think that PC plant is true to name.
Janis
-
Any thoughts on these two muscari
Third photo is Hyacinthella lazuluna
-
Hyacinthella acutiloba
-
Hyacinthella acutiloba
This looks like what I know as H dalmatica.
-
very nice Ebbie, thanks for sharing.
-
Any thoughts on these two muscari
Third photo is Hyacinthella lazuluna
Couldn't the first one be Muscari leucostomum / neglectum?
http://home.tiscali.nl/hennessy/Species%20and%20cultivars.htm (http://home.tiscali.nl/hennessy/Species%20and%20cultivars.htm)
I have a similar one, and another unknown.
Poul
-
Poul, that second one looks interesting - will you post another pic when it gets a little more developed?
-
Surely I will Mark. I find it interesting too. It is a new one I got last autumn.
Poul
-
Hyacinthella acutiloba
Hyacinthella acutiloba from a bulb from RR Wallis
this is a bit less stout than Ebbie's plants
Hyacinthella dalmatica grandiflora will bloom in a week or so and it is stout like Ebbie's plants
-
Look Rimmer, so sees my Hyacinthella acutiloba out today. Do you mean it's really Hyacinthella dalmatica? I think it's possible, but I'm not a specialist.
Please show your Hyacinthella dalmatica when it blooms.
-
Hi Ebbie,
my H dalmatica blooms a few weeks later than H. actiloba but these two are very similar.
the H. dalmatica is like a miniature dutch hybrid hyacinth with a strong stem while the Hyacinthella acutiloba has a tread like stem similar to most hyacinthella.
there is a possibility that what i have is a hybrid !? it originally came from Monocot Nursery
attached is a picture of it today followed by a photos of it blooming last March (spring was early last year)
-
Poul, that second one looks interesting - will you post another pic when it gets a little more developed?
Here it is
Poul
-
And a few more
Muscari armenaicum 'Gül'
Muscari leucostomum
-
Hi Ebbie,
my H dalmatica blooms a few weeks later than H. actiloba but these two are very similar.
the H. dalmatica is like a miniature dutch hybrid hyacinth with a strong stem while the Hyacinthella acutiloba has a tread like stem similar to most hyacinthella.
there is a possibility that what i have is a hybrid !? it originally came from Monocot Nursery
attached is a picture of it today followed by a photos of it blooming last March (spring was early last year)
Hi Rimmer, yes, the plants are rather similar. But Hyacinthella dalmatica seems to me have clearly broader leaves. In this respect, is my plant like your Hyacinthella acutiloba.
-
Ebbie
you are probably correct, you have a very nice form!
Rimmer
-
Muscari season in my greenhouse only starts.
The first was Muscari anatolicum - very beautiful form from Turkey
I'm still wondering - will be seedlings of this Muscari discolor with same shape of flowers or not? Seeds are sawn, but not blooming yet. I decided to cut this bulb this summer to increase it.
Muscari coeleste has very nice shade - stock comes from Gothenburg BG and was collected in Turkey during their first expedition there.
This Muscari pseudomuscari has somwething similar colour. It comes from Iran.
And as last - selection of mysterious Caucasian muscari made by Augis Dambrauskas in Lithuania. It is virus free stock (most of stocks of this strange species now are virus-infected)
-
Very nice Janis. My M. anatolicum (seed from Jim Archibald) is much paler but otherwise similar .
-
Very nice Janis. My M. anatolicum (seed from Jim Archibald) is much paler but otherwise similar .
SASA - Stevens (Norman), Archibald (Jim), Seisums Arnis
-
M. anatolicum JJA0687950 from Sultan Dag, Konya, 1,700m
Bellevalia dubia JJA0227702 from Castel Mola, Sicily (x2)
M. commutatum ? from near Mistra, Peloponnese
-
Sunny days and freezing nights - it's a cruel spring for everyone/everything this year.
I need your help to identify a Hyacinthella I grow outside in a cold frame..
The first picture was taken almost a month ago but since then we have had frost every night and most of the days so not until today it started to open its buds.
-
Lovely plants Gunilla. They look like Muscari azureum to me.
-
The seed packet was labeled Hyacinthella lineata but I agree with you Ashley, they look like Muscari azureum. Thanks.
-
Bellevalia rixii and another picture of Muscari discolor which I named "sausage form"
-
Janis you do have some beautiful bulbs. I do like the sausage form.
-
Some more muscari, blooming now:
The first is Muscari polyanthum, regarded as sinonim of M. armeniacum in Flora of Turkey but by my opinion it is sufficiently different both by habitat and plant dimensions. M. polyanthum has much wider leaves than M. armeniacum. This form is very early blooming and I got it from Czech collector.
Next is Muscari inconstrictum WHIR-174 - collected by me in NW Iran, near Iraq border.
Follows Muscari species LST-296 collected in NE Turkey at around 3000 m altitude by Arnis Seisums. He think that it is new species. He braught down 3 different Muscari at this mountain ridge. This one is earliest.
Muscari sp. RIGA-014 was collected in S Turkey during my first trip there (together with Arnis and our wifes).
-
A follow up to a thread on Hyacinthella from a month ago, now that my season has caught up with the others.
H. heldrechii from Janis bloomed deep violet purple with a deeper coloured mid rid, and relaibely wide leaves exactly like the bulb from PC marked H. lazulina
H. lazulina ex RRW bloomed a light azure blue colour with narrow leaves.
So it looks like the PC plants are H. heldreichii not lazulina as offered.
A photo is attached showing the RRW lazulina plant in front of the PC plant not "H. lazulina"
and a close up of H. heldreichii from JR
-
Following up on the progress of Muscari adilii
here is my plant from PC blooming today in the open frame (under snow flurries)
the plant tends to be prostrate with the stems bending to the ground as well as the leaves.
-
The attached photo is the first blooming of Hyacinthella atcheyi NARGS 2008 seed #1589
These were grown in the the cold frame and have not been moved in years, except for squirrels planting black walnuts in the pots.
The largest plant has leaf streaks. can anyone tell me if the leaf streaks are from the cold, squirrel activity or a virus?
Thank you
Rimmer
-
Hyacinthella millegrenii from RRW
nice blue flowers short to no pedicils, thin stem, narrow glaucous leaves
is there a book or paper that describes all these various Hyacinthella?
without the labels from the source and photos form others to compare to i find it very difficult to identify these plants
Thanks
Rimmer
-
is there a book or paper that describes all these various Hyacinthella?
without the labels from the source and photos form others to compare to i find it very difficult to identify these plants
Thanks
Rimmer
Rimmer, I think the general difficulty in naming these plants can e shown very well by the fact that the RHS trial of these plants was simply named the trial of "little blue bulbs" !!
http://apps.rhs.org.uk/planttrials/TrialReports/Hyacinthaceae%20hardy%202003.pdf (http://apps.rhs.org.uk/planttrials/TrialReports/Hyacinthaceae%20hardy%202003.pdf)
https://www.rhs.org.uk/Plants/PDFs/Plant-trials-and-awards/Plant-bulletins/hyacinthaceae (https://www.rhs.org.uk/Plants/PDFs/Plant-trials-and-awards/Plant-bulletins/hyacinthaceae)
-
Maggie
thank you so much for this paper!!!!
most appreciated
Rimmer
-
Following up on the progress of Muscari adilii
here is my plant from PC blooming today in the open frame (under snow flurries)
the plant tends to be prostrate with the stems bending to the ground as well as the leaves.
If the colour is correct, it don't look as adilii.
-
Thank you Maggie for the paper :). Very useful.
A white form of Hyacinthoides italica is mentioned in the paper. I have been searching this white form for many years. Anyone know where it can be found ?
-
Thank you Maggie for the paper :). Very useful.
A white form of Hyacinthoides italica is mentioned in the paper. I have been searching this white form for many years. Anyone know where it can be found ?
I read somewhere the white Hyacinthoides italica may be the same thing as what Janis offers as Scilla bifolia alba.
http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=10151.msg273444#msg273444 (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=10151.msg273444#msg273444)
In Janis 2010 catalogue (last time item listed) Janis mentioned that his white Scilla bifolia 'Alba" fits the description of Hyacinthoides italica because of two minor bracts at the base of the pedicels where Scilla have only one or no bracts. But since it looks so much like Scilla bifolia by flowers and bulbs he lists it as Scilla bifolia.
This plant from Janis grows to a max of 15cm in my garden and cold frame, but some descriptions of Hyacinthoides italica in the web state 20-50cm.
http://www.buytech.biz/acatalog/Online_Catalogue_HYACINTHOIDES_1173.html (http://www.buytech.biz/acatalog/Online_Catalogue_HYACINTHOIDES_1173.html)
it is a good increaser and very floriferous, one of my favorites!
comments welcome!!
Rimmer
-
Hyacinthoides italica grow in many old gardens here and increase very well and are about 20-30 cm high. My favorites as well even if they can be a little weedy.
The Scilla bifolia 'Alba' I grow are much smaller.
1. Hyacinthoides italica
2. Scilla bifolia 'Alba'
-
This plant has just started flowering in my garden. I bought the bulbs as Bellevalia paradoxa but am pretty sure it is a Muscari. Does anyone know which species?
-
For those anywhere near Norfolk, Richard Hobbs' National Collection of Muscari is open on Sunday from 11 - 4
Featured in The Garden last year, Richard and Sally's small garden has a wide range of rare and unusual plants of great interest such as species tulips, daffodils, scillas, dog's tooth violets, many more bulbous plants and an abundance of trilliums and wood anemones. Within the garden the National Collection of Muscari is held. Entrance £3 for NGS
Event Location: 16, Witton Lane, Little Plumstead NR13 5DL
I was there yesterday taking Herbarium specimens with our Plant Heritage group and there were some super muscari to be seen.
-
For those anywhere near Norfolk, Richard Hobbs' National Collection of Muscari is open on Sunday from 11 - 4
Featured in The Garden last year, Richard and Sally's small garden has a wide range of rare and unusual plants of great interest such as species tulips, daffodils, scillas, dog's tooth violets, many more bulbous plants and an abundance of trilliums and wood anemones. Within the garden the National Collection of Muscari is held. Entrance £3 for NGS
Event Location: 16, Witton Lane, Little Plumstead NR13 5DL
I was there yesterday taking Herbarium specimens with our Plant Heritage group and there were some super muscari to be seen.
Oh! I would love to be able to attend that Open Day - Muscari are something I get very confused about identifying -the little blue bulb question! To see the collection would be most instructive, I'm sure. I'll bet there are plenty here who would really like to be able to study even photographs of the plants.
-
Tony, thank you for the information! There is very little information to find about this selection so I am grateful for your posting.
I read about Autumn Glory in Roy Leeds book Autumn Bulbs several years ago, and had tried to get hold of it for long time.
Two years ago I got two bulbs from Ray Cobb via a generous forumist. Until now they have flowered reliably in October and again in spring. Martin Philippo (Muscari pages) has told me that the ones he has tried only flowered the first autumn.
Maybe the weather in Denmark suit them better. Anyway I hope they will continue flowering in the autumn.
I have been pollinating them without any luck every year, so maybe it is a sterile hybrid as Ray suggest.
Here is the spring flower as it look today.
Poul
I have to correct myself - now seed pods are forming, so it isn't sterile! :D
It will be exciting to see how seedlings will perform. Hopefully they keep the autumn flowering habit.
Poul
-
Lost label Muscari - can anyone identify?
-
To my mind the first is Muscari macrocarpum, the second and the fourth are Muscari latifolium. It is difficult to say based on the picture what the third is, as there are a lot of the similar type.
-
To my mind the first is Muscari macrocarpum, the second and the fourth are Muscari latifolium. It is difficult to say based on the picture what the third is, as there are a lot of the similar type.
Thanks. the third one is a nice powder blue. Found some dislodged labels nearby: Muscari latifolium, Muscari tubergenianum and Muscari ambrosiacum.Could picture three be one of these?
-
Muscari would make a great subject for a small booklet like Plant Heritage have produced on other genera - having looked through this thread they really grow on you; even species like neglectum can look wonderful seeding around in short turf. Has anyone succeed in growing Bellevalia forniculata in the garden? Plants I had of this from JJA seed have not persisted, but it is an astonishing colour.
-
If it is one of the three I would say it is Muscari tubergenianum
-
If it is one of the three I would say it is Muscari tubergenianum
Yes, it certainly looks like the pictures of that on Google.
-
Glad they have been sorted out
-
Hi Tim,
Bellevalia forniculata grows fine out here in the open garden, setting seed but the bulbs don't multiply just get bigger.
When you look at the picture in Janis's book you see that Henrick is walking in his bare feet. They were growing in a wet meadow, maybe that is why we have no problem growing them ;) Susan
-
Can anyone identify this Bellevaria? This is Peter Korn's photo, he posted it on Facebook, and we were texting about what species it might be.
-
It looks like the usual form of Bellevalia romana to me Mark.
-
Thanks Ashley, that was Peter's guess as well.
-
Muscari armeniacum 'Valerie Finnis'
-
Muscari muscarimi
-
Finally good flowers
I found these at Cape Corse in Corsica 2010
Roland
-
Interesting white comosum Roland 8)
Here:
Bellevalia forniculata JJA 0227770
Bellevalia romana
-
Muscari argaei
M. comosum from Greece, Delphi. Thanks Tony.
M. neglectum from Spain, Palencia, Aguilar de Campóo
M. pallens
-
Ashley I first saw Bellevalia forniculata at Tallin Botanic and that wonderful shade of blue fairly shone and made the bed look wonderful.
-
I like it too Shelagh; it's almost a kingfisher blue.
Unfortunately this plant doesn't bulk up, with me anyway, so I'll need to sow more seed to have enough for the garden.
-
Grown from AGS seed ex seed labeled as Muscari bourgaei
(AGS 2010 #4129)
3-4 inches tall,
can anyone confirm its identity?
Thank Rimmer
-
Bellevalia crassa and B. forniculata colour forms.
-
Two similar looking muscaris:
-Muscari mirum
-Muscari massayanum
-
There are two forms of Muscari massayanum. By late Jim Archibald true massayanum comes from Čiftehan (first two pictuires). Another form was collected by our team during BATM and LST trips (next two pictures). On last picture very pretty white Muscari of Leopoldia group collected by me somewhere in Iran (WHIR) but its number was lost and so I don't know from where just it comes.
-
Nice to see Janis 8)
I have young plants of an Archibald collection so look forward to seeing them flower in a year or two.
With such a constricted mouth I wonder what the pollinator is?
-
Nice to see Janis 8)
I have young plants of an Archibald collection so look forward to seeing them flower in a year or two.
With such a constricted mouth I wonder what the pollinator is?
I saw bees and bumblebees on them, but I use tooth stick, slightly unsharpened and moistured by saliva.
-
Janis
Your unidentified muscari in my opinion is an albino form of Leopoldia comosa [syn M. comosum] unless it has different leaves...?
-
Here is a field of Bellevalia forniculata of which i took a photo two days ago in the Paladonken mountains not far from Erzurum.
-
Well that puts my efforts in context ::) ;D Thanks Oron; a wonderful sight 8)
Thanks too Janis for your comments on M. massayanum pollination.
-
:D
Here is a field of Bellevalia forniculata of which i took a photo two days ago in the Paladonken mountains not far from Erzurum.
Phantastic view! I was there 3 times and never at so good blooming - allways a little late, after culmination of blooming.
-
Can someone identify these for me
http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=10531.0 (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=10531.0)
-
Leopoldia comosa White Wave collected in Corsica
Roland
-
Muscari dionysiacum
large plants are old mature bulbs from Dix Export, the clump of smaller plants is first year blooming seedlings from the parent plants.
these have the leaf tip caps.
-
Muscari commosum from seed ex seed
these are smaller plants than Muscari dionysiacum and seem less showy and do not have the leaf tip caps
Rimmer
-
wow Oron, incredible pic.
Question for people, is M. massayanum scented?
-
Two new muscari flowering for the first time from seed;
Muscari inconstrictum from AGS Seedex 2009
Muscari commutatum? from Goteborg ?2010?
cheers
fermi
-
This Muscari azureum seems to have a two tone effect as the flowers age.
Is this typical?
cheers
fermi
-
Here's a little group of seedlings ex Muscari 'Valerie Finnis'
cheers
fermi
-
Muscari muscarimi is just starting to open its flowers
cheers
fermi
-
This Muscari azureum seems to have a two tone effect as the flowers age.
Is this typical?
cheers
fermi
Fermi, my azureum are more uniform in colour and of a lighter blue shade.
Lovely Valerie Finnis seedlings with an interesting variation!
Poul
-
Fermi, my azureum are more uniform in colour and of a lighter blue
Poul
Hi Poul,
I wonder is this is a hybrid?
Or just a variation?
cheers
fermi
-
Fermi, it could be a variation, there are many similar two tone azureum when you search the Web.
Poul
-
After a week they are no longer two-toned!
Completely dark purply-blue now,
cheers
fermi
-
Muscari weissii in the Rock garden almost smothered by Allium and California Poppy! - sorry, pic missing!
Muscari pallens in a pot
cheers
fermi
edit by Maggi - sorry fermi, the weissii picture has not loaded..... please try again :D
-
Thanks, Maggi,
pic re-loaded!
cheers
fermi
-
I took this pic just over a week ago - the last flowers on Muscari caucasicum - it seems very similar to M. weissii but flowers a bit later and is a bit shorter (though it is in a pot, not in the ground);
Can anyone say if it is definitely different?
cheers
fermi