Scottish Rock Garden Club Forum
Specific Families and Genera => Amaryllidaceae => Topic started by: Angelo Porcelli on January 19, 2013, 09:28:25 AM
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As antipicated, the New Year starts with some nice plants here, the last two Sternbergia species.
Sternbergia candida, hasn't reach its peak yet, I find this species very slow to increase.
Now I would like to start a discussion about S. fischeriana, now renamed S. vernalis.
I have two forms of this species, one with dull green leaves, which I see is the oone most of you show in photos and another with gray leaves. The gray form is undoubtely a great performer, at least in my climate, this year I think I have got the maximum result, yesterday I counted 46 open flowers and there are a lot of small buds. This form flower well above the leaves, which are rather short at this time, but they grow long later resembling truly a Narcissus . The green one instead has short stemmed flowers which are the same height of the leaves, so flowering is less showy, not only this but the size of the flowers are about half those of the gray form. Of course that clump of gray form is 10 years old, the green ones are much younger, but even when single head bulbs the gray form has been always better.
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Another interesting feature I have noticed is the difference in setting fruits of the two forms. The gray one bears the pod in axis with the peduncle, laying it on the ground as usual, but the green one instead developes the pod at almost right angle to the peduncle, looking like a Galanthus and it lay to the ground that way.
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Fantastic show Angelo! :o
Here a picture of my green S. fischeriana - the greyish plant in front was given to me also as S. fischeriana - but as it flowers in November without leaves and it looks very much like S.clusiana I think it is not.
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As antipicated, the New Year starts with some nice plants here, the last two Sternbergia species.
Sternbergia candida, hasn't reach its peak yet, I find this species very slow to increase.
Now I would like to start a discussion about S. fischeriana, now renamed S. vernalis.
I have two forms of this species, one with dull green leaves, which I see is the oone most of you show in photos and another with gray leaves. The gray form is undoubtely a great performer, at least in my climate, this year I think I have got the maximum result, yesterday I counted 46 open flowers and there are a lot of small buds. This form flower well above the leaves, which are rather short at this time, but they grow long later resembling truly a Narcissus . The green one instead has short stemmed flowers which are the same height of the leaves, so flowering is less showy, not only this but the size of the flowers are about half those of the gray form. Of course that clump of gray form is 10 years old, the green ones are much younger, but even when single head bulbs the gray form has been always better.
What a wonderfull Sternbergia show
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Here S. candida blooming, 2 weeks ahead of last year.
John B
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Angelo,
Very impressive show!
The grey S. vernalis is very interesting. If you have some spare bulbs when you replant I will be very interested in buying/swapping a bulb.
Poul
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S. vernalis
Typo PeHe ??
R
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S. vernalis
Typo PeHe ??
R
http://citesbulbs.myspecies.info/category/sternbergia/sternbergia-vernalis (http://citesbulbs.myspecies.info/category/sternbergia/sternbergia-vernalis)
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Thanks Maggie
learning every day :D
Roland
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Ah, Roland, my problem is though I learn every day, I then forget every other day! :-X
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Same problem here
luckily there are computer to store all that info
and Fora to search
How did they do that 30 years ago ???
Roland
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Same problem here
luckily there are computer to store all that info
and Fora to search
How did they do that 30 years ago ???
Roland
Moi aussi. Shoeboxes and post cards-couldn't find a thing then, can't find a thing now ::)
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Here S. candida blooming, 2 weeks ahead of last year.
John B
Hi John,
do you grow S. candida outside in Kansas? Or is it in a greenhouse?
Matt
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Hi Matt. It is out in the ground. Poked up in early December and we have been down
in the lows teen's F a few times since and 20"s quite a bit. But up in the 50"s F at least
once every week.
John B
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Hi John,
Thank you for the reply.
I wasn't imagining S. candida to be as hardy. Few times at -10C and several times at -5C would easily kill any tender-ish bulb (or at least freeze the flowers!).
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I would say pretty hardy. No snow cover at all. Here is a pic of my place, the S. candida
is behind the old boiler tub behind the street sign. Not much protection.
John B
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Sternbergia candida
This year the flowers are somewhat smaller than usual.
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Sternbergia candida
This year the flowers are somewhat smaller than usual.
Still a very good clump though, Gerry!
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Thanks Maggi. "Can do better" as my old Latin master used to say.
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Stil great to see Gerry .
And now .....Sternbergia for beginners .... ;D
After the magnificent clumps..... I show you the first time flowering here of Sternbergia vernalis ....
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nice to see them flowering in your countries. BTW, mine are still in flower ! :)
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BTW, mine are still in flower ! :)
Still??!! Wow! :o 8)
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Sternbergia candida
This year the flowers are somewhat smaller than usual.
But a little smaller than usual is still much better than no flowers!
Mine grow and increase well but I'm afraid there will be no flowers this year (as usual, I'm tempted to say). As a consequence of that, I have split them up last summer. Some were planted in the best spot in my garden, some I have in a 11 cm Long Tom pot and some in a standard 9 cm pot. All will be heavily feed this year. Hopefully that will result in some flowers next year.
Poul
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Yes Maggi, they put new buds over the weeks, some flowers a bit spoiled by the rains.
About the size of the flowers, years ago when I got the first flowering of these species I was quite disappointed, they were rather small compared with my large-flowered clones of lutea. So, if it wasn't for the winter time of flowering, I would have not given them much consideration indeed. After a couple of season the flowers became significatively larger, reaching the full potential of the species, till to turn to be one of the 'superstar' plants of January. Probably the bulbs need to size up well before to get the maximum result, it's rather odd that all species resent to be moved in spite to don't have perennial roots.
I have checked the biggest bulbs of fischeriana can produce 4 flowers, on candida 3, I got 6 on lutea but it was a double-nose bulb, while I have yet to see the top limit of clusiana.
A question, have you checked if S. candida is scented? It is said to be freesia scented, but mine are not scented at all. The gray fischeriana instead is lightly lemon scented.
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........A question, have you checked if S. candida is scented? It is said to be freesia scented, but mine are not scented at all. The gray fischeriana instead is lightly lemon scented.
Angelo - I can't detect any scent at all but my nose is not the most sensitive.
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And now .....Sternbergia for beginners .... ;D
But what a beginner!
I think you are very skilled. S. Vernalis is not easy to flower indeed.
Lovely show so far north!
Poul
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I have three forms of Sternbergia colchiciflora. Their flowers are quite similar but their leaves are different. Two of them have rather broad leaves and the other relatively narrow leaves which have a bluish tint.
The two of them are shown in the pic below. The broad-leaved at the left is from Ziyaret pass, Turkey and the narrow-leaved is grown from seeds collected somewhere in Turkey. Unfortunately I do not know where in Turkey. Can anybody help with a location?
Poul
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Sternbergia kick off in the Southern Hemisphere.
These bulbs are growing outside. As we live in a seriously hot Mediterranean climate they don't seem to mind being in a bed that is watered occasionally.
Anita
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Sternbergia sicula is in full bloom in our garden - all came originally from seed from Rannweig Wallis in Wales - having been collected in Crete I believe.
cheers
fermi
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Sternbergia lutea is also in bloom
cheers
fermi
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Sternbergia lutea is also in bloom
cheers
fermi
Fantastic show Fermi ! :o
Wish we could grow them outside like that .
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Very nice Fermi, I do grow that form from R. Wallis ex Crete ad is a good increaser, although quite small compared to my other forms
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Very nice Fermi, I do grow that form from R. Wallis ex Crete ad is a good increaser, although quite small compared to my other forms
Hi Angelo,
yes, Otto has given me a bulb of the form he got from...Paul Furse, I think. It is still one bulb but flowers consistently - it is half way in size between "Rannweig's" S. sicula and the "commercial" form of S. lutea.
Fantastic show Fermi ! :o
Wish we could grow them outside like that .
Hi Kris,
we always want what we can't get ;)
I'm impressed with what you can grow where you are. The Sternbergias grow themselves here - we just try to make sure they don't get watered during the summer when they are asleep!
cheers
fermi
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Hi Angelo,
yes, Otto has given me a bulb of the form he got from...Paul Furse, I think. It is still one bulb but flowers consistently - it is half way in size between "Rannweig's" S. sicula and the "commercial" form of S. lutea.
Hi Kris,
we always want what we can't get ;)
I'm impressed with what you can grow where you are. The Sternbergias grow themselves here - we just try to make sure they don't get watered during the summer when they are asleep!
cheers
fermi
Fermi , for the record : the S. sicula I gave you came from Alan Edwards and was collected in the Selia Gorge ,Crete.
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Lovely Sternbergia spp. there. Do they set seed?
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Lovely Sternbergia spp. there. Do they set seed?
Hi Anthony,
occasionally I manage to catch a few few before the wasps and ants disperse them
I'll keep an eye out and let you know,
cheers
fermi
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Fermi , for the record : the S. sicula I gave you came from Alan Edwards and was collected in the Selia Gorge ,Crete.
This is one of the best forms I ever seen Otto !
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The white Sternbergia is in flower again!
It's being protected by an overgrowth of a DBI!
cheers
fermi
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Nice one Fermi
Roland
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More blooms open on our little clump of Sternbergia candida :D
cheers
fermi
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The autumn season has started in the northern hemisphere.
In this through of an early form of Sternbergia sicula there is 60+ flowers.
It normally spent the winter, spring and summer in my green house along with some other big Sternbergia pots.
But this year I was short of space and in June I placed them outside against a south facing wall. At that time it was very rainy, so I covered them with an almost closed plastic mini green house.
We had a warm and sunny summer, and they got a god 'baking'. At the end of July i checked the temperature inside the mini green house and I was chocked to see that the surface temperature of the through was 53oC and the soil temperature was 46oC 5cm below the surface. I removed the cover immediately but as this was not the warmest day of the summer, I was sure all the bulbs has been killed.
Luckily they were not, but they have had the baking of their life!
Poul
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The autumn season has started in the northern hemisphere.
In this trough of an early form of Sternbergia sicula there is 60+ flowers.
It normally spent the winter, spring and summer in my green house along with some other big Sternbergia pots.
But this year I was short of space and in June I placed them outside against a south facing wall. At that time it was very rainy, so I covered them with an almost closed plastic mini green house.
We had a warm and sunny summer, and they got a god 'baking'. At the end of July i checked the temperature inside the mini green house and I was chocked to see that the surface temperature of the through was 53oC and the soil temperature was 46oC 5cm below the surface. I removed the cover immediately but as this was not the warmest day of the summer, I was sure all the bulbs has been killed.
Luckily they were not, but they have had the baking of their life!
Poul
Oh! My goodness, how wonderful they look!
After such high temperatures you might have thought they were roasted enough to eat :o
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Oh! My goodness, how wonderful they look!
After such high temperatures you might have thought they were roasted enough to eat :o
Yes, I did. But I think they are poisonous. If they were tulips I would certainly have eaten them ;D
Poul
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In this through of an early form of Sternbergia sicula there is 60+ flowers.
Poul
:o :o :o What a great show Poul . What a season opener ......
Interesting experience , again some evidence that they need baking in summer ....
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The autumn season has started in the northern hemisphere.
In this through of an early form of Sternbergia sicula there is 60+ flowers.
It normally spent the winter, spring and summer in my green house along with some other big Sternbergia pots.
But this year I was short of space and in June I placed them outside against a south facing wall. At that time it was very rainy, so I covered them with an almost closed plastic mini green house.
We had a warm and sunny summer, and they got a god 'baking'. At the end of July i checked the temperature inside the mini green house and I was chocked to see that the surface temperature of the through was 53oC and the soil temperature was 46oC 5cm below the surface. I removed the cover immediately but as this was not the warmest day of the summer, I was sure all the bulbs has been killed.
Luckily they were not, but they have had the baking of their life!
Poul
Superb and very impressive Poul ! :o :o :o
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Thank you Kris and Luc!
The next to flower is Sternbergia colchiciflora. Not impressive as the sicula, but I find the flower very elegant.
Poul
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Thank you Kris and Luc!
The next to flower is Sternbergia colchiciflora. Not impressive as the sicula, but I find the flower very elegant.
Poul
Congratulations Poul ! Here it is not reliable in flowering ....Most of the years it won't flower :(
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Congratulations Poul ! Here it is not reliable in flowering ....Most of the years it won't flower :(
The same here - last year they didn't flower, or more correct they didn't show they flowers. But they set seeds so they must have flowered below ground.
Poul
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Thanks, Poul!!! Very showy S. sicula!!! Besides, I've got this one from you flowering at me in Donetsk in late August - see here. Also, I put here some flowering clones of S. colchiciflora. I grow two races - ONE from Bessarabia (S. Ukraine) with narrow tiny leaves and freely blooming every year, and the SECOND from Crimea with big broad leaves, rare flowering and often cleistogamic flowers. I put here S. colchiciflora from Bessarabian race.
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Merendera montana & Sternbergia colchiciflora (Bessarabian race)
S. colchiciflora leaves (Bessarabian race, April 2013)
S. colchiciflora leaves (Crimean race, April 2013)
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Thanks, Poul!!! Very showy S. sicula!!! Besides, I've got this one from you flowering at me in Donetsk in late August - see here. Also, I put here some clones of S. colchiciflora. I grow two races - ONE from Bessarabia (S. Ukraine) with narrow tiny leaves and freely blooming every year, and the SECOND from Crimea with big broad leaves, rare flowering and often cleistogamic flowers. I put here S. colchiciflora from Bessarabian race.
I am glad you have success too!! And especial that the Sternbergia I send you thrive in Donetsk!
Your colchiciflora are very interesting. Can you tell me how the habitat are where they grow?
Do you know if they need a hot summer bake to flower well?
I grow two races too, one narrow leaved and one with broader leaves, but not as broad as your Bessarabian race. Both are from Turkey. You can see a pic of them in reply 26 in this thread. The ones I showed in flower above are the narrow leaved race. Some years this race flowers best, in other years the broad leaved form flowers best.
Poul
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Sternbergia has started flowering early this year. We have had a long warm summer resulting in many flowers.
1. The first flower this year of my own hybrid. Sternbergia lutea x sicula Dodona Gold
2. The same in sunshine
3. Sternbergia sicula Dodona Gold. In this 20 cm pot I counted more than 25 flowers and flower buds
4. Sternbergia sicula, early form and Colchicum montanum in the open garden
Poul
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I am glad you have success too!! And especial that the Sternbergia I send you thrive in Donetsk!
Your colchiciflora are very interesting. Can you tell me how the habitat are where they grow?
Do you know if they need a hot summer bake to flower well?
I grow two races too, one narrow leaved and one with broader leaves, but not as broad as your Bessarabian race. Both are from Turkey. You can see a pic of them in reply 26 in this thread. The ones I showed in flower above are the narrow leaved race. Some years this race flowers best, in other years the broad leaved form flowers best.
Poul
Poul, I put here S. colchiciflora habitats in Crimea and in Bessarabia (Odessa region, Ukraine). As I told you Bessarabian plants bloom freely every year (we've got hot dry summer), but my Crimean plants flower rare, I've noticed they bloom well when we have rainy spring, else - they are cleistogamic in those years with dry spring.
Bessarabian habitat - freely blooming S. colchiciflora. It is S. Ukraine, Odessa region steppes, in bushes and Robinia pseudoacacia and Gleditsia triacanthos plantations.
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Crimean habitat - rarely blooming S. colchiciflora. It is S. Ukraine, Crimea peninsula, montane ravines (1000 m), in open dry southern sea slopes (300-500 m).
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Dima, thank you for the very informative pics and habitat descriptions. This helps understanding the bulbs and their needs. I will plant my broad leaved S. colchiciflora in a warm bed outside, where they will get rain in the spring to see if that gives better flowering. I will keep you informed about the result.
Poul
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Interesting this postings from Dimitri and Poul about colchiciflora !
This form of S. sicula is planted out in my rockgarden for 4 years now and it is flowering for the third time. Only previous year it was not flowering .
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Sternbergia lutea ssp lutea started flowering here ! 3 weeks later than last year !
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This form of S. sicula is planted out in my rockgarden for 4 years now and it is flowering for the third time. Only previous year it was not flowering .
Kris your Sternbergia planting look very natural! If one didn't know it could have been pics from a mountain in Greece.
How was your summer this year compared with last year? In Denmark we had a relative warm and long summer resulting in very good Sternbergia flowering.
Poul
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Sternbergia lutea ssp lutea started flowering here ! 3 weeks later than last year !
Luc, very nice lutea! The many flowers show it likes the planting site against the wall.
Poul
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Besides more flowers the long and warm summer has also resulted in leafless flowering in many of my Sternbergias.
In most years this Sternbergia lutea has very advanced leaves before the flowers show up, but not this year.
Poul
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Kris your Sternbergia planting look very natural! If one didn't know it could have been pics from a mountain in Greece.
How was your summer this year compared with last year? In Denmark we had a relative warm and long summer resulting in very good Sternbergia flowering.
Poul
Thanks Poul ! It is one of my dreams/targets to grow them as natural as possible ........But it is a hard way with a lot of disappointments . But I learned from the past........... first anough stock in pots before they go outside to try ... .On the other hand I am a better grower of plants (bulbs & rockgardenplants )outside in the garden then in pots ....or under glas...
We had a really very dry and warm summer with not any rain between the end of june and the beginning of september .
If they are not willing to flower outside this year I would be very disappointed and I would not understand it anymore.
On the other hand al my Sternies in pot are not showing any sign ........They are growing in the glashouse ..
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Sternbergia sicula
From a collection made in 1966 by Herbert & Molly Crook (C 529), at 300m in the Peloponnese
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A very satisfyingly fat potful, Gerry - potted sunshine 8)
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I agree Maggi, a fantastic potful, Gerry ! :o
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Spectacular :o
Well done Gerry.
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Thanks all. It's really down to the hot summer.
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Thanks all. It's really down to the hot summer.
You are too modest - good feeding and watering is important too.
So well done!
Poul
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Great show Gerry, well done.
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My clump of Sternbergia lutea enjoyed the sunshine today !
[attachimg=1]
.... ans so did the bees !!
[attachimg=2]
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Very nice Luc.
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Sternbergia greuteriana
From JJA 933.350.
Greece, Karpathos ex a Manfred Koenen collection (01-87 ). This is tiny.
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Small is beautiful, Gerry !!! 8)
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My best clone of Sternbergia sicula
Itwas collected on the island of Corfu, on top of its highest mountain, Pantokrator.
Here fully hardy and flowering without any protection winter or summer.
If somebody is interested, next spring I shall have some for exchange!
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My best clone of Sternbergia sicula
Itwas collected on the island of Corfu, on top of its highest mountain, Pantokrator.
Here fully hardy and flowering without any protection winter or summer.
If somebody is interested, next spring I shall have some for exchange!
:o :o :o So impressive Herbert ! Maybe , so far this one needs to get the award of "the best Sternbergia of 2013 " ....Tough Poul's , Luc's and Gerry's plant are stil competitors .....
Oh yes please , You may put me on your list for Exchange .Some long time ago I was on this Pantokrator , but it was high summer and only the Verbascums and Euphorbia's where flowering.
Another question , how do you grow it so succesfully ?
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My best clone of Sternbergia sicula
Itwas collected on the island of Corfu, on top of its highest mountain, Pantokrator.
Here fully hardy and flowering without any protection winter or summer.
If somebody is interested, next spring I shall have some for exchange!
Very impressive Herbert. I wish I could grow them in the open garden. My plants from Pantokrator ( in a frame) are also in flower.
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Kris,
I do nothing except some fertilizer in spring!
Frosts down to -18C, this year a new summer record with 37,5 C, no watering ever! Linz has close to 800mm rain/year, most of it in the summer months! No reliable snow cover!
I will be glad to exchange next summer!
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My best clone of Sternbergia sicula.....
Beautiful clumps Herbert!
It certainly is a very floriferious clone! How is the flowering after a colder summer?
Poul
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OMG a miracle has happened. For the first time EVER I have Sterngerias in flower
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Sternbergia sicula
Derived from a collection made near Castel del Monte, Apulia, Italy.
A gift from a kind forumist.
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OMG a miracle has happened. For the first time EVER I have Sterngerias in flower
Photographic proof, Mark? ;D
cheers
fermi
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Sternbergia sicula and lute in my meadow.
Not a big difference!
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Sternbergia lutea
A few days behind sicula and not as floriferous!
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Sternbergia sicula and lute in my meadow.
Not a big difference!
:o Great as ever Franz !
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Sternbergia sicula and lute in my meadow.
Not a big difference!
Fantastic sight, Franz !
You have an excellent excuse not to maw the lawn !! :P
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Sorry for asking but how can I differ S.lutea from S.sicula?
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According to a recent study, you can't. See:
Botanical Journal of the Linnean Society, 2011, 166, 149–162
Too large to post but available online.
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According to a recent study, you can't. See:
Botanical Journal of the Linnean Society, 2011, 166, 149–162
Too large to post but available online.
The abstract for this paper says :
Abstract/Summary
The phylogenetics of Sternbergia (Amaryllidaceae) were studied using DNA sequences of the plastid ndhF and matK genes and nuclear internal transcribed spacer (ITS) ribosomal region for 38, 37 and 32 ingroup and outgroup accessions, respectively. All members of Sternbergia were represented by at least one accession, except S. minoica and S. schubertii, with additional taxa from Narcissus and Pancratium serving as principal outgroups. Sternbergia was resolved and supported as sister to Narcissus and composed of two primary subclades: S. colchiciflora sister to S. vernalis, S. candida and S. clusiana, with this clade in turn sister to S. lutea and its allies in both Bayesian and bootstrap analyses. A clear relationship between the two vernal flowering members of the genus was recovered, supporting the hypothesis of a single origin of vernal flowering in Sternbergia. However, in the S. lutea complex, the DNA markers examined did not offer sufficient resolving power to separate taxa, providing some support for the idea that S. sicula and S. greuteriana are conspecific with S. lutea.
http://centaur.reading.ac.uk/22205/ (http://centaur.reading.ac.uk/22205/)
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Sternbergia lutea flowering in my garden. The flowering is much better than usual due to a warm and dry summer.
Poul
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Thanks you both.. I hope upper two answers are for me.. ???
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Sternbergia sicula have just finished flowering outside in the rockgarden (picture from previous week)
Now Sternbergia lutea takes over this week ....
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Kris,
your Sternbergia sicula grow as the natural habitat, Superb!
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Kris,
your Sternbergia sicula grow as the natural habitat, Superb!
Thanks for the compliments Franz !
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Nice Sternbergias from all,
here some in my garden:
Sternbergia sicula from Corfu
Sternbegia greuteriana, stoloniferae form with unknown orgin,
the smallest flowers from all
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A good year for sternbergia here. The last to flower are these which I was given under the name Sternbergia lutea angustifolia. Whatever you cal them, they're doing OK!
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A good year for sternbergia here. The last to flower are these which I was given under the name Sternbergia lutea angustifolia. Whatever you cal them, they're doing OK!
........ and my usual rubbish year here, but I'll keep trying, I'm a glutton for punishment.
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A good year for sternbergia here. The last to flower are these which I was given under the name Sternbergia lutea angustifolia. Whatever you cal them, they're doing OK!
They are doing OK Tony, but very different from what I have under that name (originally from Mike Salmon). However, I suspect it is a fictitious taxon
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They are doing OK Tony, but very different from what I have under that name (originally from Mike Salmon). However, I suspect it is a fictitious taxon
Tropicos < http://www.tropicos.org/NameSearch.aspx?name=cyclamen+luteum&commonname= (http://www.tropicos.org/NameSearch.aspx?name=cyclamen+luteum&commonname=) > only lists subsp. graeca and sicula, so I think "fictitious" is the operative word.
I need to go see if my S. lutea have started blooming yet. None have started yet anywhere close to the house.
Jim
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Tropicos < http://www.tropicos.org/NameSearch.aspx?name=cyclamen+luteum&commonname= (http://www.tropicos.org/NameSearch.aspx?name=cyclamen+luteum&commonname=) > only lists subsp. graeca and sicula, so I think "fictitious" is the operative word.
I need to go see if my S. lutea have started blooming yet. None have started yet anywhere close to the house.
Jim
??? Two completely different genera here Cyclamen (which counts graecum as one of it's own) and Sternbergia which has lutea. I'm all in favour of lumping but that's rediculous ;D
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Recent studies at Kew - morphometric & phylogenetic - suggest that S.sicula & S. greuteriana should be included in S. lutea which is described as a very variable species. I recall seeing a reference to "S. sicula graeca" years ago but cannot recall where.
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Sternbergia lutea have been wonderful this year, very dry & warm, must suit their needs.
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??? Two completely different genera here Cyclamen (which counts graecum as one of it's own) and Sternbergia which has lutea. I'm all in favour of lumping but that's rediculous ;D
That's what happens when I try to do two things at once! Or maybe it's just time taking its toll on the little grey cells!
Jim
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Kew lists Sternbergia lutea with three subspecies:
graeca
greuteriana
sicula
at:
http://apps.kew.org/wcsp/advsearch.do;jsessionid=FC7FF6025E4C84C046382B3AABF94814 (http://apps.kew.org/wcsp/advsearch.do;jsessionid=FC7FF6025E4C84C046382B3AABF94814)
Which is what I was after in the first place.
Sternbergia lutea seems perfectly hardy outdoors here. S. sicula did not survive outdoors here in my rock garden.
Jim
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I think this is more up-to-date:
http://apps.kew.org/wcsp/synonomy.do?name_id=288111 (http://apps.kew.org/wcsp/synonomy.do?name_id=288111)
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That's what happens when I try to do two things at once! Or maybe it's just time taking its toll on the little grey cells!
Jim
Know the feeling well Jim!
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Sternbergia lutea have been wonderful this year, very dry & warm, must suit their needs.
It looks great Mike !
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The smaller types of S. lutea from Crete are always the last here
And a picture of my Sternbergia bed, between a south facing wall and a street. Here are only surplus plants and I do not actively propagate them any longer!
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Another two, looking very similar, both small types
first received as greuteriana from a nice forumist - I am not convinced about the name
second a miniature from Karpathos, also a gift from a forumist
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Herbert- in my (limited) experience S. greuteriana is variable in size, but none of the three plants I have under that name (from Crete, Karpathos & an unknown source) looks anything like yours.
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Herbert- in my (limited) experience S. greuteriana is variable in size, but none of the three plants I have under that name (from Crete, Karpathos & an unknown source) looks anything like yours.
Me to Herbert, I was thinking that I not recognise them as greuteriana ........
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S. greuteriana as showed recently in Kent ....
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Kris,
these plants I would also call greuteriana (stamens as long or longer than flowers).
But unfortunately I do not have such plants in my collection ... :'(
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Kris,
these plants I would also call greuteriana (stamens as long or longer than flowers).
But unfortunately I do not have such plants in my collection ... :'(
Neither do I Herbert .... :'(
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Kris,
these plants I would also call greuteriana (stamens as long or longer than flowers).
But unfortunately I do not have such plants in my collection ... :'(
I assume you are relying on Pasche & Kerndorff (2002) but this criterion has been rejected by Gage & Wilkin (2007) [among others] on grounds of variability.
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I got this labeled as Sternbergia greuteriana many years ago. If I remember correct Herberts greut1 is offset from this plant.
Real greuteriana or not - it performs very well in my open garden every year.
Poul
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You are right Poul and I am very happy with this free flowering miniature!
By the way, quite a show of Crocuses you showed!
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Sternbergia lutea just beginning to open here in Kent.
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Sternbergia lutea now fully open and thriving in our mild autumn weather.
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Sternbergia lutea now fully open and thriving in our mild autumn weather.
Ralph, Nice to see S. Lutea flowering in the open garden!
Does it flower so well every year?
Poul
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Yes, I bought a load of them from Bulb'Argence some years ago and they have been very reliable. But I do have a very sunny garden in a dry area.
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Yes, a bought a load of them from Bulb'Argence some years ago and they have been very reliable. But I do have a very sunny garden in a dry area.
I am trying hard not to be green with envy - it's not always easy.......
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This photo was taken a month ago in a neighbours garden. I assume it is S. lutea var. angustifolia. The garage wall with trellis faces south but the bulbs are in a very sheltered position. The clump is thinned out every few years.
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This photo was taken a month ago in a neighbours garden. I assume it is S. lutea var. angustifolia. The garage wall with trellis faces south but the bulbs are in a very sheltered position. The clump is thinned out every few years.
Good grief! Is there no end to my suffering?
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Good grief! Is there no end to my suffering?
I'll bet they feel the same when they see you grow Erythronium, Dactylorhiza, Crocus pelistericus etc. in your Aberdeen garden. ;)
Anyway I do. The size of my Dactylorhiza flowers are about one third of yours! Not to mention the numbers.
Poul
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Fresh clumps of Sternbergia lutea keep opening in the garden.
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Sternbergia were looking good in the Peloponnese last week, the first photo is of S.lutea at Harouda the second S.lutea at Kastania and finally flowering at home now Sternbergia Molly Dawson's late. Does anyone know who Molly is/was?
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Sternbergia were looking good in the Peloponnese last week, the first photo is of S.lutea at Harouda the second S.lutea at Kastania and finally flowering at home now Sternbergia Molly Dawson's late. Does anyone know who Molly is/was?
They look just perfect Melvyn ! Seems that you had a very good trip ....
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Sternbergia were looking good in the Peloponnese last week, the first photo is of S.lutea at Harouda the second S.lutea at Kastania and finally flowering at home now Sternbergia Molly Dawson's late. Does anyone know who Molly is/was?
I have just been told by Mary Ridley that Molly Dawson was a staunch member of the Wimbledon AGS group and an excellent grower and shower.
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I have just been told by Mary Ridley that Molly Dawson was a staunch member of the Wimbledon AGS group and an excellent grower and shower.
Aha! Mary to the rescue - nice to know who the people are behind these plant types, isn't it?
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Melvyn, it is nice to see Sternbergia in the wild, thanks for showing us. It certainly was a successful trip!
Poul
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After replanting my Sternbergia lutea ex. Iran to another site the leaves of all the bulbs look like this. Last year all of them looked perfectly healthy with a uniform green colour.
I fear it is virus, and if that is correct the plants must have had a 'hidden' virus for some time and the change of growing conditions has made the virus visible.
Is it virus or is the colour changing in the leaves caused by different nutrients levels in their new site?
Poul
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Poul - the leaves on my plants of S. lutea angustifolia (sometimes) look like this & have done so for several years. I suspect virus but the plants remain vigorous & floriferous.
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Poul - the leaves on my plants of S. lutea angustifolia (sometimes) look like this & have done so for several years. I suspect virus but the plants remain vigorous & floriferous.
Gerry, I have made the same observation on Sternbergia Autumn Gold, (a cross between lutea and sicula) and on another clone of lutea. I have discarded both of them with regret as they were very floriferious. The last one I had for several years and it multiplied and flowered exceptionally well.
I wonder if a virus could be beneficial to the plant like some fungus often is?
The above observations could indicate that.
Many plants can live unaffected with a virus. There are several researches on the genus Galanthus which indicates that many of the old named clones in fact are virus infected. But even if a virus don't harm a specific plant or even may be beneficial I don't like the thought of having virused plants. Who knows if they can infect other genus like crocus with disastrous results.
I think it is better to be safe than sorry, so I never buy 'broken coloured' tulips and I discard plants if they show signs of virus.
Poul
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I agree with Poul in discarding virused plants.
However there are other causes which can present similar symptoms, ranging from nutrient imbalances, to irregular water supplies, aphid, slug and even frost damage.
I am not experienced with Sternbergia, (though I have a few), and even less so as regards virus in the genus but I have grown enough bulbs that I question whether this is virus induced.
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I agree about avoiding problems with virused plants. I had serious such troubles 40 years ago! However, if -- and these are important "if" -- if there is an isolated growing chamber, and if the virus-infected bulbs are truly rare and valuable, growing from seed can sometime produce virus-free offspring. If you have virused plants never use their pollen on a healthy plant. Just often enough to be a real problem, viruses can be transmitted in the debris accompanying the pollen, even if inside the pollen there are no virus particles.
Also, heat-treatment has been used to inactivate viruses in certain cases, and tissue culture can also sometimes produce virus-free materials if the tissue can out-grow the viruses.
Jim
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are the roots healthy and the basal plate firm? is there any sign of insect life between the leaves? could the bulbs contain narcissus fly?
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Into December, and Sternbergia lutea keeps on flowering.