Cyclamen 2014

[Mark Griffiths]

Steve, I get a number of "failed to launch" plants too - or the "I've only got enough energy for one leaf" thing.

I'll probably have the details on the autumnale sowing date but it's dark so it will need to be another day. I do know these have been absolute bruisers - I have two other pots more or less packed with 1 inch tubers and I think a few other singletons. I've been sending the seed in regularly to the Cyclamen Societymarked up appropriately. I thought, but I can't be sure that the seedlings from the original plants gave me quite a variety of different colours but they may have all been pink.

Here's a picture of the original plant taken a few years back

[SJW]

I'll probably have the details on the autumnale sowing date but it's dark so it will need to be another day. I do know these have been absolute bruisers - I have two other pots more or less packed with 1 inch tubers and I think a few other singletons. I've been sending the seed in regularly to the Cyclamen Society marked up appropriately. I thought, but I can't be sure that the seedlings from the original plants gave me quite a variety of different colours but they may have all been pink.

I don't think there can be many C. persicum autumnale seed donors, Mark - it hasn't been on the main CS seed list for a few years so I assume there hasn't been enough seed available to make it worth listing, and what is sent in probably goes as an extra 'thank you' to donors. That must be how I got my seed (5, and 3 germinated) so you may well have been the donor! For some reason, I didn't note when I sowed mine but it was no more than a couple of years ago, I think. They've not been the most robust growers for me so far (unlike your bruisers). This one has the best leaf.

[Mark Griffiths]

Steve, the leaves on yours certainly look right - I've just checked and it seems unfortunately I didn't write down the sowing date either but they've been flowering for quite a few years now.

[Roma]

Cyclamen alpinum
2nd picture showing the leaves
Cyclamen coum
Cyclamen elegans

[ian mcenery]

Steve and Mark interesting your comments about persicum autumnale mine which was from Peter Moore seed was via a friend and was sown by my version of the Reading method in October 2010. Growth has so far been good but autumn flowering well not so far  though buds were in waiting from the end of October. Perhaps I should give it more of a baking in the summer?

[Mark Griffiths]

Ian, part of my plan for the seedling was to be "really mean" to one set of them - I think I've got the dryness but I'm not sure we have the heat and that may be the key.

When I bought the tuber directly from Peter Moore on a visit he told me I could have it as long as I didn't complain that it flowered in spring - makes me wonder if he also couldn't get it to flower in the autumn either. These are I am sure absolutely genuine plants but it seems given a chance they slip back into old habits.

[ian mcenery]

Ian, part of my plan for the seedling was to be "really mean" to one set of them - I think I've got the dryness but I'm not sure we have the heat and that may be the key.

When I bought the tuber directly from Peter Moore on a visit he told me I could have it as long as I didn't complain that it flowered in spring - makes me wonder if he also couldn't get it to flower in the autumn either. These are I am sure absolutely genuine plants but it seems given a chance they slip back into old habits.

Hi Mark I did see one in flower at one of the Cyclamen shows held in late September at the Birmingham Botanic Garden but can't remember whose plant it was. It was I think in flower without leaves and looked very nice.

[SJW]

There's a photo of the deep pink form of C. persicum var. autumnale in the new Cyclamen book, and a very interesting and useful article by forumist Oron Peri on it's distribution, variation, characteristic differences between colonies and growth habits. Bit too long to reproduce all the info about it in it's natural environment but, in cultivation away from its country of origin, Oron recommends treating var. autumnale in a similar way to C. rohlfsianum so as to encourage it to behave normally and produce its flowers before the leaves. Oron notes that in the wild they "do not grow in the vicinity of rocks by chance, it seems that the dew that forms on rocks provides a source of humidity as a result of the changes between day/night temperatures; in autumn the nights start to get cooler and consequently drops of water form on the surface of the rock and trickle down into the crevices where the cyclamen grow. This might also provide an explanation for the fact that the flowering time of this variety is so precise,  the first flowers are present by 15 October, whereas the flowering of var. persicum depends entirely on the first rains of winter." (Usually, rain does not fall in the localities in which C. persicum grows before mid-November). So, he recommends growing in small pots so that the soil dries out quicker with water withheld from May until the plants have mature flowers but check the tubers once per month and add a bit of water if they start to shrink/soften. Water regularly when the flowers are mature. It grows in shade in the wild but he recommends full sun in cultivation. Hand pollination is necessary for seed set. In Oron's experience they take longer to grow, with smaller tubers, are shy to set seed, germination is slow and unreliable, and they take 3-5 years to reach flowering size! Depending on locality, they flower between mid October and January.

As I say, an interesting read which I hope he doesn't mind me part-reproducing here.

[SJW]

When I bought the tuber directly from Peter Moore... These are I am sure absolutely genuine plants...

Mark - just noticed that the Type specimen was prepared from a plant cultivated by Peter Moore. 

[Maggi Young]

There's a photo of the deep pink form of C. persicum var. autumnale in the new Cyclamen book, and a very interesting and useful article by forumist Oron Peri on it's distribution, variation, characteristic differences between colonies and growth habits. Bit too long to reproduce all the info about it in it's natural environment but, in cultivation away from its country of origin, Oron recommends treating var. autumnale in a similar way to C. rohlfsianum so as to encourage it to behave normally and produce its flowers before the leaves. Oron notes that in the wild they "do not grow in the vicinity of rocks by chance, it seems that the dew that forms on rocks provides a source of humidity as a result of the changes between day/night temperatures; in autumn the nights start to get cooler and consequently drops of water form on the surface of the rock and trickle down into the crevices where the cyclamen grow. This might also provide an explanation for the fact that the flowering time of this variety is so precise,  the first flowers are present by 15 October, whereas the flowering of var. persicum depends entirely on the first rains of winter." (Usually, rain does not fall in the localities in which C. persicum grows before mid-November). So, he recommends growing in small pots so that the soil dries out quicker with water withheld from May until the plants have mature flowers but check the tubers once per month and add a bit of water if they start to shrink/soften. Water regularly when the flowers are mature. It grows in shade in the wild but he recommends full sun in cultivation. Hand pollination is necessary for seed set. In Oron's experience they take longer to grow, with smaller tubers, are shy to set seed, germination is slow and unreliable, and they take 3-5 years to reach flowering size! Depending on locality, they flower between mid October and January.

As I say, an interesting read which I hope he doesn't mind me part-reproducing here.

I doubt that Oron would have a problem with this - he is very open and generous with  his information -  and this is the best enticement I've seen to to tempt me to buy the book !

[SJW]

...and this is the best enticement I've seen to tempt me to buy the book !

Maggi - it's relatively expensive, I know, but it really is a fantastic and valuable resource, which I'm enjoying dipping into. I can understand, though, that at that price it may not quicken the pulse if you're not a fellow cyclamentalist!

[ian mcenery]

There's a photo of the deep pink form of C. persicum var. autumnale in the new Cyclamen book, and a very interesting and useful article by forumist Oron Peri on it's distribution, variation, characteristic differences between colonies and growth habits. Bit too long to reproduce all the info about it in it's natural environment but, in cultivation away from its country of origin, Oron recommends treating var. autumnale in a similar way to C. rohlfsianum so as to encourage it to behave normally and produce its flowers before the leaves. Oron notes that in the wild they "do not grow in the vicinity of rocks by chance, it seems that the dew that forms on rocks provides a source of humidity as a result of the changes between day/night temperatures; in autumn the nights start to get cooler and consequently drops of water form on the surface of the rock and trickle down into the crevices where the cyclamen grow. This might also provide an explanation for the fact that the flowering time of this variety is so precise,  the first flowers are present by 15 October, whereas the flowering of var. persicum depends entirely on the first rains of winter." (Usually, rain does not fall in the localities in which C. persicum grows before mid-November). So, he recommends growing in small pots so that the soil dries out quicker with water withheld from May until the plants have mature flowers but check the tubers once per month and add a bit of water if they start to shrink/soften. Water regularly when the flowers are mature. It grows in shade in the wild but he recommends full sun in cultivation. Hand pollination is necessary for seed set. In Oron's experience they take longer to grow, with smaller tubers, are shy to set seed, germination is slow and unreliable, and they take 3-5 years to reach flowering size! Depending on locality, they flower between mid October and January.

As I say, an interesting read which I hope he doesn't mind me part-reproducing here.

Thanks Steve I do have the book and may still be able to lift to read for a couple more years  . I  have read Oron's very helpful comments. Obviously the difficulty for me is translating his very good advice into culture in the UK is where I am failing. As a matter of interest he mentions that it should be treated in  a similar way to rohlfsianum ( a plant that so far I grow but rarely get flowers) so when I crack the code with either it could be both

I posted x wellensiekii a month ago and couldn't resist doing it again these can be very attractive

[SJW]

Thanks Steve I do have the book and may still be able to lift to read for a couple more years  . I  have read Oron's very helpful comments. Obviously the difficulty for me is translating his very good advice into culture in the UK is where I am failing. As a matter of interest he mentions that it should be treated in  a similar way to rohlfsianum ( a plant that so far I grow but rarely get flowers) so when I crack the code with either it could be both

I posted x wellensiekii a month ago and couldn't resist doing it again these can be very attractive

Ian - I know many CS members will have got the new book, but wasn't sure if you and Mark had succumbed! My rohlfsianum are normally quite disappointing but they flowered quite well last autumn, probably related to the decent summer and mild autumn we had. Thereagain, I think I've just lost one through overwatering...just when you think you're getting it right.

I've never really been tempted to grow any of the hybrids but the xwellensieki looks like a fine plant so I may have to reconsider.

[Mark Griffiths]

I don't have the book. Maybe one day.

That x wellensiekii looks lovely, both the parents are favourites of mine but I had a hard time getting hold of the hybrid. I tried to recreate it - I sometimes have cypriums that remain with flowers opened in the autumn right through the winter.

I think I now have a seedling or two from seed I got from Jan Bravenboer.

[SJW]

C. purpurascens seedlings, germinated early summer onwards last year. It's interesting to compare the germination and growth rates of the different pots (each from a separate plant).