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Author Topic: galanthus worronii/ woronowii ?  (Read 8120 times)

Jim McKenney

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Re: galanthus worronii/ woronowii ?
« Reply #15 on: February 17, 2008, 03:49:24 PM »
What do you mean, how did the H get dropped? Some of you over there might have dropped it, but some of us immediately picked it up.

In my experience, the masculine name Herb is always pronounced with the H. I’ve never heard anyone refer to an “erbaceous” border, although I guess it appens.   ;)

In my circle, the word herb as applied to plants seems to get the H about as often as it does not. I’m not consistent in this myself: some contexts seem to call for the H, in others it seems uncouth. 

What I always look for are signs of a sensitive editor: if the editor respects the pronunciation of the writer, then herb will appear as either an herb or a herb depending on the pronunciation intended.
Jim McKenney
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Jim McKenney

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Re: galanthus worronii/ woronowii ?
« Reply #16 on: February 17, 2008, 04:05:55 PM »
Mark, let's go back to Sloane again.

You wrote "s (as in slice) own"

So while you're wondering how the h in herb got dropped, I'm wondering what happened to the L in Sloane.

You meant "sl (as in slice) own" didn't you? Or did you?

 
Jim McKenney
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mark smyth

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Re: galanthus worronii/ woronowii ?
« Reply #17 on: February 17, 2008, 04:06:49 PM »
yes I did mean sl. I'm juggling work and play time at the same time
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mark smyth

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Re: galanthus worronii/ woronowii ?
« Reply #18 on: February 17, 2008, 06:55:31 PM »
yes I meant herbs. One TV I always hear 'erbs
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Paddy Tobin

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Re: galanthus worronii/ woronowii ?
« Reply #19 on: February 17, 2008, 07:19:43 PM »
Jim,

I have a friend in Westminster, Maryland, and as with yourself and Mark we regularly have fun with language, its various and different uses on both sides of the Atlantic, the different meaning given to words and phrases etc. It's a bit of fun.

Worst of all  is humour (humor). It took a great while for us to become accustomed to each others humour. Here in Ireland we have a habit of 'slagging off' our friends - disparaging remarks but meant in a humourous manner; the closer the friend the more one can be disparaging. However for one not used to this sort of humour it can read as being very insulting.

Oscar Wilde, an Irish playwright, referred to America and Ireland as two countries separated by a common language.

Paddy
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Anthony Darby

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Re: galanthus worronii/ woronowii ?
« Reply #20 on: February 17, 2008, 07:38:35 PM »
Don't think it was Ireland Paddy?
Anthony Darby, Auckland, New Zealand.
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Jim McKenney

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Re: galanthus worronii/ woronowii ?
« Reply #21 on: February 17, 2008, 07:46:10 PM »
Slagg off to your heart's content, Paddy, I can take it!
In fact, it's a common practice here, too, although it's not something one does with strangers. It's an odd way of showing affection.  ::)

I don't get to Westminster, Maryland very often - there is a once famous nursery there which I try to visit every few years. It's about an hour's drive from here.

Mark, 'erbs seems to have some sort of association with those who like to Frenchify things over here - or the sort of people who were called Jeffery until they discovered the difference between herb and 'erb and then changed their name to Geoffrey or something like that.

Now here's something else I wonder about, something with a musical/zoological flavor. In Handel's Messiah there is that line "leaps like an hart". I've never been sure what to make of that. What sort of beast is an 'art (or is it a nart?) ? And does it eat 'erbs?
Jim McKenney
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Maggi Young

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Re: galanthus worronii/ woronowii ?
« Reply #22 on: February 17, 2008, 08:35:12 PM »
"Hart" is an old term for a deer, could be a stag or a hind, which is only seen nowadays (the term, not the animals) in ancient manuscripts, folk songs, poems and the like.
Margaret Young in Aberdeen, North East Scotland Zone 7 -ish!

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Jim McKenney

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Re: galanthus worronii/ woronowii ?
« Reply #23 on: February 17, 2008, 08:38:51 PM »
I knew that, Maggie. I also know why they are so uncommon now: they have a hard time eating because so many gardeners have cut out their tongues for decorating their ferneries.   ::)
Jim McKenney
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Jim McKenney

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Re: galanthus worronii/ woronowii ?
« Reply #24 on: February 17, 2008, 08:41:54 PM »
Who's this Maggie?

Sorry.  :-[
Jim McKenney
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Maggi Young

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Re: galanthus worronii/ woronowii ?
« Reply #25 on: February 17, 2008, 08:51:41 PM »
Quote
I also know why they are so uncommon now:
Bother, that was what I was going to tell you next  >:(
Margaret Young in Aberdeen, North East Scotland Zone 7 -ish!

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johnw

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Re: galanthus worronii/ woronowii ?
« Reply #26 on: March 21, 2008, 01:38:08 AM »
And does it eat 'erbs?

In Newfoundland they drop the first "h" but sometimes add one if a word begins with a vowel!

I remember on my first trip there I overheard a phone conversation at a garden centre. Someone had phoned with a question. "Yes" the owner replied, "we have plastic and steel". The caller must have been puzzled as the owner replied "oh edging, I thought you said hedging, yes we have plenty of bareroot ones, harctic willow and efty privet".

johnw
John in coastal Nova Scotia

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Re: galanthus worronii/ woronowii ?
« Reply #27 on: March 21, 2008, 09:05:12 AM »
The fishermen on the Swedish east coast outside Stockholm are known for dropping initial H and putting it in before a vowel. It is rather strange that this is a phenomenon that appears localized and independently. It is the same with the fricative pronunciation of I (ee for you Anglosaxons) that occurs in Chinese Japanese and some Swedish dialects.

Now speaking of honorific meaning of plant names what about a Swedish gentleman from two hundred years ago.

His father was a parson and since the clergy latinized their names, his father used the name Linnaeus (we can ignore why). The parson got a son and named him Karl which in those days was customary to spell Carl .
The young man became a scientist and since scientists wrote in  Latin he signed Carolus Linnaeus. He became a very famous scientist and the crown recognized that by making him a knight. As a token of this, his named was officially changed to the customary form for the nobility which became Carl von Linné. And this is the form always used in his homeland. To call him Linnaeus today is like calling the British Queen Princess Elisabeth or perhaps the Prince of Wales Mr Battenberg.  :P Of course if you write in Latin it is OK to call him Linnaeus

Ave a nice Heaster
Göte

Göte Svanholm
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