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Author Topic: Chipping/Twin-scaling type question  (Read 101676 times)

Martin Baxendale

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Re: Chipping/Twin-scaling type question
« Reply #30 on: November 25, 2008, 10:28:24 PM »
John I just put it in whole, but it in some of them the 'rings' have separated and this gives the bulbils more room to develop. 

Same here.
Martin Baxendale, Gloucestershire, UK.

annew

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Re: Chipping/Twin-scaling type question
« Reply #31 on: November 25, 2008, 10:44:54 PM »
Me too. Next time I will pot them up seperately to see how they compare to the others.
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Maggi Young

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Re: Chipping/Twin-scaling type question
« Reply #32 on: November 25, 2008, 10:46:47 PM »
Me too. Next time I will pot them up seperately to see how they compare to the others.

All very well, but all these control/experimental pots take up SPACE, don't they?  :-\ We've got little of that left as it is!
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snowdropman

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Re: Chipping/Twin-scaling type question
« Reply #33 on: November 25, 2008, 10:48:43 PM »
I have not yet seen it, but Colin Mason has written an article for the RHS Daffodils, Snowdrops & Tulips Yearbook 2008-2009 entitled 'Galanthomania and twin-scaling' - given his great experience with twin-scaling, I am sure that this will be worth reading.
Chris Sanham
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Anthony Darby

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Re: Chipping/Twin-scaling type question
« Reply #34 on: November 25, 2008, 11:01:12 PM »
What about excessive chipping leading to poor quality offspring? If this was the case, could you send bulbs back because they were chipped?
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snowdropman

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Re: Chipping/Twin-scaling type question
« Reply #35 on: November 25, 2008, 11:02:16 PM »
It seems that, quite often, when the time comes to pot up the chips/twin scales some of them are still blind i.e. they have not produced bulbils or pips.

Some people pot the blind chips/twin scales up with the rest, on the basis that they may still produce bulbils, whilst others throw the blind chips/twin scales away believing that to pot them up could result in them rotting off in the pot thereby putting the chips/twin scales that have produced bulbils at risk.

I would be interested to hear what Hagen, Martin, Brian, Anne et al do?
« Last Edit: November 26, 2008, 08:01:22 AM by snowdropman »
Chris Sanham
West Sussex, UK

Martin Baxendale

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Re: Chipping/Twin-scaling type question
« Reply #36 on: November 25, 2008, 11:38:15 PM »
Chris, I always pot chips that haven't made bulbils along with those that have, in the hope that they will sprout eventually. And I've done the same this year with the tops as well. Anything that isn't rotten and looks clean and healthy goes in the pot. I've never had a problem with whole pots rotting off, so assume nothing bad comes of this habit.

Anthony, most snowdrops seem to chip fine and there's usually no problem with offspring varying from the parents in my experience. Where a snowdrop, for whatever reason (unstable genetics?), tends to produce offspring that vary from the original, as we've all heard 'South Hayes' may do, then I'd say if this happens you've every right to ask for your money back - the grower should be aware of this problem and grow the offspring on long enough to be sure they grow and flower in character before selling.
Martin Baxendale, Gloucestershire, UK.

ian mcenery

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Re: Chipping/Twin-scaling type question
« Reply #37 on: November 25, 2008, 11:49:47 PM »
Chris you are right Colin Mason is an expert at twin scaling he also has some super plants for sale, examples of which have found their way into my garden. He is also a friend and member of the Birmingham AGS group and often brings plants along to our meetings for the sales table. But for those who want some advice now on twin scaling there is already good guidance on Judy's Snowdrop site (owned by Janet) http://www.judyssnowdrops.co.uk/Propagation/Twin-Scaling/twin-scaling.htm

There are also some super photos of many snowdrops to cheer up all those with the dreaded white fever
Ian McEnery Sutton Coldfield  West Midlands 600ft above sea level

snowdropman

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Re: Chipping/Twin-scaling type question
« Reply #38 on: November 26, 2008, 08:09:42 AM »
Chris, I always pot chips that haven't made bulbils along with those that have, in the hope that they will sprout eventually. And I've done the same this year with the tops as well. Anything that isn't rotten and looks clean and healthy goes in the pot. I've never had a problem with whole pots rotting off, so assume nothing bad comes of this habit.
Martin - thanks for your response - do you know whether any of these 'blind' chips have actually gone on to produce viable bulbs?
Chris Sanham
West Sussex, UK

Brian Ellis

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Re: Chipping/Twin-scaling type question
« Reply #39 on: November 26, 2008, 09:08:00 AM »
Quote
Chris, I always pot chips that haven't made bulbils along with those that have, in the hope that they will sprout eventually... Anything that isn't rotten and looks clean and healthy goes in the pot.

Yes I do the same Chris, but I haven't monitored for results I'm afraid.

Quote
Where a snowdrop, for whatever reason (unstable genetics?), tends to produce offspring that vary from the original, ... the grower should be aware of this problem and grow the offspring on long enough to be sure they grow and flower in character before selling.

Martin would this account for the variation in Ronald Mackenzie's G.'Hyde Lodge' this year - perhaps from twin-scaling from too young a bulb?
Brian Ellis, Brooke, Norfolk UK. altitude 30m Mintemp -8C

Martin Baxendale

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Re: Chipping/Twin-scaling type question
« Reply #40 on: November 26, 2008, 01:41:20 PM »
Martin would this account for the variation in Ronald Mackenzie's G.'Hyde Lodge' this year - perhaps from twin-scaling from too young a bulb?

As far as I'm aware, it's mainly markings that can vary in one or two snowdrops after chipping, and usually markings on the outers, like 'South Hayes', which generally speaking can be variable in intensity in snowdrops that exhibit them, so are probably a bit genetically unstable.

I've chipped 'Hyde Lodge' and never had any problems with it becoming atypical, and I wouldn't expect chipping to affect the ovary shape, which in John's pic is clearly very different to the ovary of 'Hyde Lodge'. Ovary shape is pretty constant, which is why Matt Bishop uses it in his descriptions in the book.
Martin Baxendale, Gloucestershire, UK.

snowdropman

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Re: Chipping/Twin-scaling type question
« Reply #41 on: November 26, 2008, 02:44:44 PM »
Martin would this account for the variation in Ronald Mackenzie's G.'Hyde Lodge' this year - perhaps from twin-scaling from too young a bulb?

Brian - another possibility is that the plants might have been bought in from a third party - I do not know if the Snowdrop Company do this, but I believe that one or two of the other snowdrop sellers do.
Chris Sanham
West Sussex, UK

mark smyth

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Re: Chipping/Twin-scaling type question
« Reply #42 on: November 26, 2008, 03:31:27 PM »
I know a few years ago he was buying in surplus snowdrops. Please dont ask where from.
« Last Edit: November 26, 2008, 11:00:33 PM by mark smyth »
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Brian Ellis

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Re: Chipping/Twin-scaling type question
« Reply #43 on: November 26, 2008, 03:33:17 PM »
Thanks Martin, Chris and Mark.  I also noticed that there is a second bud coming through so wondered whether it just needed to build up a bit of oomph to show it's true characteristics, I'll keep an eye on it.
Brian Ellis, Brooke, Norfolk UK. altitude 30m Mintemp -8C

annew

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Re: Chipping/Twin-scaling type question
« Reply #44 on: November 26, 2008, 09:49:37 PM »
I usually leave any unsprouted chips for longer to see if they will - this year Trym took 4 weeks longer than other varieties, but eventually did produce good bulbils. If that failed, and the chips were in good condition, I would plant them anyway. I'll make a note infuture.
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