Aconitum 2008

[John Proctor]

Oleg,

This is what I received as Aconitum alboviolaceum (SRGC 06/07 #38) with very narrow hoods and fiddle-head shapes on the unopen buds, as in the Missouri Botanical Garden line drawing: http://www.tropicos.org/Image/19994. It flowered here late July into August and is forming seed now.

The hoods are too narrow for bumblebees to enter; they struggle unsuccessfully to squeeze in before resigning to extending their tongues to the top, which can be watched from very close.

Fine, short hairs cover the flowers and younger stems.



Leaves:


And twining stems:


John

[olegKon]

Thanks, John. Your wonderful plant seems to be true to the species except the colour. Can it be A.a. var albiflorum? Mine is closer to A. hemsleyanum which is extremely variable to my mind, although I received it as A. alboviolaceum

[mickeymuc]

Hi,

I just discovered this thread, about one of my favourite genuses :-)
I have an A. albo-violaceum, raised from seed of chilternseeds (but be warned - I bought this seed everytime they had it, with zero germination - only as I once discovered it on their homepage in late autumn, immediately ordered and sowed it I managed to get two plants out of a pack of seed). It is not yet fully grown in its 3rd year but flowered this year - very lovely, I think. Hope it will survive here.
It really looks very similar to the white plant shown before in this thread - does this ever set seed ? Mine has not done me that favour, maybe next year.....

[Kristl Walek]

Aside from the nomenclature issues in this genus---there are also seed viability problems, because the genus is all over the place in terms of it's longevity.

Some species are immediate germinators, and can survive some period of dry storage.
Others are short lived and should be moist packed immediately after collection, etc.
Some require cold, others do not.

I've been involved with the seed of this genus for many years, and it still manages to confound and confuse. Last season I lost all my A. hemslyanum seed sales as it all germinated immediately in moist packing---more recently A. barbatum has done the same thing (although I am now getting smarter and moist packing a bit, and freezing a bit to see what transpires).

I have always moist-packed albo violaceum- as this one appears to be one of the short lived species that requires cold to germinate, so is a perfect candidate for moist-packing.

Post script to above: I received my alboviolaceum seed this year from an outside source---moist packed a bit, froze the remainder. Massive germination has occurred in the moist packed bag--so now I need to ponder whether the species I have previously had as this species was correct (as it did not germinate in moist packing), or whether this one is, or whether some other variable (time or collection, etc) has included the different behaviour.

[Hkind]

I have had a lot of trouble with my computer this year, so it is not before now, that I have been able to return to the forum to find many interesting new threads.
Thank you, , for starting this thread about Aconitum. I am very fond of them and  have a little collection of them. Especially I am interested in climbing species. The most common one in Swedish gardens is Aconitum ‘Red Vine’. It is sold as A hemsleyanum, but I am not at all sure, that that is right. The flowers are about 1,5 x the size of other species and have a wonderful colour.
Here some images:
Aconitum ‘Red Vine’
A volubile and
An unidentified species

[Maggi Young]

Hanelotte, how nice to have you back again, we missed you! Computer problems are most irritating, I know...

I must admit that I know very little about the climbing types of Aconitum, so I am hoping to learn much more ...

[Hkind]

Of the other species I would like to show you Aconitum brevicalceratum. I got seed of this species from the Alaska Rock Garden Society’s China collection (ARGS 891) and managed not before this year to identify the species.
Still unidentified is the species I grew from SSSE seed. It is a very distinct plant and shouldn’t be so difficult to identify. Maybe someone can help?
The last species I got as A stoloniferum.

[Hkind]

Thank you, Maggi! I have missed you too! -- Climbing species are as easy to cultivate as other species. If you have a look at the Flora of China, you see that there are many climbers we haven't yet seen in cultivation. But many species, I suppose, are quite similar to each other.

Here is the image of Aconitum brevicaceratum, which I missed to post in my last message. And I add an image of a fabulous pink Aconitum septentrionale I found in the Swedish mountains. Never seen such a good pink in any Aconitum.

[mickeymuc]

Hi Hannelotte !

The pink Aconitum is fantastic ! In case you have some seed of that you don't need I'd be very happy :-)
The climbing sp. might be A. episcopale, this one is very distinct in its foilage - here
http://forum.garten-pur.de/attachments/A.episcopale.jpg
I posted a picture some time ago, and for comparison this
http://forum.garten-pur.de/attachments/hemsleyanum.jpg
is a leaf of volubile / hemsleyanum. I hope one can guess the differences. Episcopale leaves can be quite large, heer up to more than 15 cm in diameter and very deeply dissected.

Kind regards from Munich !

Michael

[Hkind]

Hi Michael!

Nice of you to help me in my trial to identify the different species! I compared my unidentified, climbing species with A episcopale and don't think that is the right id. The hood is very characteristic in my species. So far I haven't found any climbing pecies with a similar hood.

Maggi,
I found a very informative article about the climbing species at http://www.rhs.org.uk/publications/plantsman/0306/Aconitum.pdf. 

The distinction between A hemsleyanum and A volubile is a little bit confusing. Some years ago the two were said to be synonymous. Now Flora of China treats them as separate genera. Any help?

[mickeymuc]

Wow, if it is not A. episcopale it is an other species that should definitely be more widely known ! The habit & flower colour are very beautiful! Do you have a photo of the hood and / or the leaves? Maybe that might help with the ID - but I'm not too confident, as so few climbing species are in the trade....unfortunately.
Concerning volubile / hemsleyanum I don't see much difference, the flowers of the plants I got as volubile are lighter coloured (with some parts of white) and hemsleyanum leaves grow a bit larger - but in general it could easily be two forms of a species. However, I may also have received wrongly labelled seeds - but many other people in Germany agree with what I have seen.
For another Forum I have made photos comparing episcopale (left), hemsleyanum (middle) and volubile (right) flowers:
http://forum.garten-pur.de/attachments/Vergleich_1.jpg
http://forum.garten-pur.de/attachments/Vergleich_2.jpg
Maybe this helps a bit, but I think it is also possible, that only one species is around under the names volubile and hemsleyanum, while the true form of one of the species might not at all be around in western countries - but this is just a guess.

Michael

[Maggi Young]

Hannelotte,  that link gives an excellent article for me to study, thank you.
 Super photos links, Michael... another assistance!

[Hkind]

Hi Michael,

Thank you for the links. I agree with you that it is difficult to see any differences between the two species. My plants are from Russia, not China and should  be the true A volubile. I had also a white form, but lost it and haven't managed yet to get an other plant (I must go back to Moscow!).

You can see the flower of my unidentified species in the middle of the image below. To the ledt A volubile and to the right A 'Red Wine'.

I forgot in earlier message to commend your wish of seed of the pink A septentrionale. The image is from the wild. I tried to dig up a plant, which was really difficult and I didn't get the whole root. Maybe it is alive in my garden - maybe not. If I am lucky, I'll offer seed next year.

[Maggi Young]

A reply by Michael (mickeymuc) was lost this afternoon in the move of the Forum to a new server.... so I repeat Michael's post here:

 Michael  wrote....
Hello Hannelotte,
>
> Thanks for the pictures - my first thought was: what a splendid flower does "red wine" have ! It was not available in Germany until this year, and I love it very much. Though my plant has flowered very early for an aconitum, I'd say in August and September. "Volubile" started in September while "hemsleyanum" and episcopale  are in full flower just now - no chance for seeds, I'd say.
>
> I have to say that I have never seen a flower like your sp., it has very unique and beautiful flowers but that's all I can say 
> It might well be one of the many species unknown in the western world....
>
> I hope your pink A septentrionale will survive ! This would really be a fantastic addition to the pale pink Aconitums that are currently on the market.
>
> Best regards,
>
> Michael

[olegKon]

One of the last aconitums flowering here is A. carmichaelii 'Arendsii' The picture is taken a fourtnight ago but it is still on although a bit bitten by frost now, Unlike Western Europe we unexpectedly have a warm spell here to enjoy last floweres. + 10 for the beginning of November is a miracle