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Author Topic: Autumn flowering narcissus in the Northern Hemisphere 2018  (Read 18995 times)

Maggi Young

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Re: Autumn flowering narcissus in the Northern Hemisphere 2018
« Reply #90 on: November 12, 2018, 02:26:33 PM »
Sorry for all the people that don't like long writing and don't care about the names..

 Well, those people need not read it! Many like to learn things - thank goodness.
 It is  valuable to have these discussions here where they can be found and read  by all !   8)
Margaret Young in Aberdeen, North East Scotland Zone 7 -ish!

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David Nicholson

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Re: Autumn flowering narcissus in the Northern Hemisphere 2018
« Reply #91 on: November 13, 2018, 06:40:14 PM »
OK, it's not a 'special one' but the first this season from my ever decreasing range of Narcissus.

Narcissus 'Nylon Group'

629191-0

......and a close up of the flower

629193-1
David Nicholson
in Devon, UK  Zone 9b
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Yann

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Re: Autumn flowering narcissus in the Northern Hemisphere 2018
« Reply #92 on: November 17, 2018, 09:51:17 PM »
Back to the boring taxonomic discussion ;D

From these studies, it comes that eastern and western elegans population have the same karyotype, so they should hybridise nearly freely when they meet (between Morocco and Algeria). DNA studies show no differenciation of the studied eastern elegans and miniatus/deficiens populations from the western populations. That why I think that it's better to use a subspecies level inside the elegans species and to gather the eastern and western populations of minitaus/deficiens under the same species.

I would keep elegans because there's no confusion about what Desfontaine has drawn. And I would drop obsoletus because it's too confusing, as it's difficult to know what Parkinson has reproduced  and the name has been typified and used in several Flora (at least Flora iberica and Flora gallica) for Narcissus miniatus/deficiens, writing the synonymy would be terrible.

Sorry for all the people that don't like long writing and don't care about the names..

I've found something interesting for those interested by DNA and boring for the others  ;D

The allopolyploid origin of Narcissus obsoletus : https://ufile.io/xrflw
North of France

YT

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Re: Autumn flowering narcissus in the Northern Hemisphere 2018
« Reply #93 on: November 22, 2018, 03:50:19 PM »
Hoop season has just started today here :) :) :)

Narcissus romieuxii subsp. albidus var. zaianicus, as “N. zaianicus var. albus, MS.168 Morocco, Zaian Mts, Taztot.” on Monocot Seeds' list and  “N. zaianicus var. albus, MS.168” in Mike Salmon's newest book "A Survey Of The Genus NARCISSUS".
« Last Edit: November 23, 2018, 04:10:41 PM by YT »
Tatsuo Y
By the Pacific coast, central part of main island, Japan

Karaba

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Re: Autumn flowering narcissus in the Northern Hemisphere 2018
« Reply #94 on: November 23, 2018, 04:16:39 PM »
The name albidus is a very old name used for other species. None of the name given by M. Salmon are recognized because they don't fullfilled the ICBN (see yhe botanical names in the genus Narcissus by RHS)
If you want to use a simplier name, use Narcissus peroccidentalis Fern. Casas, 1996, it is now quite recognized. IMHO, a subspecies of cantabricus should be enough but I've been already a bit long with taxonomy  ::)
Yvain Dubois - Isère, France (Zone 7b)  _ south east Lyon

YT

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Re: Autumn flowering narcissus in the Northern Hemisphere 2018
« Reply #95 on: November 25, 2018, 10:53:25 AM »
Thank you for your advice and the url link to the newest version of botanical name list , Kabara :)
I think the name on seed list (even if it was wrong) is as important as the accepted botanical name and should write both names on this forum. It makes easier to recognise them to readers.

The name albidus is a very old name used for other species. None of the name given by M. Salmon are recognized because they don't fullfilled the ICBN (see yhe botanical names in the genus Narcissus by RHS)
If you want to use a simplier name, use Narcissus peroccidentalis Fern. Casas, 1996, it is now quite recognized. IMHO, a subspecies of cantabricus should be enough but I've been already a bit long with taxonomy  ::)
« Last Edit: November 25, 2018, 11:00:26 AM by YT »
Tatsuo Y
By the Pacific coast, central part of main island, Japan

Yann

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Re: Autumn flowering narcissus in the Northern Hemisphere 2018
« Reply #96 on: November 28, 2018, 05:22:09 PM »
i've heard a new classification is discussed among scientifics :)  So be ready to change your labels once again
North of France

YT

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Re: Autumn flowering narcissus in the Northern Hemisphere 2018
« Reply #97 on: November 29, 2018, 01:46:28 AM »
i've heard a new classification is discussed among scientifics :)  So be ready to change your labels once again

Yes, that's the point, Yann ;D
Tatsuo Y
By the Pacific coast, central part of main island, Japan

 


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