Supply of under sized bulbs

[mark smyth]

All this talk of parcels received reminds me of poor bulbs received last year from two of the mail order companies

Last year I got bulbs at full price that were obviously twinscaled bulbils with two leaves like blades of grass. These shouldnt have been sold at full price. They died down within weeks of arrival and didnt come back.

I also received spongy bulbs that were almost see through. My guess is these small bulbs had used all their stored food to produce leaves and a flower. It's from this time of year on that the bulb needs it's roots to get all the nutrients it can back in to the bulb before the leaves die back.

Is this not the main reason we should be buying dormant bulbs in late summer? Ian may know the answer to this.

Discussion at one of the days I was at turned to feeding of snowdrops and Narcissus. He said that food especially liquid food should be applied during the autumn before the leaves are above ground. The reason is it's only then that the bulb roosts have fine feeding hairs. I have seen roots out the bottom of a pot that has been sitting on gravel. There are fine white hairs along the roots

[KentGardener]

Hi Mark

I have found this new thread interesting.  I wonder, Should I assume, and even expect, flowering sized bulbs when ordering from the main snowdrop suppliers?

Yesterday I received a bulb in an order that was the smallest bulb I have ever received.  The bulb itself (Fiona's Gold) was 5mm x 4mm in size - non flowering - 2 leaves 12cm in length.  From my limited experience I would guess that it will not even have reached flowering size by next year.  The bulb was not cheap and I was really surprised that, for the price, it was non flowering sized.

Upon checking the catalogue I see that there is no mention of whether the bulbs will be flowering sized or not - so I wonder what other SRGC members would expect when ordering?

kind regards

John

[Maggi Young]

This all relates to Galanthus, of course, but there is certainly a problem with some other bulbs too. I would expect a supplier to state whether bulbs were flowering size, one year or two years to flower. I would also expect those claims to be true! Sadly, that is not always the case. I have been horrified to buy Trillium which were obviously recently chopped tiny sections with no roots and zero chance of survival after that treatment, followed by storage and post and packing....and this from a seller who claims his plants are  "not fresh divisions but established pot-grown plants". Yeah, right 
No wonder some people prefer to buy only plants they can choose "in the flesh" and that suppliers who provide good quality bulbs get such praise, often expresses as surprised delight, from their customers.

[Martin Baxendale]

Exactly what I was going to say, Maggi. I'd expect a bulb  to be flowering size unless specifically mentioned in the sale catalogue as less than flowering size (and offered at a commensurate price). If not pre-stated to be non-F.S., then if a non-F.S. one arrived I'd expect the price to be adjusted or an extra small bulb added to make up for it. The problem with snowdrops is the huge demand for and very limited availability of rarer bulbs, which means growers can often get away with sending small non-flowering size bulbs.

[Alan_b]

Surely the way to ensure you get flowering sized bulbs is to return the ones that are not of flowering size?  If the bulb supplier realises you will take any old bulb, no matter how small, without a word of complaint then next year they are not going to fall over themselves to give you their best stock, are they?  If we are all so crazed with white fever that we will take any bulb offered then we only have ourselves to blame! 

[mark smyth]

If this was any other business I'm sure we would have rights or maybe we do under the sale of goods act.

[Martin Baxendale]

Surely the way to ensure you get flowering sized bulbs is to return the ones that are not of flowering size?  If the bulb supplier realises you will take any old bulb, no matter how small, without a word of complaint then next year they are not going to fall over themselves to give you their best stock, are they?  If we are all so crazed with white fever that we will take any bulb offered then we only have ourselves to blame! 

That's the problem, though, Alan. Many people are glad (after sometimes years of waiting) to get even a non-flowering size bulb, especially if the alternative is no bulb at all.

I still think the real long-term answer would be for new snowdrops not to be released until large stocks have been built up through chipping, making them available to all who want them at a reasonable price. That's what big bulb companies (and any really big grower, like Bressingham) do. They wouldn't put a bulb in their catalogue if they only had 15 of them to sell. But that means everyone being prepared to sit on their hands until a new snowdrop goes through a lengthy bulking-up period. Mind you, it's like raising bulbs from seed - you have to wait years for the first ones to flower, but after that (provided you keep sowing every year or - in this case - keeping finding new snowdrops every year to be chipped) every year there's something new and exciting so you don't mind.

[Martin Baxendale]

I think years of raising snowdrops slowly from seed, waiting to see them flower, then chipping them and waiting again for them to get back to flowering size, has probably made me quite patient! (or just resigned to sitting around staring at hundreds of pots with nothing but leaves in them     )

[Maggi Young]

I think we all as gardeners have learned patience, but when I've paid "top dollar"... that particular virtue is not top of my list... unless I have been honestly pre-warned, then it's my choice.

Another pet hate is the "naturally small bulb" tack, when in our experience the same plant  regularly makes bulbsthe size of spuds........

Whoo! I'm feeling good and grumpy today..... better hit the chocolate sharpish and restore sweet self 

[Anthony Darby]

Should anyone not have the patience Maggi and Martin talked about, just chuck your undersized bulbs in my direction and for a very small fee (less than three figures) I'll grow them on.

[Maggi Young]

Should anyone not have the patience Maggi and Martin talked about, just chuck your undersized bulbs in my direction and for a very small fee (less than three figures) I'll grow them on.

That was good for a giggle, Anthony, but I'll still have the choc hit, just in case.

[Martin Baxendale]

I only meant patience would be needed by snowdrop growers while waiting for new cultivars to be bulked up for sale (rather than scrambling for the few available bulbs that's the current situation).

I agree totally that when you buy a bulb from a commercial source, you want to see it flower the first season - unless pre-warned that it might take a year to get to F.S. and then you can make your choice (if you have the patience) 

[KentGardener]

Should anyone not have the patience Maggi and Martin talked about, just chuck your undersized bulbs in my direction and for a very small fee (less than three figures) I'll grow them on.

Very tempted Anthony.   Can I just check that you know what you are proposing, and have adequate insurance to cover your new venture?......  (remembering the exponential price increase between last year and this demonstrated recently on ebay!)

The tiny 'South Hayes' I received from one of the 'big boys' last year, after much pampering from me, has failed to reappear this year.  I want to check that if I am going to pay you a 2 figure fee to grow this years miniscule bulbs on, that you have some contingency plans in place for potential loses 

Jx

[Anthony Darby]

I suppose I would have to say "at sender's risk"?

[Andrew]

I was going to post this in the Signs thread but reading Maggi's comments above I'll stick it in here .