We hope you have enjoyed the SRGC Forum. You can make a Paypal donation to the SRGC by clicking the above button

Author Topic: Bearded iris 2016  (Read 16423 times)

arilnut

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 407
  • Country: us
Bearded iris 2016
« on: March 14, 2016, 12:07:13 AM »
Here is I pumila today.

John B
John  B.
Hopelessly hooked on Aril Iris

Dave M

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 81
  • Country: gb
Re: Bearded iris 2016
« Reply #1 on: March 15, 2016, 09:50:51 PM »
Starting for me this year with the dainty Iris suaveolens 'Helvolus Group'

and Iris lutescens glowing in the morning sunshine
Dave Morris, Lune Valley nr. Lancaster UK

Chris Johnson

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 656
  • Country: scotland
Re: Bearded iris 2016
« Reply #2 on: April 03, 2016, 10:09:38 AM »
This is the first flowering from seed bought as Iris lutescens ssp. lutescens. I was fortunate to get both colour forms. However, I've not been able to find any information as to why this has subspecific rank.

Can anyone point me in the right direction, please?

South Uist, Outer Hebrides

Chris Johnson

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 656
  • Country: scotland
Re: Bearded iris 2016
« Reply #3 on: April 06, 2016, 10:34:16 AM »
One that lost its label on the move north. If anyone can provide a name, I would be grateful.

South Uist, Outer Hebrides

Karaba

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 453
  • Country: fr
    • My 2015-2016 seed list (in french)
Re: Bearded iris 2016
« Reply #4 on: April 06, 2016, 02:19:59 PM »
This is the first flowering from seed bought as Iris lutescens ssp. lutescens. I was fortunate to get both colour forms. However, I've not been able to find any information as to why this has subspecific rank.
The other subspecies is subbiflora from western Spain, Portugal and northern Africa wich is taller, see http://www.flora-on.pt/#/1Iris+subbiflora and Flora iberica.
Iris lutescens have more than 2 colour forms, at least 4 very different forms (white, yellow, violet, blue) and 2-4 more variations, all can be found in the same populations. There are also lot of differences in robustness, some are tall , some are very short : flower on first picture is 9 cm tall, on the second picture, they are almost 30 cm

Yvain Dubois - Isère, France (Zone 7b)  _ south east Lyon

Chris Johnson

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 656
  • Country: scotland
Re: Bearded iris 2016
« Reply #5 on: April 06, 2016, 02:37:48 PM »
Thanks for the reply, Yvain.

With so much natural variation within the species, it emphasises my query as to what is so special to justify the subspecific name 'lutescens'?
South Uist, Outer Hebrides

Karaba

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 453
  • Country: fr
    • My 2015-2016 seed list (in french)
Re: Bearded iris 2016
« Reply #6 on: April 06, 2016, 02:56:11 PM »
Because subbiflora is an accepted subspecies at least by some botanists (see the plantlist), this need at least an other subspecies to include all the other populations.
subbiflora is sometimes recognized as a true species (see flora-on). Even Flora iberica recognize that there are some differences between western populations (cf. subbiflora) and eastern ones (cf. lutescens). Infraspecific rank for subbiflora is a position between Flora-on and Flora iberica.
This is also true that Iris lutescens is very variable, many subspecies have been described (chamaeiris, olbiensis...) but few have any taxonomic value.

sorry for my english, I hope to be understood but this is not so easy for me to explain...
Yvain Dubois - Isère, France (Zone 7b)  _ south east Lyon

David Nicholson

  • Hawkeye
  • Journal Access Group
  • Hero Member
  • ******
  • Posts: 13117
  • Country: england
  • Why can't I play like Clapton
Re: Bearded iris 2016
« Reply #7 on: April 06, 2016, 04:55:50 PM »
This is the first flowering from seed bought as Iris lutescens ssp. lutescens. I was fortunate to get both colour forms. However, I've not been able to find any information as to why this has subspecific rank.

Can anyone point me in the right direction, please?

I'm not sure it has subspecific rank Chris. I can't say that I'm uptodate with Iris taxonomy but Mathew didn't credit it in 1981/9 and the SIGNA species list doesn't credit it either.
David Nicholson
in Devon, UK  Zone 9b
"Victims of satire who are overly defensive, who cry "foul" or just winge to high heaven, might take pause and consider what exactly it is that leaves them so sensitive, when they were happy with satire when they were on the side dishing it out"

Chris Johnson

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 656
  • Country: scotland
Re: Bearded iris 2016
« Reply #8 on: April 06, 2016, 06:11:22 PM »
I'm not sure it has subspecific rank Chris. I can't say that I'm uptodate with Iris taxonomy but Mathew didn't credit it in 1981/9 and the SIGNA species list doesn't credit it either.

Thanks David, nice iris though.

EDIT - deleted nonsense.
« Last Edit: April 07, 2016, 09:04:15 AM by Chris Johnson »
South Uist, Outer Hebrides

Karaba

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 453
  • Country: fr
    • My 2015-2016 seed list (in french)
Re: Bearded iris 2016
« Reply #9 on: April 06, 2016, 08:55:43 PM »
variety ? Finally, I don't understand your problem. Is it about the colour ? ssp. lutescens does not refer to the colour. ssp. lutescens can be yellow violet, white... This name is just the autonym, depending of wheter subbiflora is credited as a species or a subspecies.. SANBI does not credit spp. lutescens because they credit I. subbiflora as a species. Flora iberica consider that there is all the intermediate between subbiflora and lutescens and thus, subbiflora is not even a subspecies. Other taxonomist take an intermediate position with one species and 2 subspecies but, one more time, this in not about colour.
Yvain Dubois - Isère, France (Zone 7b)  _ south east Lyon

Tasmanian Taffy

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 139
Re: Bearded iris 2016
« Reply #10 on: April 06, 2016, 11:06:15 PM »
Hi Chris,
looks very much like Iris Bicapitata to me.
Cheers John.

Chris Johnson

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 656
  • Country: scotland
Re: Bearded iris 2016
« Reply #11 on: April 07, 2016, 09:06:40 AM »
variety ? Finally, I don't understand your problem. Is it about the colour ? ssp. lutescens does not refer to the colour. ssp. lutescens can be yellow violet, white... This name is just the autonym, depending of wheter subbiflora is credited as a species or a subspecies.. SANBI does not credit spp. lutescens because they credit I. subbiflora as a species. Flora iberica consider that there is all the intermediate between subbiflora and lutescens and thus, subbiflora is not even a subspecies. Other taxonomist take an intermediate position with one species and 2 subspecies but, one more time, this in not about colour.

I was concentrating on the colour but got the jist of it now.

Thanks again. :)
South Uist, Outer Hebrides

Chris Johnson

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 656
  • Country: scotland
Re: Bearded iris 2016
« Reply #12 on: April 07, 2016, 09:21:07 AM »
Hi Chris,
looks very much like Iris Bicapitata to me.
Cheers John.

Hi John

Thanks for that thought.

As I understand it,  Iris bicapitata is twin-headed (hence the name) and mine are single. ???
South Uist, Outer Hebrides

Lesley Cox

  • way down south !
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 16347
  • Country: nz
  • Gardening forever, house work.....whenever!
Re: Bearded iris 2016
« Reply #13 on: April 19, 2016, 12:47:18 AM »
Has anyone a correct name for this very tiny DB hybrid (American, I'm pretty sure, and quite old) please?
« Last Edit: April 19, 2016, 12:49:58 AM by Lesley Cox »
Lesley Cox - near Dunedin, lower east coast, South Island of New Zealand - Zone 9

Philip Walker

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 365
  • Country: england
Re: Bearded iris 2016
« Reply #14 on: April 26, 2016, 11:33:04 AM »
Iris babadagica

 


Scottish Rock Garden Club is a Charity registered with Scottish Charity Regulator (OSCR): SC000942
SimplePortal 2.3.5 © 2008-2012, SimplePortal