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Author Topic: What happened to these?  (Read 7300 times)

David Nicholson

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What happened to these?
« on: February 14, 2008, 08:32:37 PM »
I have just obtained a copy of 'Dwarf Bulbs' by Brian Mathew, it was originally published by Batsford in 1973 but I have the Garden Book Club edition published in 1974 (Garden Book Club Editions are always cheaper to buy-mine cost me £1!)

Obviously time has moved on since the book was written and a fair amount of 'lumping and splitting' has taken place, some of which was probably done by Brian himself. There are a number of species described in the book that are not listed on Tony G's Crocus Pages and I can only assume that they have been moved into other species. I would like, for my own study, to add some notes to the book as to where these species are currently lodged. Can anyone help please-I have not included the written descriptions but could do if needed.

Crocus-
albiflorus
asturicus
balansae
biliottii
clusii
guillardotii (syn. aleppicus)
lazicus
napolitanus
stellaris
suwarowianus
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David Nicholson
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berggreen

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Re: What happened to these?
« Reply #1 on: February 14, 2008, 09:14:16 PM »
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David Nicholson

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Re: What happened to these?
« Reply #2 on: February 14, 2008, 09:37:56 PM »
Quote from: berggreen on February 14, 2008, 09:14:16 PM
Search for crocus on this site

http://apps.kew.org/wcsp/prepareChecklist.do;jsessionid=81EABBAD930DA49F2A9ABCD94C63507A?checklist=monocots%40%40355211220071306848

And you will know what happened.



Thanks indeed for that. I have been able to sort them all out apart from C. napolitanus
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David Nicholson
in Devon, UK  Zone 9b
"Victims of satire who are overly defensive, who cry "foul" or just winge to high heaven, might take pause and consider what exactly it is that leaves them so sensitive, when they were happy with satire when they were on the side dishing it out"

tonyg

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Re: What happened to these?
« Reply #3 on: February 14, 2008, 10:10:34 PM »
I started typing this an hour ago and got interrupted - how many did I get wrong ;)

By 1980 Brian Mathew had reached some new conclusions in his book The Crocus.  Most, if not all, have so far stood the test of time!

albiflorus  = vernus ssp albiflorus
asturicus = serotinus ssp ?  I cannot recall which and I am not at home now!
balansae = olivieri ssp balansae
biliottii = ?aerius - see above
clusii
guillardotii (syn. aleppicus) = aleppicus
lazicus = scharojanii
napolitanus = vernus ssp vernus
stellaris = x stellaris (hybrid)
suwarowianus = kotschyanus ssp suworowianus
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Thomas Huber

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Re: What happened to these?
« Reply #4 on: February 15, 2008, 09:52:55 AM »
Just a few additions to Tony's comments:

asturicus = now enclosed in the serotinus ssp salzmanii group, which is widespread in Spain.

lazicus   = exactly scharojanii ssp lazicus - the yellow late-summer flowers from Turkey
             while the Caucasus plants are scharojanii ssp scharojanii.

clusii     = C. serotinus ssp clusii

stellaris  = an old clone, a cross between Crocus flavus and angustifolius.

biliottii    = named by George Maw 1881 by mistake, thinking it was a new species, later it turned
             out, that it was the same plant that has been described as C. aerius in 1847 by Herbert.

napolitanus = the Italian form of C. vernus ssp vernus
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Thomas Huber, Neustadt - Germany (230m)

David Nicholson

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Re: What happened to these?
« Reply #5 on: February 15, 2008, 04:01:37 PM »
Tony, between you and Thomas 100%, thanks to both of you. One day I may find a reasonably priced copy of 'The Crocus' ::)
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David Nicholson
in Devon, UK  Zone 9b
"Victims of satire who are overly defensive, who cry "foul" or just winge to high heaven, might take pause and consider what exactly it is that leaves them so sensitive, when they were happy with satire when they were on the side dishing it out"

Thomas Huber

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Re: What happened to these?
« Reply #6 on: February 15, 2008, 04:20:28 PM »
David stop dreaming and better forget it!  :'(

But if you wait 3 or 4 years more you can buy the
new monograph by Kerndorff and Pasche!
« Last Edit: February 15, 2008, 04:24:35 PM by Thomas Huber »
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Thomas Huber, Neustadt - Germany (230m)

tonyg

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Re: What happened to these?
« Reply #7 on: February 15, 2008, 09:07:43 PM »
How did I miss out clusii :-[

Glad to hear there is a new monograph in the pipeline.  Curiously I had a conversation with a (part-time) publisher this week :o - he hopes to produce a work on crocus when his current subject is complete.   Don't start jumping to conclusions though :)
« Last Edit: February 16, 2008, 04:54:04 PM by tonyg »
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David Nicholson

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Re: What happened to these?
« Reply #8 on: February 15, 2008, 09:20:31 PM »
Quote from: tonyg on February 15, 2008, 09:07:43 PM
How did I miss out clusii :-[

Glad to hear there is a new monograph in the pipeline.  Curiously I had a conversation with a (part-time) publisher this week :o - he hopes to produce a work on crocus when his current subject.   Don't start jumping to conclusions though :)

Well, there you go!!!!! ??? 8) ::)
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David Nicholson
in Devon, UK  Zone 9b
"Victims of satire who are overly defensive, who cry "foul" or just winge to high heaven, might take pause and consider what exactly it is that leaves them so sensitive, when they were happy with satire when they were on the side dishing it out"

mark smyth

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Re: What happened to these?
« Reply #9 on: February 15, 2008, 10:33:40 PM »
very exciting news. Will it be filled with photos?
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tonyg

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Re: What happened to these?
« Reply #10 on: February 15, 2008, 11:56:04 PM »
More to the point, will it sort out the grey areas of nomenclature?   Surely you get enough pictures here Mark! :)
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mark smyth

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Re: What happened to these?
« Reply #11 on: February 15, 2008, 11:59:12 PM »
My computer may be in the bed room but I cant take to bed with me
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Antrim, Northern Ireland Z8
www.snowdropinfo.com / www.marksgardenplants.com / www.saveourswifts.co.uk

When the swifts arrive empty the green house

All photos taken with a Canon 900T and 230

tonyg

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Re: What happened to these?
« Reply #12 on: February 16, 2008, 12:05:35 AM »
Get a wireless laptop then ;D
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Otto Fauser

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Re: What happened to these?
« Reply #13 on: February 16, 2008, 03:54:09 AM »
Quote from: Thomas Huber on February 15, 2008, 04:20:28 PM
David stop dreaming and better forget it!  :'(

But if you wait 3 or 4 years more you can buy the
new monograph by Kerndorff and Pasche!

 THomas , I,m dreaming too to see a new monograpy by Kerndorff & Pasche, however Erich told me a few months ago , finding a publisher for a limited market =small printrun, has so far proved unsuccessful.
 Pity I gave my spare copy of THE CROCUS away recently as a present.
« Last Edit: February 16, 2008, 11:09:49 PM by Maggi Young »
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Gerry Webster

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Re: What happened to these?
« Reply #14 on: February 16, 2008, 09:51:27 AM »
It doesn't surprise me at all that Kerndorff & Pasche are having difficulties in finding a publisher for a monograph on Crocus. I'm not holding my breath.
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