Scottish Rock Garden Club Forum
Bulbs => Galanthus => Topic started by: Brian Ellis on January 24, 2017, 12:07:38 PM
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I have been sent a list of 'Gold Group' snowdrops - whatever that means and there were some that were not listed such as Anne's Dryad Gold Group and Taavi Tuulik's Estonian Spirit Group so I have cranked up the brain cells and put this together. I wonder if there are many that I have not included - there are bound to be some glaring omissions, and it would be good to have others opinions as to what is missing/shouldn't be included. I had thought that if there was enough interest we could also put up photos so that they were all in one place - like we did with the Galanthus that are truly easy to recognize thread. What do others think? Here is a basic list!
Updated list starts here:
http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=15063.msg370708#msg370708 (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=15063.msg370708#msg370708)
Andrew Thorpe
Anglesey Orange Tip (http://johngrimshawsgardendiary.blogspot.co.uk/2010/02/sensational-snowdrops.html)
Anglesey Aurora
Anita
Beloglavi (http://www.botanic-gardens-ljubljana.com/en/component/plants/galanthus-nivalis-beloglavi)
Belvedere Gold
Bill Bishop (Yellow form)
Bill Boardman
Bill Clark
ex Blackthorn Sandersii Group
Blasses Wesen
Blonde Betty
Blonde Erica
Blonde Inge
Bloomer
Bohemia Gold
Carinthian Summer
Carinthian Sun
Carolyn Elwes (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=12555.msg319499#msg319499)
Ceri Roberts
Chadwick’s Cream
Chameleon
Chatton
Chrome Yellow
Chthonic
Crème Anglaise
Curry
Daglingworth Yellow = Ronald Mackenzie)
Daisy Sunshine
Das Gelbe vom Ei
Doddington
Dryad Gold Bullion
Dryad Gold Charm
Dryad Gold Ingot
Dryad Gold Medal
Dryad Gold Nugget
Dryad Gold Ribbon
Dryad Gold Sovereign
Dryad Gold Star
Ecusson d’Or (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=12555.msg319491#msg319491)
Elizabeth Harrison
Elles Dream
Ellie Boardman
Estonian Spirit Group
Feodora
Fiona’s Gold
‘Flavascens’ Sandersii Group
Gelbe Marlu
Ghost
Gilt Edge
Gold Dust
Gold Edge ex Gunter Waldorf
Gold Edge ex Phil Cornish
Goldcrest
Golden Boy
Golden Chalice
Golden Promise
Golden Fleece (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=12420.msg316173#msg316173)
Goldmine unofficial name no longer used
Grakes Gold
Grakes Yellow
Green Witch
Gunter Bauer
Gunter's Geist (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=6625.msg187940#msg187940http://)
Helios
Honigmund
ex Howick Sandersii Group
Howick Starlight
Howick Yellow
Ilse Bilse
Janet Aspland
Janet’s Gold
Joe's Yellow
Joy Cozens
June Boardman
Karla Tausendschön
Kristin Meier
Kullake
lagodechianus
Lady Elphinstone
Lemongrass
Lichtgeel
ex Lowick Sandersii Group
lutescens Sandersii Group
Madelaine
Malovše
Marmin
Midas
Miss Elly
Monti Picentini
Moonlight
Mother Goose
Netherhall Double Yellow
Netherhall Yellow
Nethetaler Gold
neu 3170004
Nightlight
Nivalis ex Estonia
‘Norfolk Blonde’ Sandersii Group
Ochrospeilus
Pale Cross
Paleface
Pluto
Primrose Warburg
‘Ray Cobb’ Sandersii Group
Rheingold
Robert Wijnen
Ronald Mackenzie =Daglingworth Yellow
Ruby’s Gold
Rumeni A
Rumenoglavi
Sandersii Group
Sarah Dumont
‘Savill Gold’ Sandersii Group
Schorbuser Irrlicht (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=12602.msg320375#msg320375)
Schorbuser Lampion
Schwefelgeschwafel
Senne's Sunrise
Sharman’s Late
Spetchley Yellow
Spindlestone Surprise
Steve's Yellow
The Whin’s Yellow
Treasure Island
Trym (Yellow form)
Twilight
Utrecht Goud
Utrecht Lime
Wandlebury Ring
Webb’s Gold
Wendy’s Gold
Windesheim
Windsor Yellow
Wisp
Wolfgang’s Gold
Woodpeckers = n.sandersii ex Cox
Yellow Angel'
Zarnikova
edit by maggi to add some hyperlinks to photos
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Golden Fleece = Trym yellow form
Woodpeckers = Galanthus nivalis sandersii ex (Lallie) Cox
I think this is a good idea, Brian, although I have only one or two of the named ones so I won't be much help with photographs. I also have a couple of my own yellows under evaluation but I'm not yet sure if they are good enough to be named.
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Good idea, and though I don't have much to contribute, but I'm sure I will read this thread many times later. :)
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Brian, that is a lovely list already ! You can add Carinthian Sun and Carinthian Summer, 2 lovely yellows selected by Gerhard Raschun from Austria.
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Just thinking about it, other ones you can add to this are;
Chameleon
Anita
Twillight
Ghost
Gunter Bauer
Nethetaler Gold
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A reminder of this thread.... http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=12555.0 (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=12555.0) .....a few pictures there.
and also this thread on the Dryad Gold series :
http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=13222.0 (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=13222.0)
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Mention was made once of Anglesey Spiky, said to be golden..... ???
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Thanks for the extras, now adding... :D
How I forgot 'Twilight' I don't know but thereby hangs a sad tale.
Any photographic donations welcome too!!
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Here's a few photos to start with which we have used on the other thread.
Blonde Inge, Carolyn Elwes and Ecusson d'Or
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Elizabeth Harrison, Grakes Gold and Lady Elphinstone
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Norfolk Blonde, Ronald Mackenzie, Twilight, Wandlebury Ring
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See here for Snowdropman's list of yellows from 2012
http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=8427.msg227831#msg227831 (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=8427.msg227831#msg227831)
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Thanks Maggi, I did absorb it into the list.
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Yes, I thought so - well done for this Brian.
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I could be wrong but my impression is that Joe Sharman's attempt to breed a yellow analogue of 'Trym' gave rise to more than one seedling. A picture of one of these appeared in Gunter Waldorf's book captioned as Yellow Trym. Ultimately one of these seedling was given the name 'Golden Fleece'. I'm not sure if 'Golden Fleece' and Yellow Trym are one and the same but if Yellow Trym is different, will ever be distributed? Yellow Trym may only ever be known as a picture in a book.
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Twilight looks great in the photo
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Thanks Emma, unfortunately it did not like being dug up last year for a swap at all and I am keeping my fingers crossed that I still have one.
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A wonderful idea to list and show all the yellows, Brian!
Are ´Audrey Vockins´and ´Günter´s Geist´considered to be different clones? Once they were suspected to be the same, I think.
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Yes, I think you are correct Mariette, will indicate this.
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´Feodora´by Nicolas Top may be added, it´s still grown by some collectors in Germany and quite nice.
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Excellent, thank you Mariette.
I realise that this list actually contains several types of snowdrop, the Yellows, the GRYMs (Green receptacle yellow mark) - my favourite group, the Ethereal - very pale like the 'Estonian Spirit' group, changelings such as Schorbuser Irrlicht which becomes more yellow as the season progresses and those which are 'tinted' such as 'Anglesey Aurora' which have another tint. I will have a think and try and put the ones I know into a sub-section later on.
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Thanks Emma, unfortunately it did not like being dug up last year for a swap at all and I am keeping my fingers crossed that I still have one.
I'm hoping to grab a twilight at Myddleton
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I'm hoping to grab a twilight at Myddleton
Nothing like a grab in the twilight Em ;D
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Haha ;D I don't intend to start queuing at twilight for Myddleton!
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Some pictures from Hagen - many thanks: 'Chadwick's Cream' (on the right), 'Das Gelbe vom Ei', 'Golden Chalice'
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...and some more. 'Ilse Bilse', 'Schorbuser Irrlicht' and 'Schorbuser Lampion' - now added to list.
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Must say that the pix of Hagen's yellows and those of Anne W have changed my mind about yellows. Anne's are robust little chaps, and I hope one day to be able to have them in the garden. Otherwise I'm still thinking about a lottery ticket!
Before Anne's yellows and the beautiful Elizabeth Harrison, the few yellows tried have proved very feeble here.
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Before Anne's yellows and the beautiful Elizabeth Harrison, the few yellows tried have proved very feeble here.
You can rely on Anne's yellows Maggi, very robust, some others are unreliable in terms of colour and robustness!
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Perhaps it would be wise to quote Gunter Waldorf in this thread for the inexperienced grower of yellows. He writes in his book ‘Snowdrops’ when describing some of the yellow varieties, that ‘the colour becomes more intense in its second year after planting in situ’. It follows that some varieties would need to settle down again once replanted from splitting/moving/swapping which goes for lots of the snowdrops which have unusual marking.
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I'll plough on with some more pictures of GRYM snowdrops. 'Anita' and 'Chameleon' - well named for, as it ages it changes colour as you can see in the second picture.
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You might be right, Brian. I think also the colour might be more intense in full natural light, rather than under glass. Maybe something to do with the UV.
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You might be right, Brian. I think also the colour might be more intense in full natural light, rather than under glass. Maybe something to do with the UV.
I think that is true for quite a few of them Anne, my 'Gold Sovereign' is a much better colour this year, a real delight now it has settled in :D
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I imagine the increased intensity referred to, was an intense yellow, as opposed to green, particularly after two to four years. Having collected yellows for over 20 years, I have only experienced the 'settling' phenomenon with one snowdrop and certainly not, for example, with any of the Dryad Gold series: all of mine have been bright yellow from the first year. Perhaps this indicates the importance, for inexperienced growers, of sourcing from a supplier that provides adequate warnings if 'settling' is a known issue.
All this,of course, depends on the plant appearing at all!
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"settling" is one thing I would not get hung up about personally - because it seems to very common in galanthus -for me robustness is much more important. Any number of flowers it seems, especially snowdrops, for sure , seem to take ages to settle into a particular shape or colour and it is my belief that chipping can sometimes contribute to the uncertainty. 'Drops do seem to be particularly prone to this - perhaps because a "new" one is so eagelry leapt upon and chipped st speed , perhaps before the reliability of the new feature had been established! Cynical, me? Surely not!
Anyhow, that's why I'm more interested in a plant which proves itself quite fast to be able to establish and multiply itself rather than just be different. Anyone's head may be turned by a pretty face, of course!
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Whilst we are giving hints on growing yellow snowdrops, many prefer acidic soils and this can be enhanced by using things like pine needles to mulch them - much like Trilliums.
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Might be an idea for me to try one under a little pine then -worth a try. Thanks Brian.
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I have extracted those which I know to be in the Sandersii group, these are:
ex Blackthorn
Chatton
Doddington
Feodora
Flavascens
Golden Boy
Grakes Gold
Grakes Yellow
ex Howick
Howick Yellow
Janet Apsland
ex Lowick
lutescens
Netherhall Yellow
Norfolk Blonde
Ray Cobb
Ruby’s Gold
Rumenoglavi
sandersii
Savill Gold
Spetchley Yellow
Windesheim
Windsor Yellow
Woodpeckers
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... and those in the GRYM group ie Green Receptacle Yellow Mark that I know for certain:
Anita
Blonde Inge
Chameleon
Das Gelbe vom Ei
Golden Chalice
Ilse Bilse
Lady Elphinstone
Robert Wijnen
Schorbuser Irrlicht
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For want of a better description those that are tinted in some way:
Anglesey Orange Tip
Anglesey Aurora
Chadwick’s Cream
Crème Anglaise
Joy Cozens
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Mention was made once of Anglesey Spiky, said to be golden..... ???
I am told that this is not the case so I have removed it from the list.
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´Feodora´belongs to the Sandersii group, too, I think.
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You might like to add Moonlight to the list, shown in my talks at Shaftesbury and Colesbourne.
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Thanks Mariette and Steve have changed the lists accordingly. Amy further details on 'Moonlight' Steve, or photos to add?
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Might be an idea for me to try one under a little pine then -worth a try. Thanks Brian.
Well it's 'Horses for courses' Maggi, I would have thought that your garden would be fine for them as you grow rhododendrons I believe ;) and, of course Ian applies loads of mulch. It may repay you to use a little pine-must as a surface dressing to pots. Here of course it is an entirely different matter as the climate and soil are totally different, the blue meconopsis have to be a labour of love, especially in the summer when we are so dry...if they only grew like they do in Scotland...
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Whilst we are giving hints on growing yellow snowdrops, many prefer acidic soils and this can be enhanced by using things like pine needles to mulch them - much like Trilliums.
On the other hand, the ones that come from the Wandlebury Ring area, which are 'Wendy's Gold', 'Bill Clark', 'Madeleine' and (of course) 'Wandlebury Ring' might reasonably be supposed to prefer the chalky soil of their native habitat.
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Funnily enough I have just had an email quoting Jorg on the German forum saying that this is a myth, yet Gunter Waldorf thought it a good idea. Obviously as I said to Maggi it depends on soil conditions and presumably whether they are sandersii or plicate crosses.
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presumably whether they are sandersii or plicate crosses.
Can you tell more about that? Does G.plicatus do better in acidic or alkaline soil?
In your list there is G.lagodechianus, is there a yellow form of it?
Two pictures
'Ray Cobb'
'Wendy's Gold'
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Thanks for the pictures Leena. G.plicatus is found in both deciduous and coniferous woodland and in many conditions where there is a lot of humus. Amazingly we can grow it quite well in our garden yet an expert grower we know, who has given lots of talks on snowdrops, finds it difficult!
I find this one of the intriguing things about growing snowdrops, there are some varieties that I simply cannot grow, no matter how I treat them and I know other people have said the same thing.
You might like to take a look at Tom Mitchell's excellent blog from last year, here is the plicatus page:
http://www.revolution-snowdrops.co.uk/galanthus-plicatus/ (http://www.revolution-snowdrops.co.uk/galanthus-plicatus/)
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Thanks Brian.
With my short experience G.plicatus (I have 10 different ones, 3 nameless and 8 cultivars) grows well and multiplies here in my garden (I hope now that I wrote it, there won't be losses this spring ::)), and I like it very much.
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Thanks Brian.
With my short experience G.plicatus (I have 10 different ones, 3 nameless and 8 cultivars) grows well and multiplies here in my garden (I hope now that I wrote it, there won't be losses this spring ::) ), and I like it very much.
Leena - It would be interesting to know which plicatus do well for you. Do you grow Three' Ships' successfully?
Some of the plicatus are cranky and/or slow here.
Also do you grow lagodechianus as well? Here it multiplies like mad but has never flowered. We got it as kemulariae from Don Armstrong who got it from Thelma Chapman and she likely got it from a prominent plantsman in the UK back in the late 70's.
john
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Brian,
I am just weighing in with a huge "Thank you"! So good to have an updated listing of yellows. Nice work.
Rick
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Brian,
I am just weighing in with a huge "Thank you"! So good to have an updated listing of yellows. Nice work.
Rick
You are very welcome Rick, I was doing it for myself out of boredome interest and thought others might like to see what I came up with. Hopefully as the season goes on Leena and Steve will be joined by others adding photos to show what they are like.
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Galanthus doing well in Finland
Leena - It would be interesting to know which plicatus do well for you. Do you grow Three' Ships' successfully?
Some of the plicatus are cranky and/or slow here.
Also do you grow lagodechianus as well? Here it multiplies like mad but has never flowered. We got it as kemulariae from Don Armstrong who got it from Thelma Chapman and she likely got it from a prominent plantsman in the UK back in the late 70's.
john
I answer here though my answer isn't yellow. :) I couldn't think of a better thread, but Maggi can move this if it is better somewhere else. :)
I grow G.lagodechianus, it was bought from Estonia with origin from nature (but I can't remember now where). I planted one bulb in 2012 and this is how it looked last summer, so it multiplies well, and flowers, but not so well as many other snowdrops.
About G.plicatus: I planted my first plicatus in autum 2011, three bulbs of nameless G.plicatus from Augis bulbs. They grow in acid moist soil next to Rhododendrons and have multiplied so well that I have already divided them twice. The first picture is of the original place and the second from another bed where I planted it two years ago.
Then in summer 2013 I planted 'Bill Clark' (it has not multiplied!), 'Wendy's Gold', 'Diggory', 'Oreanda' and an unnamed late G.plicatus I got from Gail, which I like very much. In 2014 I planted 'Trymming' and 'Washfield Warham', and because all earlier ones seemed to do well, I bought an expensive one: 'E.A.Bowles' :o . That year I also planted 'Gerard Parker', Copton Trym' and an unnamed G.plicatus from Bondarenko (of wild origin). They all flowered well last year, so last summer I planted again some more: 'Colossus', 'The Pearl' and 'Sophie North', which I'm looking forward to seeing in the spring.
So, actually I have longer experience only from few G.plicatus, (and I don't have 'Three Ships'), and it may be that I spoke too early, but we'll see in few more years.
Some more pictures: 'Diggory' one bulb planted in 2013 looked like this last summer.
G.plicatus from Gail, two bulbs in 2013 looked like this last summer.
(Edit by maggi to add "title" to help search engine )
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You are very welcome Rick, I was doing it for myself out of boredome interest and thought others might like to see what I came up with. Hopefully as the season goes on Leena and Steve will be joined by others adding photos to show what they are like.
;D ;D ;D...boredome interest ! I get it, but it will be a valuable tool for crazy collectors like myself who love to grow the yellows. Have a fine time tomorrow, Brian and all of you who are braving the elements at Myddleton. It will be well worth it when you find that "have to have" add to your collections. Go with sharp elbows and kind hearts! Rick
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Dryad Gold Sovereign yesterday, I'm determined to keep the slugs off most of my snowdrops and daffs this year.
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Dryad Gold Sovereign yesterday, I'm determined to keep the slugs off most of my snowdrops and daffs this year.
lovely group Anne!
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Val Bourne on yellow drops - and others too :
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/gardening/how-to-grow/hot-trail-elusive-gold-snowdrops/ (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/gardening/how-to-grow/hot-trail-elusive-gold-snowdrops/)
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Super photo Anne, pleased you put the link up Maggi as Val said today about it.
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Just opened Monksilver sales list and found Peter Erskine's 'Monti Picentini' which Joe describes as the only yellow nivalis selection from Italy, added to list.
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Is 'Midas' on the list Brian? ;)
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our small path through the yellow world of galanthus
... gold between the green ...
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Val Bourne on yellow drops - and others too :
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/gardening/how-to-grow/hot-trail-elusive-gold-snowdrops/ (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/gardening/how-to-grow/hot-trail-elusive-gold-snowdrops/)
For those interested in Midas there is now an update from Avon!
"Galanthus Midas: Val Bourne's article in the Gardening section of the Saturday Telegraph of 28th January suggests that we are now at the point of selling bulbs of this plant. In fact they need a little longer to grow and are due to be made available for sale as dormant bulbs in the summer 2017. There will not be quite as many available as suggested if one follows the numbers in the article too literally and their price has yet to be fixed, that will depend on how many are harvested and are then judged to be of flowering size." :)
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Is 'Midas' on the list Brian? ;)
It is now!! Especially as it is now going to be available ;)
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our small path through the yellow world of galanthus
... gold between the green ...
What a tease Hagen, you know how I like these GRYM snowdrops!
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If ´Blonde Inge´ist the prototype of the GRYMs, ´Wolfgang´s Gold´may be the prototype of the YGRMs?
[attach=1]
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If ´Blonde Inge´ist the prototype of the GRYMs, ´Wolfgang´s Gold´may be the prototype of the YGRMs?
(Attachment Link)
so it is Mariette,
but I like to prefer the name of the first cultivar with these said properties. So I use MERLIN,ROBIN HOOD, VIRESCENS, BLONDE INGE ...
Goood to see WOLFGANGS GOLD does it very well in your hands ...
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What a tease Hagen, you know how I like these GRYM snowdrops!
MOTHER GOOSE will start to flower here next days. I'm a little bit crazy for the GRYM/BI too ;)
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Nice to see 'Wolfgang's Gold' it's not one I have seen and you are absolutely right Mariette YGRM indeed ;) The long yellow receptacle is super.
Hagen you are well ahead of me, 'Mother Goose' is barely through the ground and 'Das Gelbe vom ei' much the same.
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Nice to see 'Wolfgang's Gold' it's not one I have seen and you are absolutely right Mariette YGRM indeed ;) The long yellow receptacle is super.
Hagen you are well ahead of me, 'Mother Goose' is barely through the ground and 'Das Gelbe vom ei' much the same.
All are in a greenhouse, so it is easy to be the first ...
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Does 'Bloomer' count? ( http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=14000.msg349961#msg349961 (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=14000.msg349961#msg349961) )
[attachimg=1]
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Two more YRGMs (could do with a niftier acronym. how about YOGIM - yellow ovary, green inner mark)
Dryad Gold Nugget
[attach=1]
Dryad Gold Ingot
[attach=2]
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Does 'Bloomer' count? ( http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=14000.msg349961#msg349961 (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=14000.msg349961#msg349961) )
(Attachment Link)
I should think it does as one of the 'Gold Group' which is where I think the term is too broad! I'll add it Maggi. Fancy you knowing that ;)
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.... how about YOGIM - yellow ovary, green inner mark)
Good thinking Anne, Ido like a good acronym. They are lovely.
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You can read about the Dryad Gold series of galanthus in IRG (International Rock Gardener e-magazine) of June 2016 - http://www.srgc.org.uk/logs/logdir/2015Jun251435252604IRG_66.pdf (http://www.srgc.org.uk/logs/logdir/2015Jun251435252604IRG_66.pdf)
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I've just been in warm fluffy haze , drooling at the mouth ::) ......back to reality ::)..I've actually been reading SRGC International Rock Gardener magazine by Hagen and noticed another one missing from the list 'Blonde Erika' .I also grow one from Holland nivalis 'Blonde Betty' .
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I think Green witch turned into Monti Picentini, which is a far better name in my humble opinion.
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It would be helpful to know which category added snowdrops belong too: sandersii, GRYM, YOGIM etc which would add to the usefulness of the list. When the weather is not so good I'll indicate on the original list at the top of the thread.
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I've just been in warm fluffy haze , drooling at the mouth ::) ......back to reality ::)..I've actually been reading SRGC International Rock Gardener magazine by Hagen and noticed another one missing from the list 'Blonde Erika' .I also grow one from Holland nivalis 'Blonde Betty' .
Thanks Steve I've amended the list accordingly!
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A very generous forumist recently sent me 'Golden promise' :-*
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A very generous forumist recently sent me 'Golden promise' :-*
That was kind of her.
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Well I should be outside in the garden but thought it was long overdue to start to section the snowdrops so here they are. Do PM me if you can attribute any of the others to these first groups and I will move them.
G.nivalis sandersii
Alan Clark
ex Blackthorn
Chatton
Doddington
Feodora
Flavascens
Golden Boy
Grakes Gold
Grakes Yellow
Gunter's Geist
ex Howick
Howick Yellow
Janet Aspland
ex Lowick
lutescens
Moonshine
Netherhall Yellow
Norfolk Blonde
Ray Cobb
Rheingold
Ruby’s Gold
Rumenoglavi
Savill Gold
Schwefelfee
Spetchley Yellow
Windesheim
Windsor Yellow
Woodpeckers = n.sandersii ex Cox
GRYM (Green Receptacle Yellow Mark)
Anita
Blonde Erika
Blonde Inge
Chameleon
Das Gelbe vom Ei
Gold Dust
Golden Chalice
Honigmund
Ilse Bilse
Karla Tausendschön
Kristin Meier
Lady Elphinstone
Robert Wijnen
Schorbuser Irrlicht
Schorbuser Lampion
Silver and Gold
Silvia
Tricky Treasure
YOGIM (Yellow Ovary Green Inner Mark)
Dryad Gold Ingot
Dryad Gold Nugget
Kelways - not yet available (see Edrom's site)
Wolfgang’s Gold
Ethereal (Overall pale colouring)
Blasses Wesen
Chthonic
Estonian Spirit Group
Ghost
Judith's Yelbino
Paleface
Tinted in some way
Anglesey Candlelight
Anglesey Orange Tip
Anglesey Aurora
Chadwick’s Cream
Crème Anglaise
Curry
Joy Cozens
Schwefelgeschwafel
Senne's Sunrise
Doubles
Lady Elphinstone
Netherhall Double Yellow
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Still to be attributed
Andrew Thorpe
Beloglavi
Belvedere Gold
Bill Bishop (Yellow form)
Bill Boardman
Bill Clark
Blonde Betty
Bloomer
Bohemia Gold
Carinthian Summer
Carinthian Sun
Carolyn Elwes
Ceri Roberts
Chrome Yellow
Daglingworth Yellow = Ronald Mackenzie)
Daisy Sunshine
Donaugold
Dryad Gold Bullion
Dryad Gold Charm
Dryad Gold Medal
Dryad Gold Ribbon
Dryad Gold Sovereign
Dryad Gold Star
Ecusson d’Or
Elizabeth Harrison
Elles Dream
Ellie Boardman
Fiona’s Gold
Frohnauer Gold
Gelbe Marlu
Gilt Edge
Gold Digger (plicatus seedling from Wendy's Gold)
Gold Edge ex Gunter Waldorf is a Gp from the Merlin-group, only faded with yellow
Gold Edge ex Phil Cornish
Gold Fever (plicatus seedling from Wendy's Gold)
Gold Vein (plicatus seedling from Wendy's Gold)
Goldcrest
Golden Promise
Golden Fleece
Goldmine unofficial name no longer used
Green Witch syn. Monti Picentini
Gunter Bauer
Helios
Howick Starlight
Howick Yellow
Janet’s Gold
Joe's Yellow
June Boardman
Kullake
lagodechianus
Lemongrass
Lichtgeel
Madelaine
Malovše
Marmin
Midas
Miss Elly
Monti Picentini syn. Green Witch
Moonlight
Mother Goose
Nethetaler Gold
neu 3170004
Nightlight
Nivalis ex Estonia
Ochrospeilus
Pale Cross
Paleface
Pluto
Primrose Warburg
Ronald Mackenzie =Daglingworth Yellow
Rumeni A
Sarah Dumont
Sharman’s Late
Spindlestone Surprise
Steve's Yellow
The Whin’s Yellow
Treasure Island
Trym (Yellow form)
Twilight
Utrecht Goud
Utrecht Lime
Wandlebury Ring
Webb’s Gold
Wendy’s Gold
Wisp
Yellow Angel'
Zarnikova
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'Yellow Angel' must be in a class of its own as an albino with a yellow receptacle. http://johngrimshawsgardendiary.blogspot.co.uk/2013/02/winter-gardens-tour.html (http://johngrimshawsgardendiary.blogspot.co.uk/2013/02/winter-gardens-tour.html)
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'Yellow Angel' must be in a class of its own as an albino with a yellow receptacle. http://johngrimshawsgardendiary.blogspot.co.uk/2013/02/winter-gardens-tour.html (http://johngrimshawsgardendiary.blogspot.co.uk/2013/02/winter-gardens-tour.html)
I think it would sit with Audrey Vockins syn Gunter's Geist in the tinted group? No, perhaps not...but no doubt there are others for which that could be said and we could endlessly divide the list, far better to have a few in a group don't you think?
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Does anybody know which name has priority, ´Audrey Vockins´or ´Günters Geist´?
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Does anybody know which name has priority, ´Audrey Vockins´or ´Günters Geist´?
Mariette I am about to separate them. According to Freda Cox 'Audrey Vockins' is a plicatus and 'Günter's Geist' is sandersii although in Günter's book he says they are the same plant. Perhaps someone who grows them can let us know.
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... far better to have a few in a group don't you think?
Absolute, but some obvious groupings will give rise to small groups e.g.
Doubles
Lady Elphinstone
Netherhall Double Yellow
and I think that's the lot for that group.
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I think it would sit with Audrey Vockins syn Gunter's Geist in the tinted group? No, perhaps not...but no doubt there are others for which that could be said and we could endlessly divide the list, far better to have a few in a group don't you think?
Thanks for Your effort, Brian! It would be great to learn that there are already three of this kind, which I like so very much. Another may be the G. r.o. Ruben showed earlier, but that one was not named, then.
´Kelways´may join the YOGIM group, if it becomes available.
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Mariette, I think G.Kelways in filtering out slowly.
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Just a little note about 'Midas' - Alan asked me to say that although Val's article says that there are possibly 300 bulbs now - these are all at various stages of growth and are certainly not all flowering size yet!! ;)
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Actually Val's article said that there were 300 bulbs in 2015 and that these were then chopped into 8 or 16 depending on size. The implication was that there should be approximately 3600 bulbs by now! I appreciate that is not correct!
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Blasses Wesen, is coming fresh after ts, ethereal Group
Blonde Erika, GRYM
Gilt Edge (from Günter Waldorf) is a Gp from the Merlin-group, only faded with yellow
Silver and Gold (from Jörg Lebsa) GRYM
Honigmund, GRYM
Karla Tausendschön, GRYM
Kristin Meier, GRYM
Schwefelgeschwafel, only starting with a yellow in the basal mark turns later to greenish
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Oh Hagen how could you add all those to the GRYM group? I shall spend the rest of my life looking for them ::)
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Oh Hagen how could you add all those to the GRYM group? I shall spend the rest of my life looking for them ::)
But you know Brian, I'm also a lover of the GRYM group like you!
The only difference I call this goup BLONDE INGE group ;)
And I'm a lover of the invers BLONDE INGE group too ...:)
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here is an example for the invers BI group ...
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That one is very pretty!
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It is pretty isn't it? There's something very attractive about these bi-coloured flowers. Thanks for showing us anther one Hagen.
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WOLFGANG'S GOLD in a glowing greenish yellow. I felt in love to this shy beauty again and again
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Hagen - Now that IS distinct! Pure elegance and with such a very warm glow.
john
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Hagen - Now that IS distinct! Pure elegance and with such a very warm glow.
john
Better to say, I'm in love or I'm loving ....?! ;)
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Better to say, I'm in love or I'm loving ....?! ;)
"I'm loving" is a statement of that moment in time, implying an immediate, possibly exaggerated, reaction to something you are seeing or tasting or doing for the first time. "I'm in love" implies an emotion that is ongoing. So unless your feeling for the snowdrop are fickle, in love one day, out of love the next, "I'm in love" would be better.
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WOLFGANG'S GOLD in a glowing greenish yellow. I felt in love to this shy beauty again and again
That one is stunning Hagen and has gone straight to the top of my wants list. Wow :o :o
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It is gorgeous!
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I'm very much an interested observer (rather than a grower) in Brian's listing of yellow snowdrops and especially those he has grouped together as Galanthus nivalis sandersii. At random I've just picked out two pictures of snowdrops from this group, G. 'Ray Cobb' and G. 'Howick Yellow' and they do strike me as being very much (essentially) the same unless you experts can convince me otherwise. Would this be true of the others in this group and if so what are the merits of having a whole host of plants that look the same all with different names?
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... what are the merits of having a whole host of plants that look the same all with different names?
Not a lot on the face of it; that's why they are all grouped together as sandersii. The fact that they were given names is either because it was done before there were so many or because they have some none-visual characteristic that is deemed to make them distinct (or dare I say, possibly because the ego of the person naming them demanded it). Sandersii have a general reputation for being a bit miffy so a good vigorous one might be worth naming - even if it looks just the same as all the others.
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... they do strike me as being very much (essentially) the same unless you experts can convince me otherwise. Would this be true of the others in this group and if so what are the merits of having a whole host of plants that look the same all with different names?
I agree with Alan, and that is one of the reasons for grouping them together, one or two are much more golden, have yellower scapes or whatever but who is to know when starting a collection? At least if you know they are Galanthus nivalis sandersii you won't keep buying things that are very similar, unless of course you wish too!
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Thanks for the replies chaps. It was a serious question I was asking and not a joke. Doesn't the whole situation cry out for a properly recognised (by growers, breeders and nurseries) registration process. The National Auricula and Primula Society will only invite members to name their plants if they have been entered in a seedling class and won a first prize. Of course the drawback to that is it doesn't stop every other Tom, Dick , Harry and Jill who are not members of NAPS naming their plants and results in the situation now that we have umpteen allionii plants that all look the same.
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Doesn't the whole situation cry out for a properly recognised (by growers, breeders and nurseries) registration process.
There is a registration process. It is operated by the KAVB in the Netherlands. I have used it, as has Anne Wright. But otherwise I think it's fair to say that it is ignored in the UK.
You just came back from a meeting with 4 snowdrops for £11. Did you ask if they were registered? Until Joe Punter snowdrop buyer regards it as desirable to be purchasing a registered snowdrop then few people will bother to register.
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Well I don't usually buy them and certainly not at the ridiculous prices that pertain in the current market, I have friends who give them to me on occasions. I wouldn't have bought these if I hadn't wanted a few other than nivalis to fill a space and I was amazed when I was told that one of them would have cost between £24 and £30 from a specialist. I normally won't pay more £5 for any plant or bulb.
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Well I don't usually buy them and certainly not at the ridiculous prices that pertain in the current market, I have friends who give them to me on occasions. I wouldn't have bought these if I hadn't wanted a few other than nivalis to fill a space and I was amazed when I was told that one of them would have cost between £24 and £30 from a specialist. I normally won't pay more £5 for any plant or bulb.
Well it is certainly an education to watch the prices on eBay, unfortunately they seem to have had the effect of encouraging some suppliers to put their prices up too...
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I agree with Alan, and that is one of the reasons for grouping them together, one or two are much more golden, have yellower scapes or whatever but who is to know when starting a collection? At least if you know they are Galanthus nivalis sandersii you won't keep buying things that are very similar, unless of course you wish too!
For me this is good to know, thank you. I wonder if all would grow over here the same way or if there are difference in that respect..
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This is my yellow:
- first two photos are from yesterday
- third from 31 December 2016 showing golden colours of new, emerging shoots
- fourth showing mature plant from February 2016, showing silver channeled light green leaves
Not sure if worthy of a name as not got enough comparators but it is particularly notable for foliage and a good yellow to the ovary and inner. Found last year with three flowering bulbs (two with smaller flowers) and two small bulbs. This year the larger three bulbs are flowering again and each of these has a daughter shoot emerging.
I will keep it under review but, if name worthy, I would suggest Imogen's gold, as it was found as the tail end of Storm Imogen was passing through and was clearly a bit battered!
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nb the green nivalis in the pot this season was included in error on re-potting but serves well to show the colour by comparison!
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It'a a good strong yellow inner mark judging by the photos - but it is difficult to tell online. I'd compare it to others that you see at events, grow or see in other growers gardens before naming it if it were mine.
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I have just added Galanthus nivalis sandersii group 'Alan Clark' to the list, Paul Christian says:
A taller and more strongly growing form of the yellow Northumberland Snowdrop which arose in the garden of the eponymous gardener, as a variant of the 'normal form', which in turn he received from a garden '20 miles from Alnwick' many years before. .....
Released 2012 for the first time though a few left our garden in 2009 unbeknown to ourselves! It is also possible that other plants were gifted elsewhere when we received ours.
This illustrates nicely why it is good to hold fire on naming, this could have been named in the first garden in which it was found and then named for Alan Clark. It is also possible that if some were taken (?) in 2009 they could also have been named!
...and the reason to grow it??
The yellow colouration seems, if anything, a little brighter and more intense than 'plain' Sandersii and the flowers spread open nicely in warm sun, however it is for the larger flower size, broader, greyer leaves and stronger constitution all on a plant 25% taller, that this clone was selected.
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But in a way it also illustrates why it's NOT a good idea to hold fire on naming. If the owner of the garden where it was initially found did indeed gift it elsewhere then it could also be circulating under a completely different name, possibly several different names. My opinion is that if you start to circulate a bulb you have to give it some sort of designation so that it can subsequently be traced back to its point of origin.
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At random I've just picked out two pictures of snowdrops from this group, ...and they do strike me as being very much (essentially) the same unless you experts can convince me otherwise. Would this be true of the others in this group and if so what are the merits of having a whole host of plants that look the same all with different names?
David, I have a good deal of sympathy with your point. It could also be applied to a host of greentips whose main differentiation is the number of noughts on Ebay prices. Poculiforms are the same (literally). The growers and breeders are not the problem here, rather it is the mania amongst buyers for chasing after the latest must-have plant regardless of its garden-worthiness or whether it has some positive differentiation over existing plants. The nurseries must make profits to exist, so cannot be blamed for providing fresh fuel in the shape of exotic new varieties, for which the initial selling prices have crept up from £30 to £40 to £60 to £80 each year.
At yesterday's Open Day, visitors here were invited to take part in a vote for the snowdrop variety they were most impressed with. The winner by a distance was a clump of G. Whittallii, which dates back to 1898, and I suppose that if anyone were to sell it on Ebay it would go for £1 a bulb.
It is all of course unsustainable. A National Collection Holder in five years time will need a garden the size of the Isle of Wight to grow them all.
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my best "yellow" under glass in the greenhouse.
Would say it looks like gold ...no name so far
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This is my yellow:
- first two photos are from yesterday
- third from 31 December 2016 showing golden colours of new, emerging shoots
- fourth showing mature plant from February 2016, showing silver channeled light green leaves
Not sure if worthy of a name as not got enough comparators but it is particularly notable for foliage and a good yellow to the ovary and inner. Found last year with three flowering bulbs (two with smaller flowers) and two small bulbs. This year the larger three bulbs are flowering again and each of these has a daughter shoot emerging.
I will keep it under review but, if name worthy, I would suggest Imogen's gold, as it was found as the tail end of Storm Imogen was passing through and was clearly a bit battered!
Your yellow is certainly distinguished by it´s leaves, at least. My prefence is for yellows with (dark-) green leaves, so this one may be a step in the right direction?
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David, I have a good deal of sympathy with your point. It could also be applied to a host of greentips whose main differentiation is the number of noughts on Ebay prices. Poculiforms are the same (literally). The growers and breeders are not the problem here, rather it is the mania amongst buyers for chasing after the latest must-have plant regardless of its garden-worthiness or whether it has some positive differentiation over existing plants. The nurseries must make profits to exist, so cannot be blamed for providing fresh fuel in the shape of exotic new varieties, for which the initial selling prices have crept up from £30 to £40 to £60 to £80 each year.
At yesterday's Open Day, visitors here were invited to take part in a vote for the snowdrop variety they were most impressed with. The winner by a distance was a clump of G. Whittallii, which dates back to 1898, and I suppose that if anyone were to sell it on Ebay it would go for £1 a bulb.
It is all of course unsustainable. A National Collection Holder in five years time will need a garden the size of the Isle of Wight to grow them all.
;) ;D
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The big question has to be ... how many of these are lost, held by one person or available to buy?
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I have an Ecusson lookalike and a yellow in a raised bed where there have never been any yellows. Must check that the latter is still there after the high wind and rain. I'll pick it for a photo and discussion
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my best "yellow" under glass in the greenhouse.
Would say it looks like gold ...no name so far
OOh - a nice peep of yellow on the inner segments!
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There is a yellow called 'Donaugold' on sale on eBay: http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Galanthus-Donaugold-a-Collectors-Snowdrop-/282348654878?hash=item41bd4a911e:g:qygAAOSwopRYlGyU (http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Galanthus-Donaugold-a-Collectors-Snowdrop-/282348654878?hash=item41bd4a911e:g:qygAAOSwopRYlGyU) . I cannot find this one on the list
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my best "yellow" under glass in the greenhouse.
Would say it looks like gold ...no name so far
Hmm 'Das Rheingold'....
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Hmm 'Das Rheingold'....
Rheingold already exists ...
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Donaugold is Rudi Bauer's plant. Interestingly not "Donaugeld". Unheimlich.
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Donaugold is Rudi Bauer's plant. Interestingly not "Donaugeld". Unheimlich.
Steve, did you mean Donaugelb (Danube yellow) or real Donaugeld (Danube money)?
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Donaugold is Rudi Bauer's plant. Interestingly not "Donaugeld". Unheimlich.
;) Is ´Donaugold´found or just sold by Rudi Bauer? Some sources mention Wolfgang Kletzing as the finder - a galanthophile who is very generous, but doesn´t sell.
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Mariette - not sure - mine came from Rudi but it may be Wolfgang's plant originally.
Hagen - Gruss - I don't mind, it just feels slightly odd juxtaposing Donau = Deutsch with Gold = English. But hey, the sun is beating down, its 10C, all my snowdrops are lifting their skirts and its not today's biggest problem.Even the earliest crocus and iris reticulata are open on my Alpine bed. What next - bees!
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...and a polite forumist has gently pointed out go me that gold in English is gold in german too, so null point for Steve and back to German classes! :'(
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Rheingold already exists ...
Fasolt? Fafner? ;)
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Fasolt? Fafner? ;)
most of the yellows are small plants not giants
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But hey, the sun is beating down, its 10C, all my snowdrops are lifting their skirts and its not today's biggest problem.
I heartily applaud this sentiment
What next - bees!
I have a near-neighbour who keeps bees. They are in and out of my snowdrops throughout the winter every time the weather gets a litle warmer.
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most of the yellows are small plants not giants
Knowing your magic the golden giants will come....
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Knowing your magic the golden giants will come....
try to do my best ...
here is TRICKY TREASURE
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Hi Hagen,
So just how close to 'giant' proportions is Tricky Treasure?
Tim DH
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Very nice one, Hagen.
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Hi Hagen,
So just how close to 'giant' proportions is Tricky Treasure?
Tim DH
far, far, ......
TT is a very globular type of the Blonde-Inge-group. The shape has a normal size (but bigger than BI)
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two more of the Schorbuser Irrlicht group
different yellow
different shape
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Yet another GRYM to look out for, I shall 'have my work cut out' Hagen.
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try to do my best ...
here is TRICKY TREASURE
I love this one :)
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SCHWEFELGESCHWAFEL always starts with this hint of yellow ...
later it looses the color
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SCHWEFELGESCHWAFEL always starts with this hint of yellow ...
later it looses the color
Much like 'Chadwick's cream' which also ends up with white outers.
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Nivalis Gelbe Marlu
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Nivalis Gunter Bauer
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Nivalis Gunters Geist
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Nivalis Nettetaler Gold. Joe Sharman of Monksilvery Nursery is working on this one to get it multiplied. So it will be available in a
few years
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Nivalis Gunters Geist
Lovely!
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Great pictures Richard, is 'Gunter's Geist' nivalis??
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I would give all those yellows a home ;D
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Thank you Brian, Gunters Geist is a Nivalis.
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Thank you Brian, Gunters Geist is a Nivalis.
Thanks for the conformation, now we just need to know about 'Audrey Vockins'.
See Reply #158
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Somewhere or other we had a discussion about what soil yellow snowdrops need. This is a picture of a molehill at Wandlebury Ring, near where many of their snowdrops grow. You can see it is a rich loamy soil.
[attachimg=1]
But a little way down the hill and there is a lot more chalk. I'm surprised the moles don't hurt themselves!
[attachimg=2]
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Here is a picture of the two yellow snowdrops I have. Before I tell you the names can any of you tell me what you think they are please? There are a few perfectly ordinary ones in the same container
[attachimg=1]
edit by maggi to rotate picture
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Before I tell you the names can any of you tell me what you think they are please?
Long mark on left so 'Wendy's Gold'. Short mark on right so unidentifiable from flower alone.
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Brilliant, I'm well impressed. The one on the right was labelled Spindlestone Surprise. Thank you!
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Thanks for the conformation, now we just need to know about 'Audrey Vockins'.
I spoke to Joe this morning and he confirmed that Audrey Vockins is not a valid name for this snowdrop, apparently Günter Waldorf named the snowdrop which was going to be called 'Audrey Vockins' as 'Günter's Geist' in his book and Joe hadn't realised what he had done, however Joe has the name for another snowdrop. I have therefore removed the reference off the lists.
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Should I be binning my Bill Clark?
All leaves affected, tho' its less noticeable on older ones.
Tim DH
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Tim, the general opinion is that those marks indicate a virus and there is no way back. To prevent possible spread you are advised to bin such snowdrops. I have no personal experinece to comment on whether that really is a virus, whether it really is incurable and whether it really is likely to spread if left alone. But I wouldn't want to be the one to take a risk so I would shed a tear and bin that 'Bill Clark' if it were mine.
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Sadly I have to agree with Alan, it's not worth the risk of transfer to your other snowdrops. I would also drench the soil with something nasty or avoid planting another snowdrop there.
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Some galanthophiles have asked me whether G. Ronald Mackenzie and G.g. Lemongrass from Andy Byfield, are very similar. These two photos should provide a useful contrast between two of the great yellows. In addition to the structural details:
Ronald Mackenzie has the same colour on both the apical mark and the basal mark, Lemongrass has a bright yellow apical mark but a darker yellow/green on the basal mark.
In my experience, Ronald Mackenzie always has the two separated apical marks, whereas Lemongrass can have two or a joined inverted 'U'.
Both are good growers in my experience and both will add to the collection of any yellow devotee!
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Spot the difference:
Galanthus plicatus 'Wendy's Gold'
Galanthus nivalis Sandersii Group 'Lowick'
Galanthus 'Spindlestone Surprise'.
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Spot the difference:
Galanthus plicatus 'Wendy's Gold'
Galanthus nivalis Sandersii Group 'Lowick'
Galanthus 'Spindlestone Surprise'.
The first to a curved pedicel. The second one does not. The third would be double?
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The third would be double?
Actually, no, although I see what you mean. We actually lack a good double yellow snowdrop. There is the long-established 'Lady Elphinstone' which is sometimes yellow and the never-seen 'Netherhall Double Yellow' which I have heard is suspected of being the same as 'Lady Elphinstone' so I presume is also not reliably yellow either. And AFAIK, that's it. A lot of the 'fancy' snowdrops do not exist as doubles, although I hear tell that Joe Sharman has managed to breed a double poculiform one.
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Glad it's not something I'm doing to Lady Elphinstone then. Last two years they were yellow but came up green so far this year. Going to put them in the garden to see if they turn back next year....
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Would this be true of the others in this group and if so what are the merits of having a whole host of plants that look the same all with different names?
Money,apart from ones with bits of green on you could sow seed and end up with lots indistinguishable from most of the named ones. In the end it is harmless and if it gives people pleasure then that is okay.
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A present from a great gardener yesterday, I can't find any reference to it but he said he got it as "Late Limey" but it doesn't look very limey! Anyone know anything about it?
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Sorry, no. But due to biographical connections I was very glad to receive this one last year.
´Rheingold´
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Sorry, no. But due to biographical connections I was very glad to receive this one last year. ´Rheingold´
Nice to see & timely as well Mariette. Are you by chance related to a Rheinmaiden? Just heard Götterdämmerung in Toronto on the weekend so I trust you didn't have to use their elaborate tactics to buy that nivalis!
john
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What a wonderful thread Brian, thank you for that list of Yellows I can't believe there are so many I love Ronald Mackenzie. Even if you think some of the yellows are the same with different names. I feel quite deprived here as we only grow Spindlestone Surprise, Wendy's Gold, Sandersonii and from Otto Lady Elphinstone. I think like Maggii I will have to win Tattslotto ticket.
Thank you again.
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I left off Primrose Warburg from our tiny list.
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Nice to see & timely as well Mariette. Are you by chance related to a Rheinmaiden? Just heard Götterdämmerung in Toronto on the weekend so I trust you didn't have to use their elaborate tactics to buy that nivalis!
john
Buy? Phoo! A present of a kind goddess, of course!
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Being a bit colour blind, I am never confident I see the same colours as other people but this one looked yellow to me. It was on show at the Harlow AGS event earlier today.
[attachimg=1]
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Buy? Phoo! A present of a kind goddess, of course!
Does she ship by Air Valhalla by chance? ; )
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What a wonderful thread Brian
You are very welcome, as always it is a combined effort from other forumists too. To be honest I am staggered at how many have 'come out of the woodwork'.
It is interesting that some are very easily obtainable whilst some are almost the stuff of legends, for years I had heard of a Norfolk yellow called 'Goldcrest' and could not track down any other information about it, amazingly I now know of at least one other grower other than the finder, that it is still in existence, who found it and where they live! It gives hope for all those other snowdrops that seem to exist as just names from the past.
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Being a bit colour blind, I am never confident I see the same colours as other people but this one looked yellow to me. It was on show at the Harlow AGS event earlier today.
(Attachment Link)
Now you have me worried Alan. To me the markings and ovaries on that one are an extremely pale lima bean green. Others?
john
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...To me the markings and ovaries on that one are an extremely pale lima bean green.
Many's the time I have seen slides of purportedly 'yellow' snowdrops that do not look even remotely yellow to me. It's clearly nowhere near as yellow as the flower in the background; perhaps you are right, John.
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Perhaps you prefer something like this Alan. This is 'Gold Dust' - aptly named!
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With thanks to Gert Jan here is 'Bohemia Gold'
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Still to be attributed
Andrew Thorpe
Beloglavi
Belvedere Gold
Bill Bishop (Yellow form)
Bill Boardman
Bill Clark
Blonde Betty
Bloomer
Bohemia Gold
Carinthian Summer
Carinthian Sun
Carolyn Elwes
Ceri Roberts
Chrome Yellow
Daglingworth Yellow = Ronald Mackenzie)
Daisy Sunshine
Donaugold
Dryad Gold Bullion
Dryad Gold Charm
Dryad Gold Medal
Dryad Gold Ribbon
Dryad Gold Sovereign
Dryad Gold Star
Ecusson d’Or
Elizabeth Harrison
Elles Dream
Ellie Boardman
Fiona’s Gold
Frohnauer Gold
Gelbe Marlu
Gilt Edge
Gold Edge ex Gunter Waldorf is a Gp from the Merlin-group, only faded with yellow
Gold Edge ex Phil Cornish
Goldcrest
Golden Promise
Golden Fleece
Golden Queen
Goldmine unofficial name no longer used
Green Witch syn. Monti Picentini
Guinea Gold
Gunter Bauer
Helios
Howick Starlight
Howick Yellow
Janet’s Gold
Joe's Yellow
June Boardman
Kullake
lagodechianus
Lemongrass
Lichtgeel
Madelaine
Malovše
Marmin
Midas
Miss Elly
Monti Picentini syn. Green Witch
Moonlight
Mother Goose
Nethetaler Gold
neu 3170004
Nightlight
Nivalis ex Estonia
Ochrospeilus
Pale Cross
Paleface
Pluto
Primrose Warburg
Ronald Mackenzie =Daglingworth Yellow
Rumeni A
Sarah Dumont
Sharman’s Late
Spindlestone Surprise
Steve's Yellow
The Whin’s Yellow
Treasure Island
Trym (Yellow form)
Twilight
Utrecht Goud
Utrecht Lime
Wandlebury Ring
Webb’s Gold
Wendy’s Gold
Wisp
Yellow Angel'
Yellowhammer
Zarnikova
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I'm not sure what you are still looking for, Brian. Surely, for example, you know everything there is to know about Wendy's Gold?
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Well this list was initially passed on, as I now realise, with the system of classification employed in Hanneke's book "Galanthomania" (ie Gold Group "Does the flower have yellow, orange or apricot-coloured marks, lines or tint and/or is the ovary yellow, orange or apricot coloured?") as such there is nowhere to place the plicatus hybrids that I can see so they remain in the bulk of the list. Had I my wits about me I would have asked Hanneke when I saw her earlier this season! I am not looking for anything Alan, merely listing the yellow snowdrops. I have to admit that it is a much longer list than I ever imagined it would be although I am grateful for everyone's input.
When I first started collecting snowdrops 'Wendy's Gold' was about as exotic as you could get in the easily obtainable range available. Although there are now many more easily obtainable there are still a huge number that are hard to come by, (many of which I had never heard of as I am sure you haven't). I thought it would be of interest for both forumists and lurkers to see what else is out there.
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This list is a great idea, and I hope it will be illustrated with more pics and experiences!
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I was intrigued last year by discussions about how reliable (or otherwise) the yellow mark on 'Mother Goose' is. Now that (I assume) a few more people grow it, I'd be interested to know how many people have Green geese and how many have yellow!
Tim DH
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As good a yellow as depicted in the NG catalog.
John(M)
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Nice to hear from you this year, John.
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I was intrigued last year by discussions about how reliable (or otherwise) the yellow mark on 'Mother Goose' is. Now that (I assume) a few more people grow it, I'd be interested to know how many people have Green geese and how many have yellow!
Tim DH
We were fortunate enough to be given a very small 'Mother Goose' last year, I am pleased to say we have had two lovely golden flowers this year, I grow it near 'Das Gelbe vom Ei' and the colour is very similar.
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I was intrigued last year by discussions about how reliable (or otherwise) the yellow mark on 'Mother Goose' is. Now that (I assume) a few more people grow it, I'd be interested to know how many people have Green geese and how many have yellow!
Tim DH
The jury is still out on the stability of this snowdrop. A number of growers are still reporting green, green yellow and yellow Mother Goose. Some time is still required to see how this drop develops.
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Quite an impressive listing Brian and all who have contributed. I just saw a photo of 'Howicks Yellow' for the first time and thought I would check the master list here. It is here assuming it is the same cultivar as 'Howick Yellow'.
I am quite interested in seeing a photo of Bill Bishop (yellow form), if anyone can post it or post a link to it, I would appreciate it.
Rick
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Quite an impressive listing Brian and all who have contributed. I just saw a photo of 'Howicks Yellow' for the first time and thought I would check the master list here. It is here assuming it is the same cultivar as 'Howick Yellow'.
I am quite interested in seeing a photo of Bill Bishop (yellow form), if anyone can post it or post a link to it, I would appreciate it.
Yes Rick, Howick is a Northumberland village. Howick Hall was the home of Earl Grey, prime minister and of tea fame! A lot of the older yellow sandersii come from Northumberland. Another is the Lowick form which makes it even more confusing and perhaps this one should be described as the Howick form. There are others which arose at Howick Hall too eg 'Dame Margot Fonteyn' which is not a yellow.
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HowicK Hall has the most fantastic garden, well worth a visit if you're in the area. I appreciate you're some way from being in the areas, Rick.
[attachimg=1]
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I was greatly amused by this comment on their website:
http://www.howickhallgardens.org/thegarden.php (http://www.howickhallgardens.org/thegarden.php)
There is a large collection of snowdrops mainly planted between the wars by Lady Grey, who was a great bulb enthusiast; over time, a number of natural hybrid’s have evolved and multiplied, and every now and then boffins descend on us and give them cultivar names on what to a layman might appear to be tiny differences.
Something in my mind tells me there is a connection to Howick with Lewis Palmer the Agapanthus breeder.
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Boffins! Love it. Thanks to both Alan and Brian on the 'Howick Yellow' backdrop. Brian, your reference to Lewis Palmer is interesting as I grow a plicatus byzantinus that is attributed as coming from his old garden. That would not be Howick Hall would it?
Rick
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Brian, your reference to Lewis Palmer is interesting as I grow a plicatus byzantinus that is attributed as coming from his old garden. That would not be Howick Hall would it?
I wouldn't think so, Lewis Palmer is of the Headbourne strain of agapanthus which is the other end of the country, near Winchester so I think I may have got myself in a muddle there. Will have to check my notes - it's been a mad week!!
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I see where I have got in a muddle! Lady Grey at Howick Hall was the daughter of the 4th earl of Selborne - John Palmer, Lewis Palmer was obviously related to Lady Grey and that is why they have a great many of his agapanthus in the garden. Sorry to have misled you Rick! Just found out she was his sister!!
From an obituary:
The Hon. William Jocelyn Lewis Palmer, 3rd son of the 2nd Earl of Selborne, died in 1971. His work on Agapanthus resulted in the Headbourne hybrids, and Philadelphus 'Beauclerc' was his. He hybridised daffodils, and shortly before he died 'Larkwhistle' received an Award of Merit. His wife, Dorothy (nee Loder), was the daughter of the 1st Baron Wakehurst, the maker of the garden in Sussex now being run by Kew.
Although he was always being asked to identify plants, he had difficulty in remembering the faces of his friends. There are many amusing stories about Luly getting them mixed up, which always distressed him. Once he was heard to murmur : 'If only they were as different as snowdrops, it would be so easy' !
I like the last bit ;D ;D
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Thank you so much, Brian.
Quite an interesting and prestigious family then. And the comment about our Lewis Palmer is quite a laugh and even more so to know that the context was his obituary. As much as I love drops, I hope that is never said of me, though it is making me reflect. Still smiling with that one!
Rick
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Here, with kind permission of Gert Geenson is a photo of a new snowdrop Galanthus nivalis 'Judith's Yelbino'.
The updated list is here:
http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=15063.msg370708#msg370708 (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=15063.msg370708#msg370708)
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Need a plan B then! Maybe selling snowdrops instead?
Regarding our conversation regarding Mother Goose David, I have noticed another report of a green Mother Goose in Germany on Facebook. Seems the problem is multi-national!
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We really need a consistent position on this. Is it a stable yellow or not? It’s certainly a fine Snowdrop at its best.
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That may be tricky, David! There are those who find it consistently yellow, those who find it yellow eventually, those who find it steadfastly green and those who those who find it sometimes yellow and sometimes green.
Not unusual to find inconsistency in quite a number of drops - but forewarned can be fore-armed in this as in other cases.
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You can say the same for many snowdrops. I have seen 'Elizabeth Harrison' looking a lovely yellow but the hanging pot in the RHS London display wasn't yellow at all and attracted very little attention.
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But we’re not talking pale yellow or olive green or greenish yellow or lime. It’s as green as grass with no hint of yellow (when it’s green!) so offers no hope that it might eventually become yellow again. But perhaps it will. It’s the inconsistency that concerns me. I have many yellows and they don’t behave like this. It’s quite fascinating in a way.
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That may be tricky, David! There are those who find it consistently yellow, those who find it yellow eventually, those who find it steadfastly green and those who those who find it sometimes yellow and sometimes green.
Not unusual to find inconsistency in quite a number of drops - but forewarned can be fore-armed in this as in other cases.
That's why I prefer to buy snowdrops when I can see them doing what they should, Maggi! Don't have Mother Goose but have a couple of others that haven't been what I might have liked! When Mother Goose is yellow on a table, I might well be tempted (although it may need to get a bit cheaper first....)
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We really need a consist position on this. Is it a stable yellow or not? It’s certainly a fine Snowdrop at its best.
Good point David, the position as I see it is that Mother Goose is at best unreliable, we have problematic reports from multiple growers, using various growing conditions! Maggi's point makes this very clearly:
those who find it consistently yellow, those who find it yellow eventually, those who find it steadfastly green and those who those who find it sometimes yellow and sometimes green
The very definition of unreliable. I agree with David's point:
I have many yellows and they don’t behave like this
Even Carolyn Elwes shows more consistency than Mother Goose and that is saying something, although I hear another yellow is delivering green instead of yellow.
I prefer to buy snowdrops when I can see them doing what they should, Maggi! Don't have Mother Goose but have a couple of others that haven't been what I might have liked! When Mother Goose is yellow on a table, I might well be tempted
The problem here Josh, is that Mother Goose often starts yellow, indeed we have had reports of buyers who buy it when yellow, only to have it produce green markings the following year.
The key fact is that you should be able to rely on the seller, who should have performed adequate testing to ensure reliability before sale or if inconsistent results are known, the buyer is informed. I was told in 2016 that I should have been told, when I first informed North Green of the problem in 2015, that it usually takes 3 years to settle down, implying this problem must have been known, by North Green, in 2012, although not shared with potential buyers!!
Contrast this approach with sellers who I trust to the extent that I will take a snowdrop on their description alone without having seen the flower myself and have never been let down.
In the last two catalogues (2107 & 2018) North Green have not included such a warning in the description of Mother Goose, to ensure that buyers have the full picture, despite being advised to do this in 2016!!
it may need to get a bit cheaper first....
It is likely it would be considerably cheaper now Josh, if buyers had been given the full facts before purchasing. I doubt high prices would result from a description saying that 'it might be green, it might be yellow, it might do both, who knows'! A point worth pondering!
To ensure buyers are aware of the issues and the lack of warnings when drops are known to be potentially problematic, I will raise this topic again on the main snowdrop groups at the start of catalogue time next season and those following.
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[quote author=Blonde Ingrid link=topic=15063.msg389353#msg389353 date=1520500206
The very definition of unreliable. I agree with David's point:
Even Carolyn Elwes shows more consistency than Mother Goose and that is saying something, although I hear another yellow is delivering green instead of yellow.
The problem here Josh, is that Mother Goose often starts yellow, indeed we have had reports of buyers who buy it when yellow, only to have it produce green markings the following year.
The key fact is that you should be able to rely on the seller, who should have performed adequate testing to ensure reliability before sale
Contrast this approach with sellers who I trust to the extent that I will take a snowdrop on their description alone without having seen the flower myself and have never been let down.
In the last two catalogues (2107 & 2018) North Green have not included such a warning in the description of Mother Goose, to ensure that buyers have the full picture, despite being advised to do this in 2016!!
To ensure buyers are aware of the issues and the lack of warnings when drops are known to be potentially problematic, I will raise this topic again on the main snowdrop groups
[/quote]
But Lady Elphinstone and Blonde Inge also do this, and you are not complaining about them.
This year my Lady Elphinstone have been wonderfully yellow but last year not. Everyone
accepts this and grows it anyway. Okay Mother Goose is more expensive but considering
how many good classic well known snowdrops North Green have been responsible for I think
you are being harsh. Just enjoy the pleasure of growing beautiful snowdrops and be
thankful you have the anticipation of what each year brings.
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everyone accepts this....
Yes, they do, and I think it is useful to have these inconsistencies pointed out for those who do not know - which, I imagine, is the reason Ingrid asked the proprietor of North Green to state something along those lines in the catalogue.
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Yes Maggi, Mother Goose is new and not well known which is why, if it is not stable, we should be told before we buy. I love the North Green catalogue and I have many great snowdrops from there. This isn’t a discussion which is meant to offend; it is just a plea for accurate description of a new introduction. Ingrid is absolutely right to pursue this in the interests of fair marketing.
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Yes, they do, and I think it is useful to have these inconsistencies pointed out for those who do not know - which, I imagine, is the reason Ingrid asked the proprietor of North Green to state something along those lines in the catalogue.
Absolutely Maggi, you, David and I agree that the important issue is that buyers make an informed purchase with all relevant information made available.
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Indeed Ingrid - I am very keen on transparency in all matters, not just in the world of Galanthus, whether by Ebayers or nurseries.
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Joe Sharman frequently gives talks on yellow snowdrops and he always says that on his soil yellow snowdrops come green. I guess that's a useful bit of full disclosure but it must mean that if you have the wrong soil, you will need to grow your yellow snowdrops in pots to see their yellow colour.
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Yes Maggi, Mother Goose is new and not well known which is why, if it is not stable, we should be told before we buy. I love the North Green catalogue and I have many great snowdrops from there. This isn’t a discussion which is meant to offend; it is just a plea for accurate description of a new introduction. Ingrid is absolutely right to pursue this in the interests of fair marketing.
There is your answer, a new introduction could behave differently in every garden. It's a
bulb not a manufactured object. Other than put a disclaimer on every new bulb, there
may be variation in colour, amount of green, height, etc.... it's always fascinating to
to wonder why a subject keeps being brought up when it has been said already.
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it's always fascinating to
to wonder why a subject keeps being brought up when it has been said already.
As I said before - it is in the interests of transparency. Since no disclaimer is being made by the original seller on a snowdrop which is still being sold for what for many people is a lot of money it is helpful to newcomers to see what the situation is. In the same way as Ingrid has done such marvelous work to expose some of the worst ebay offenders.
Some people and I am one, find the obfuscation that surrounds a lot of the snowdrop world to be deplorable and frankly, unseemly.
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I have already pointed out that this snowdrop delivers unreliable results in a variety of growing conditions e.g
we have problematic reports from multiple growers, using various growing conditions!
I grow a large number of yellow varieties and this is the only one which has proven problematic. Indeed, on the subject of growing conditions, I have already pointed out that both my Mother Goose were yellow last year and green this, so it is not that it behaves differently in every garden but that it is unreliable in the same garden. A number of other growers have tried various conditions and soil types and got the same results. Clearly growing conditions and soil are not the determining factor.
Snowdrop variability is a known phenomena, which is exactly what trialling is meant to identify before offering to the market. When it is identified, as in the case of Mother Goose, it should be reported to potential buyers so that they can decide whether that variability is acceptable to them at the price being offered. This was not done and I am bemused as to why identifying this issue seems to make some uncomfortable.
Repetitive discourse results from a photo of Mother Goose, 48 hours ago, again showing green instead of yellow. Indeed, a number of Mother Goose have been offered in the last week and are receiving bids. I want to make sure that at least these potential buyers have an informed decision and am again bemused why some seem so uncomfortable with this! The discourse could have been avoided in it's entirety if North Green had published a warning in their 2017 & 2018 catalogues, when advised to do so, which they opted not to do.
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I had heard it needed time to settle down (and what sounded like potentially too long a time) but it sounds as if it is less reliable than even that. I for one welcome that increased awareness. I'll likely wait until one of Hagen's more interesting variants becomes available.
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as an aside (and back to more reliable snowdrops), here is a recent picture of my own yellow with its still fresh green coloured leaves and ripening seed pods. It varies a bit itself though and emerged less bright this year than last (when it emerged with golden shoots). Grake's Gold also looked a similar colour this year from a photo I saw posted (I only have Grake's Yellow although I suspect i'ts somewhere between the two in colour terms).
The inner seems to change from a lightish green with yellow suffusion above to a more straight yellow colour with white above (as in the second and third photos); I need more time to evaluate this though to see if it is a consistent feature or not.
It was found in February 2016 and seems to grow well (much more vigorous than my Grake's Yellow for instance).
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I had heard it needed time to settle down (and what sounded like potentially too long a time) but it sounds as if it is less reliable than even that.
Possibly as so many collectors have their snowdrops almost all in pots, where they are
artificially managed on both watering, feeding, light, summer warmth and winter
temperatures it's impossible to claim varying conditions produce anything and I think
personally it makes it hard for a snowdrop to truly settle down and reach its true potential.
I now try to put everything in the garden and use a lot of oak leaf mould and I think
they are much happier and stronger.
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I now try to put everything in the garden and use a lot of oak leaf mould and I think
they are much happier and stronger.
I can well believe that, Bernadette, but we gardeners are always trying to grow things in conditions that may be some way removed from what a plant would enjoy in its native habitat. Part of the fun of gardening is the challenge of doing this. I would love a source of oak leaf mould but don't have room for an oak tree.
Also, if you consider all snowdrop species, they grow in such a wide range of different conditions it would be quite impossible to provide for all of them in any one garden. However I do agree that a plant that is less happy and performing less well may not produce flowers of the best strength or colour. I happen to grow a lot of snowdrops in pots because conditions in my garden are sub-optimum. They may flower a bit less well and bulk-up a bit more slowly than those few that I can grow in a leaf mould bed but I have never noted any colour differences.
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Also, if you consider all snowdrop species, they grow in such a wide range of different conditions it would be quite impossible to provide for all of them in any one garden.
I agree and understand that. It was more the settling down thing I was replying to,
as people are controlling through nurture the health of snowdrops in pots. So it's
impossible to compare and comment on why, or what someone else is doing differently.
There was a lovely article on North Green in the telegraph? this year, I am actually more
intrigued than ever to buy Mother Goose as I think it would be interesting to grow and is
quite beautiful. I actually bought the house because of the garden and oak trees, but
even in a suburban setting quite often people are happy for you to collect their leaves up
as they see them as a nuisance.
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... I actually bought the house because of the garden and oak trees,
Oh I can sympathise with that! But when we bought our house 21 years ago the garden was not such a major consideration as it would be now that we are getting more time to spend in it.
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as an aside (and back to more reliable snowdrops), here is a recent picture of my own yellow with its still fresh green coloured leaves and ripening seed pods. It varies a bit itself though and emerged less bright this year than last (when it emerged with golden shoots). Grake's Gold also looked a similar colour this year from a photo I saw posted (I only have Grake's Yellow although I suspect i'ts somewhere between the two in colour terms).
The inner seems to change from a lightish green with yellow suffusion above to a more straight yellow colour with white above (as in the second and third photos); I need more time to evaluate this though to see if it is a consistent feature or not.
It was found in February 2016 and seems to grow well (much more vigorous than my Grake's Yellow for instance).
Did you get going with a paint brush, Josh, or did you have natural early pollinators?
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I am actually more intrigued than ever to buy Mother Goose as I think it would be interesting to grow and is
quite beautiful.
Well, at least you have been made aware up front what the potential problems are unlike the catalogue, let's hope you get a random yellow one instead of a green or yellow to green version. You have reminded me of the Telegraph article, extolling the virtues of Mother Goose, indeed stating it was one of 'Three for Your Wish List', but no mention of the greening problem, odd that another opportunity to inform buyers was passed up!
I repeat once again, the problems have been reported from those that grow both in the garden - like mine, yellow last year, green this, and in pots, so that is not the issue.
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Personally I think Val Bourne writes intelligently and with witty humour
and when I am dead and buried I am sure the contribution of her and North Green
will be more important to snowdrops and an artistically good eye to beauty, with the
collecting and breeding and reporting of gems of different snowdrops, than anything
you and I are currently contributing. So really I think we should appreciate that
and start using the forum to get it back to where it used to be with photos of events
and peoples plants and gardens. Gardening should be a pleasure.
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Gardening should be a pleasure.
I agree, it is much more of a pleasure when there are no unpleasant surprises, due to sharing of relevant information.
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One is starting to wonder why you must constantly keep going on about this.
As you have acquired hundreds of snowdrops, and this one displeases you so much,
just sell it on eBay or give it away and replace it with something that makes you happy.
Really life is too short.
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One is starting to wonder why you must constantly keep going on about this.
As you have acquired hundreds of snowdrops, and this one displeases you so much,
just sell it on eBay or give it away and replace it with something that makes you happy.
Really life is too short.
An extraordinary post!
First I do not sell snowdrops, secondly if I did, I would not sell a snowdrop I know has stability issues that has not performed correctly for me!
One might also wonder why you are exercised about a snowdrop you do not grow and have no experience of.
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Because I think this forum is changing and not in a good way, one by one people are dissapearing. Whatever you reply I WIlLL NOT RESPOND TO and no doubt you will as you always want the last word. All I can say is this is not what gardening should be about.
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Dear Bernadette, I am distressed that you seem to consider that there is something wrong about trying to clarify situations where gardeners may be misled in some way.
The ethos of this forum has always been - and will continue, I hope - to be one of helping to spread information and increase knowledge with all.
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Who is king-radio, selling Mother Goose on Ebay?
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I don't know, Ralph. I note that he has quote -"copied" - photos for a few of those he is selling and that raises warning signs for me about any seller.
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Has all the hallmarks of a scam - "I'm just an amateur" etc.
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He / She has been selling for severall years already, so may be genuine.
I have wanted Mother Goose for a long time but I am grateful to have read 1st hand experience of it’s performance and it is no longer on my must have list! If the sellers are not honest about it, then it is only via a forum that we can know how it really performs and make a purchase decision based on the facts.
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All his feedback for the past twelve months has been as a buyer not a seller. Older feedback as a seller is not for snowdrops - mostly old coins.
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Sorry to come to this late. I think it should be said that the yellow version of MG is a spectacularly beautiful snowdrop, especially in a group. The green version is spectacularly ordinary. Perhaps this is why it evokes such strong feelings when it does not deliver.
Bernadette, you should definitely try it. I think I said in an earlier post that its variability is fascinating and we need to collate our experiences in order to come to a semblance of an objective view. At the moment I am disappointed but I will persevere because I am interested to discern any patterns in its behaviour. It certainly twin scales easily so there will soon be plenty of available material to work with.
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All his feedback for the past twelve months has been as a buyer not a seller. Older feedback as a seller is not for snowdrops - mostly old coins.
He has a lot os positive feedback for snowdrops, more than a year ago, if you scroll past the pages of Roman coins!
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Who is king-radio, selling Mother Goose on Ebay?
He / She has been selling for severall years already, so may be genuine.
I've been watching joy cozens being sold by queen_carrol1, and was going to write to them to ask why some of the pics have been lifted from Judy's snowdrops site but have not got around to doing that yet! Anyway after reading this about king_radio I went to have a look and was surprised to see that he/she also has this plant for sale. The text is the same as queen_carrol1 the pics are the same and they both come from Leicester! Hmmmm!
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Caveat emptor!
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as an aside (and back to more reliable snowdrops), here is a recent picture of my own yellow with its still fresh green coloured leaves and ripening seed pods. It varies a bit itself though and emerged less bright this year than last (when it emerged with golden shoots). Grake's Gold also looked a similar colour this year from a photo I saw posted (I only have Grake's Yellow although I suspect i'ts somewhere between the two in colour terms).
The inner seems to change from a lightish green with yellow suffusion above to a more straight yellow colour with white above (as in the second and third photos); I need more time to evaluate this though to see if it is a consistent feature or not.
It was found in February 2016 and seems to grow well (much more vigorous than my Grake's Yellow for instance).
A very interesting find, Josh! I like snowdrops with green leaves and think this feature is especially desirable for yellow snowdrops. The contrast looks much healthier than the combination of flowers and leaves of ´Carolyn Elwes´, for instance.
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I now try to put everything in the garden and use a lot of oak leaf mould and I think
they are much happier and stronger.
That´s what I do, and I can´t complaint about my yellows. My soil is heavy clay, enriched with compost and leafmould.
Maybe oakleaves are especially helpful - I remember a report mentioning many yellow G. elwesii growing under oaktrees.
´Primrose Warburg´
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Did you get going with a paint brush, Josh, or did you have natural early pollinators?
Paint brush, Maggi (or, more accurately, entomological tweezers!).
I found a flower of Golden Fleece on the floor near the cafe at the Myddleton House sale. It was a bit stepped on but more on the stalk end. I first questioned whether it was GF as it was a very light lime-y green colour and I wondered whether there was a similar new one or Myddleton had their own version. I concluded it was most likely GF as it can be quite lime coloured and it hadn't been a good year for plicate yellow colouring.
In order to try and check, I said to Joe that I thought GF had been on the floor by the cafe and he said one had fallen out of Janet Benjafield's hat (I didn't say it was by then safely tucked away in my bag!), Suffice to say, it 'met' a number of my snowdrops, including my yellow. i later found a very promising new virescent at the byzantinus site I know and used its pollen on my yellow as well.
I did have bees working the snowdrops very vigorously on a couple of days a while later (not been a great year for them thus far!) but don't think this one was outside at the time. Whatever has caused the pods to swell, I'll be watching any seedlings produced with interest!
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Here, with kind permission of Gert Geenson is a photo of a new snowdrop Galanthus nivalis 'Judith's Yelbino'.
The updated list is here:
http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=15063.msg370708#msg370708 (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=15063.msg370708#msg370708)
Thank You for introducing this lovely snowdrop here, Brian!
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Paint brush, Maggi (or, more accurately, entomological tweezers!).
I found a flower of Golden Fleece on the floor near the cafe at the Myddleton House sale. It was a bit stepped on but more on the stalk end. I first questioned whether it was GF as it was a very light lime-y green colour and I wondered whether there was a similar new one or Myddleton had their own version. I concluded it was most likely GF as it can be quite lime coloured and it hadn't been a good year for plicate yellow colouring.
In order to try and check, I said to Joe that I thought GF had been on the floor by the cafe and he said one had fallen out of Janet Benjafield's hat (I didn't say it was by then safely tucked away in my bag!), Suffice to say, it 'met' a number of my snowdrops, including my yellow. i later found a very promising new virescent at the byzantinus site I know and used its pollen on my yellow as well.
I did have bees working the snowdrops very vigorously on a couple of days a while later (not been a great year for them thus far!) but don't think this one was outside at the time. Whatever has caused the pods to swell, I'll be watching any seedlings produced with interest!
A much more interesting story than I could have imagined, Josh! Nifty bit of forward thinking on your part there!
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Thank You for introducing this lovely snowdrop here, Brian!
You are very welcome Mariette, unfortunately I just can’t keep up with all the new ones - how Matt copes I don’t know! Thankfully there is a difference between ‘Yellow Angel’ and ‘Judith’s Yelbino’ and I would love to grow them together to show that off.
What I love about this forum is the sharing of information between members. Where it scores, hands down, above FaceBook is the search engine for previous posts, and photographs making it a great resource for anyone starting out on the slippery slope of collecting snowdrops! It is a great community and it was really nice to meet up with Janet LeCore, David and Margaret MacLennan, Chas and Jan Whight, Steve Owen and Alan Briggs and other ‘lurkers’ at Monksilver Nursery today for the ‘Spring Fling’ where there was one major topic of conversation. Bargains to be had from Tim Fuller (The Plantsmans Preference), Jelly Cottage Plants, Brenda and John Foster and of course Joe himself. Some people spent far too much - but came away happy!
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I have no idea who King Radio is but in the past I bought snowdrops from him/her at different times and they were fine and as-described.
I'm not a lawyer but I think people would be wise not to publicly label Ebay sellers as scammmers when they have no knowledge of them beyond the fact that they may have "borrowed" a picture to illustrate their sale. Some years back I sued my local cabbage-patch newspaper for libel; they lost and it cost them a great deal of money. The law of libel and slander applies to communities-of-interest like Scottish Rock as it does elsewhere. The same note of caution would apply to statements about nurserymen/women. Better to safeguard your money to buy plants.
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Members here have shown the false plants they have been sold by various ebayers. Many ebayers - and others - have been shown to be using other people's photos without permission in their attempt to make sales. That's theft.
Thank goodness there are those who will do what they can to combat dishonesty.
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.....The law of libel and slander.....
Tort surely.
Of course there will always be those who hide below "Mother Legalitie's" skirts whether or not they are morally right to do so?
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That is so, David - and some of those find out to their cost the penalties for malicious litigation.
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Thankfully there is a difference between ‘Yellow Angel’ and ‘Judith’s Yelbino’ and I would love to grow them together to show that off.
So would I, especially as I was introduced to Geert in Kalmthout this year. It´s always nice to associate a snowdrop with a person one met. I noticed that it´s similar to ´Yellow Angel´and am interested to learn about the difference. Anyway, there are really not too many snowdrops of this kind, so new ones are very welcome.
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The law of libel and slander applies to communities-of-interest like Scottish Rock as it does elsewhere.
I think you are absolutely right, Steve, and this is well worth remembering. The typical eBay fraudster will be purporting to sell a snowdrop he/she does not actually own and so is obliged to use somebody else's photograph (or show no photo). Therefore it is only prudent to regard with some suspicion any eBay listing where the photograph has been taken from elsewhere. It is public-spirited of this forum to alert people when this misuse of other peoples photographs is spotted and to point out that this is grounds for suspicion. If we stick to this line then I would have thought we should remain on the right side of the law, although I'm not a lawyer either.
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Well it would look something like this Mariette, of course I don't know about the stature of the plants but 'Yellow Angel' is on the left and 'Judith's Yelbino' on the right. 'Yellow Angel' seems to be more golden whilst 'Judith's Yelbino' is one of the ghostly looking ones like the Estonian Spirit group.
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I think you are absolutely right, Steve, and this is well worth remembering. The typical eBay fraudster will be purporting to sell a snowdrop he/she does not actually own and so is obliged to use somebody else's photograph (or show no photo). Therefore it is only prudent to regard with some suspicion any eBay listing where the photograph has been taken from elsewhere. It is public-spirited of this forum to alert people when this misuse of other peoples photographs is spotted and to point out that this is grounds for suspicion. If we stick to this line then I would have thought we should remain on the right side of the law, although I'm not a lawyer either.
I suspect a good proportion of people buying snowdrops on eBay wouldn't know if a picture or even text has been lifted from elsewhere or not and could be setting themselves up to being duped! The people doing this could actually be selling the correct bulbs they are listing,but you do have to ask why they would choose to use someone else's pic or text over their own! And that has to make you suspicious! I think it is good that this information is being put on this forum so people can make a better judgment and ask the seller questions before choosing to buy the plant. I should also point out that unfortunately it's not just a problem with snowdrops.
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Well it would look something like this Mariette, of course I don't know about the stature of the plants but 'Yellow Angel' is on the left and 'Judith's Yelbino' on the right. 'Yellow Angel' seems to be more golden whilst 'Judith's Yelbino' is one of the ghostly looking ones like the Estonian Spirit group.
Thank You, Brian - they are both very distinct and well worth naming!
Joe Sharman is said to have sold ´Schwefelfee´in Mannheim. Does anybody know this snowdrop? It´s not mentioned in Joe´s current list.
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Galanthus nivalis 'Schwefelfee' was mentioned last year as being bought at a German Hepatica event - by a happy buyer!
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Thank You, Maggi, that fits in - there´s a guess that it was selected by Andreas Händel, "Mr. Hepatica".
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contact "carstens", Mariette, he may be able to say more.
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Here is the happy buyer of Galanthus nivalis 'Schwelfelfee'. I got it from Andreas Händel last year and he told me, that ist was found at the Elbe river. No more details, I´am afraid. Some pics of the plant and of a very tiny offspring...
The flower seems to be very much like 'Spindlestone Surprise' but the mark is more like an inverted V not an U.
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Thanks, Carsten - I hoped you would help!
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Michael Myers showed G. nivalis 'Blonde Inge ' at the AGS Loughborough show yesterday - looking very good in his pic and indeed it was awarded a Preliminary Commendation by the Joint Rock Committee.(RHS, AGS, SRGC).
Joint Rock Committee awards are given to plants "for exhibition".
[attachimg=1]
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Here is the happy buyer of Galanthus nivalis 'Schwelfelfee'. I got it from Andreas Händel last year and he told me, that ist was found at the Elbe river. No more details, I´am afraid. Some pics of the plant and of a very tiny offspring...
The flower seems to be very much like 'Spindlestone Surprise' but the mark is more like an inverted V not an U.
Thank You, Carsten, for these details - Maggi was obviously swifter than me. It´s a pity Andreas Händel doesn´t offer this snowdrop on his list, I´ll ask him to sell it at Knechtsteden next year!
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Michael Myers showed G. nivalis 'Blonde Inge ' at the AGS Loughborough show yesterday - looking very good in his pic and indeed it was awarded a Preliminary Commendation by the Joint Rock Committee.(RHS, AGS, SRGC).
Joint Rock Committee awards are given to plants "for exhibition".
(Attachment Link)
Well done, Michael!
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I have been asked to pass this on by another collector (and obviously a lurker) of repute:
I’d like to ask you kindly to tell Johnralphcarpenter that king-radio is the user name of Christopher Brierley on eBay. I lost his recent auction on ‘Rushmere Green’*) by ranking on second position. As I bought five ‘drops from him since 2012, he knows me well, he immediately gave me a second chance at the price of my last bid.
His wife’s uuser name on eBay is queen_carol (Carol Brierley). On occasion of having bought two ‘drops from her she told me
that her husband would rather favour to sell Roman coins.
I need to say tha this couple is very communicative, generous and is selling ‘drops of very good quality.
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So all is pukka with this seller.
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So to be clear Maggie, do you disagree with anything here? If you do, which part and why? Bear in mind please that my sole interest is in encouraging people not to risk good money by careless accusations. I will assume whatever you say in reply can be taken as official SRGC policy.
If I ever have occasion to state "official SRGC policy" you can be sure I will say so at the time.
I am speaking personally, Steve
As we have seen previously, those who use photos which are not their own have been found to be less than scrupulous in other dealings and I, like others, have cautioned care in such cases.
It is polite to give credit to another person if using their photos to make a sale and might calm some fears for some if that were to happen.
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I'm not a lawyer but I think people would be wise not to publicly label Ebay sellers as scammmers when they have no knowledge of them beyond the fact that they may have "borrowed" a picture to illustrate their sale. Some years back I sued my local cabbage-patch newspaper for libel; they lost and it cost them a great deal of money. The law of libel and slander applies to communities-of-interest like Scottish Rock as it does elsewhere. The same note of caution would apply to statements about nurserymen/women. Better to safeguard your money to buy plants.
Maggi will speak for herself.
I would disagree with one part of your post which, in my view, underplays the seriousness of the theft of someone else's pictures by your use of the word "borrowed". There seems to me to be a significant difference between "borrow" and "theft" Even Ebay's Image Policy, see the extraction below, differentiates between pictures obtained from rights owners following proper request and those stolen.
"When creating listings, members should write their own description and take their own photos. Buyers like to see images and descriptions that accurately represent an item they are purchasing.
If you use text or an image that was created by someone else be sure that you have permission to use the text or image from the rights owner or creator."
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I have found one yellow snowdrop with leaves like Galanthus plicatus within a group of other snowdrops. Is it possible to put a cultivar name to it?
[attachimg=1]
A group of yellow Galanthus lagodechianus, grown from seed.
[attachimg=2]
[attachimg=3]
And the well known Galanthus Blonde Inge
[attachimg=4]
[attachimg=5]
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I have found one yellow snowdrop with leaves like Galanthus plicatus within a group of other snowdrops. Is it possible to put a cultivar name to it?
It is dangerous to attach cultivar name to a found snowdrop unless you know the names of ones that have been lost. Most of the yellow plicatus snowdrops that I can think of have a larger mark on the inners, 'Madeleine' probably has the smallest with the most rounded top. Or could it be a hybrid like 'Primrose Warburg' or 'Spindlestone Surprise'?
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If I ever have occasion to state "official SRGC policy" you can be sure I will say so at the time.
I am speaking personally, Steve
As we have seen previously, those who use photos which are not their own have been found to be less than scrupulous in other dealings and I, like others, have cautioned care in such cases.
It is polite to give credit to another person if using their photos to make a sale and might calm some fears for some if that were to happen.
There are strict copyright rules about this with regard to academic publications. A photograph constitutes intellectual property. Although internet sales are less formal Maggi is right to promote good practice - it’s more than just polite really.
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Sokol, Are your lagodechianus pure bred, no possibility of hybridisation? I find lagodechianus an attractive species which grows well for me. I have never encountered a yellow version, unsurprisingly, but there is no reason why they should not exist. They look great!
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I have been asked to pass this on by another collector (and obviously a lurker) of repute:
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So all is pukka with this seller.
I should have said something earlier. I have purchased from queen carol several times and had an entirely satisfactory experience and good quality snowdrops.
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If I ever have occasion to state "official SRGC policy" you can be sure I will say so at the time.
I am speaking personally, Steve
As we have seen previously, those who use photos which are not their own have been found to be less than scrupulous in other dealings and I, like others, have cautioned care in such cases.
It is polite to give credit to another person if using their photos to make a sale and might calm some fears for some if that were to happen.
Maggi, I'm not talking about using other peoples' photos without permission - I don't agree with that either. My concern is the use of the SRGC chat site by contributors to recklessly use words about others, such as "scammer", that could land the user in legal jeopardy and lose lots of money. I would have thought that as Moderator you would not only have found it easy to agree with my point but might have been expected to lead the warnings. That is why I asked you to state official SRGC policy about such reckless criticism of others, which has also applied to discussions about nurserymen. If you don't feel able to provide that advice, please point me to whoever in the SRGC leadership/management can. I repeat, the law of the land applies to the SRGC website as it does to all other forums of public comment.
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I have found one yellow snowdrop with leaves like Galanthus plicatus within a group of other snowdrops. Is it possible to put a cultivar name to it?
(Attachment Link)
A group of yellow Galanthus lagodechianus, grown from seed.
(Attachment Link)
(Attachment Link)
And the well known Galanthus Blonde Inge
(Attachment Link)
(Attachment Link)
Your yellow G. lagodechianus is gorgeous, Stefan! Last season there was a discussion about G. lagodechianus, as most people, like me, grow a clone which hardly ever flowers. Yours is not only especially beautiful, but obviously very floriferous, too. Congratulations!
Popped Your yellow one with plicatus-like leaves up as a chance seedling, or do You not know or remember the name of an acquired variety?
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Tort surely.
Of course there will always be those who hide below "Mother Legalitie's" skirts whether or not they are morally right to do so?
No David, not "tort" - that's a different branch of the law. Check with Wikipaedia. I said the law of libel and slander and meant it.
BTW I didn't understand your following comment (or Maggie's response to it).
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A group of yellow Galanthus lagodechianus, grown from seed.
Did you have reason to believe that your seeds would give rise to plants with yellow flowers or was this just a great stroke of good luck?
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Maggi, I'm not talking about using other peoples' photos without permission - I don't agree with that either. My concern is the use of the SRGC chat site by contributors to recklessly use words about others, such as "scammer", that could land the user in legal jeopardy and lose lots of money. I would have thought that as Moderator you would not only have found it easy to agree with my point but might have been expected to lead the warnings. That is why I asked you to state official SRGC policy about such reckless criticism of others, which has also applied to discussions about nurserymen. If you don't feel able to provide that advice, please point me to whoever in the SRGC leadership/management can. I repeat, the law of the land applies to the SRGC website as it does to all other forums of public comment.
I do agree with you Steve.
I am not aware of any "reckless" comments being made. Opinions have been expressed and worries aired about sellers - and these have either been upheld by further evidence of problems or been relieved by reports of problems solved or fears unfounded.
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Did you have reason to believe that your seeds would give rise to plants with yellow flowers or was this just a great stroke of good luck?
Sokol, Are your lagodechianus pure bred, no possibility of hybridisation? I find lagodechianus an attractive species which grows well for me. I have never encountered a yellow version, unsurprisingly, but there is no reason why they should not exist. They look great!
I have bought the seeds just as Galanthus lagodechianus so really good luck. They have been yellow also last year, when the first ones flowered. I do not know whether there was any hybrididation or not, David.
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It is dangerous to attach cultivar name to a found snowdrop unless you know the names of ones that have been lost. Most of the yellow plicatus snowdrops that I can think of have a larger mark on the inners, 'Madeleine' probably has the smallest with the most rounded top. Or could it be a hybrid like 'Primrose Warburg' or 'Spindlestone Surprise'?
Thanks Alan, if it is not possible to name it safely I won't use any. I have bought a handful Galanthus bulbs last year and this one was between them.
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I have bought a handful Galanthus bulbs last year and this one was between them.
A very important thing is where these bulbs came from. If you have similar yellow snowdrops already growing in your garden, could a loose bulb have accidentally got mixed-in with the ones you bought? For example, this year I have a 'Lady Beatrix Stanley' growing in my compost heap. If you bought them from someone with a collection of named snowdrops then it quite likely your snowdrop is either a named one that went astray or possibly a seedling from other yellow snowdrops. If you bought from a commercial bulb company then it is very unlikely to be a named snowdrop. No yellow snowdrops are available from any large bulb company, to the best of my knowledge. So unless some company is building up stock before a market launch, there just isn't a way for any named snowdrop to get mixed-in with what they supply.
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Yellow G.lagodechianus is very pretty!! :) I like normal G.lagodechianus, and it flowers well here, but it does produce lots of small bulbs which I think take more time to grow big enough to flower than many other snowdrops.
The first picture is from 2013 and second is from 2017, and last summer I divided the clump to give small bulbs more room to grow.
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Very nice pictures Leena. The right plant on the second one is also yellow and has maybe changed into green later.
I will observe mine if the yellow colour is changing.
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A very important thing is where these bulbs came from. If you have similar yellow snowdrops already growing in your garden, could a loose bulb have accidentally got mixed-in with the ones you bought? For example, this year I have a 'Lady Beatrix Stanley' growing in my compost heap. If you bought them from someone with a collection of named snowdrops then it quite likely your snowdrop is either a named one that went astray or possibly a seedling from other yellow snowdrops. If you bought from a commercial bulb company then it is very unlikely to be a named snowdrop. No yellow snowdrops are available from any large bulb company, to the best of my knowledge. So unless some company is building up stock before a market launch, there just isn't a way for any named snowdrop to get mixed-in with what they supply.
After your detailed explanation I must say that there are several possibilities besides the last. I have bought Galanthus from several sellers with named snowdrops and repotted them in August at the same time.
Despite careful working an accident could have happened like a fallen bulb that I have put to the wrong bulbs. I will compare it with my other yellows and hope the question will be solved.
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Very nice pictures Leena. The right plant on the second one is also yellow and has maybe changed into green later.
Thank you. :) I like the low stature of them. What seems yellow is only yellowing caused by cold weather last spring, and it turned green later, unfortunately. Last spring I had yellow in many snowdrops, like in the picture here last March, http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=15188.msg374458#msg374458 (http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=15188.msg374458#msg374458)
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I like normal G.lagodechianus, and it flowers well here, but it does produce lots of small bulbs which I think take more time to grow big enough to flower than many other snowdrops.
The first picture is from 2013 and second is from 2017, and last summer I divided the clump to give small bulbs more room to grow.
It may be that your plants are just disposed to proliferate by these little bulbs - but perhaps splitting them every couple of years and feeding them with a potassium (kalium) rich feed in growth would strengthen them and get them to flowering size more readily. Worth a try, Leena!
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- but perhaps splitting them every couple of years and feeding them with a potassium (kalium) rich feed in growth would strengthen them and get them to flowering size more readily. Worth a try, Leena!
Thanks Maggi, I have fed them with only compost so far, so giving them kalium would be good! :)
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Under the lateflowering snowdrops I found two Yellow, one from G woronowii and one from G.elwesii from Turkey. I will look for them next year, if they are stabile!
Foto1: G. woronowii with yellow markers an yellow ovarium
Foto2: G. elwesii with deep-yellow markers and green ovarium