Scottish Rock Garden Club Forum
Specific Families and Genera => Iris => Topic started by: Gerhard Raschun on February 01, 2015, 08:25:19 PM
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I`m starting a new topic with a bicolor flowering I. unguiculares from Greece
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Iris unguicularis of any type is lovely - but that is a real beauty, Gerhard 8)
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Fabulous colour form Gerhard, thanks for showing us.
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Coincidentally, I sowed seed of the white flowered form today (courtesy of the seedex). Presumably the pot can stay outside uncovered until germination?
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Hi steve I have grown a few iris from seed and have left them outside during the winter and they have germinated the following spring. I also have some iris from the seedex so will do the same with these, it obviously does them no harm.
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Gerhard,
I can just echo Maggi and Melvyn, it is a real beauty.
I've never seen such a form before.
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I wonder if Gerhard's plant is the same being shown in the UK as Iris unguicularis 'Peloponnese snow' J&FK1024 - this photo from Rob C. for the thread on the South Wales AGS show a couple of years ago :
[attachimg=1]
I also wondered if J & FK is the same as F & JK = Fritz and Josefa Kummert ? I've emailed to Fritz and Sefi to ask.... ???
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Hi steve I have grown a few iris from seed and have left them outside during the winter and they have germinated the following spring. I also have some iris from the seedex so will do the same with these, it obviously does them no harm.
Thanks, John.
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I wonder if Gerhard's plant is the same being shown in the UK as Iris unguicularis 'Peloponnese snow' J&FK1024 - this photo from Rob C. for the thread on the South Wales AGS show a couple of years ago :
(Attachment Link)
I also wondered if J & FK is the same as F & JK = Fritz and Josefa Kummert ? I've emailed to Fritz and Sefi to ask.... ???
Yes of course, it is the same clone. I `ve got it from Fritz, who has found it on the Peloponnese some years ago. Fritz has sent the pot shown in the pict to GB, it was his aim to name it and to bring it in horticulture. It is an extraordinary clone, which is a perfect grower, and willing to bloom, much better then other named clones.
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Yes of course, it is the same clone. I `ve got it from Fritz, who has found it on the Peloponnese some years ago. Fritz has sent the pot shown in the pict to GB, it was his aim to name it and to bring it in horticulture. It is an extraordinary clone, which is a perfect grower, and willing to bloom, much better then other named clones.
Really stunning plants. The name 'Peloponnese Snow' is given to the pure white or the one with blue on the falls?
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Really stunning plants. The name 'Peloponnese Snow' is given to the pure white or the one with blue on the falls?
At the moment I`ve got the plant, it wasn`t named. So probably it was named in GB.....
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Name may have been given in UK by Robert Rolfe.
Is that pure white form with yellow tube in your post in the UK, do you know?
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Name may have been given in UK by Robert Rolfe.
Is that pure white form with yellow tube in your post in the UK, do you know?
Yes, this pure white clone I have got from Colin Mason / Birmingham. Two or three years ago I have visited him.
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elegant plants, beautifully photographed, too.
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Fabulous Gerhard!!!
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Agree that it is a good grower . Here it is flowering already from november on and more buds are there.
Mine under that name come from Aberconwy and is the bi coloured one.
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No problem steve, see you Saturday, hopefully if the weather isn't too bad, snowing down here at the moment.
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No problem steve, see you Saturday, hopefully if the weather isn't too bad, snowing down here at the moment.
John - Yes, see you at Wisley weather permitting. Bitterly cold here but no new snow thankfully. I think the east is forecast to get some, clearly already there in Lincolnshire!
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Yes it is heavy in some places and more to come by the sounds of it, must be making up for last year >:(
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I wonder if Gerhard's plant is the same being shown in the UK as Iris unguicularis 'Peloponnese snow' J&FK1024 - this photo from Rob C. for the thread on the South Wales AGS show a couple of years ago :
(Attachment Link)
I also wondered if J & FK is the same as F & JK = Fritz and Josefa Kummert ? I've emailed to Fritz and Sefi to ask.... ???
Fritz was kind enough to help us out - It is the same plant - though there is an error, the collection number should be F&JK 0124
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I also wondered if J & FK is the same as F & JK = Fritz and Josefa Kummert ? I've emailed to Fritz and Sefi to ask.... ???
It's useful to discover the names behind the initials. I had some C. hederifolium seed from the seedex last year with the collection number F&JK 97017, I can now amend my records to note that this was one of the Kummert's collections :) .
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Iris grant-duffii - very nice Iris, unfortunately shy flowering here.
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Even shyer here Hans, if fact it has gone the "way of all flesh :("
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Iris suaveolens
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Lovery iris Yann
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The Iris unguicularis season has been exceptionally long this winter. Here's 'Abingdon Purple' on 8th February.
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Our 91 year old neighbour has a nice patch of this Iris in her garden but cannot remember what it is. It has been in flower for just a fortnight. Any ideas gratefully received, it is slightly more violet than the pictures show.
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Iris lazica I think Brian.
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Thanks David, I had also come to that decision :)
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An iris that I bought in the Czech Republic in May 2013 flowering for the first time - I. songarica. Brian Mathew says that the soft greyish lavender-blue colouring is not very striking, but it is lovely none-the-less. This is growing in a trough but we must try it in a really dry spot in the garden. A lot more buds to open.
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An iris that I bought in the Czech Republic in May 2013 flowering for the first time - I. songarica. Brian Mathew says that the soft greyish lavender-blue colouring is not very striking, but it is lovely none-the-less. ...
Quiet colouring but very elegant Tim.
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Lots of Iris flowering now.
Iris siberica, an unidentified cultivar.
Iris sanguinea, I believe.
Iris versicolor var. kermessina.
Is this Iris spuria subsp. halophila?
Iris 'Holden Clough', an hybrid between Iris pseudacorus and Iris foetidissima.
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One more for now: Iris 'Gerald Darby' if I'm not mistaken.
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I believe Gerald Darby should have black stems.
John B
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An Iris spuria cultivar in flower.
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Lovely Iris Ralph.
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Iris setosa from SRGC seed exchange from wild collected seed one from Magadan in Russia and the other from Siberia.
The Siberian one is a bit taller and the Magadan one has more flowers on the stem
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Couple from the New York Botanical Garden.
Iris ensata Dirigo Red Rocket
Iris ensata Purple Parasol
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A few more irises flowering now
White form of Iris setosa
Some Iris forrestii hybrids
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White form of Iris sibirica - love the markings on these :)
Two self sown seedlings flowering for the first time. Iris chrysographes 'Black form' was growing nearby so mabe crossed with one of the yellow forrestii types
Iris 'Broadleigh Carolyn' I think this one has too much leaf for the amount of flower and the slugs seem to have taken a liking to it this year
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Iris 'Broadleigh Carolyn' I think this one has too much leaf for the amount of flower and the slugs seem to have taken a liking to it this year
Which raises a question from me about whether or not the foliage of PCIs can be/should be cut back in winter?
Any suggestions?
cheers
fermi
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Iris setosa from Magadan flowering again. The stems are about twice the height of the earlier ones. There could be more than one clone in the clump as I did not separate the seedlings before planting out.
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Very nice Roma. Are they always this late or is it mine that are always early?
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This is the first year they have flowered for me, David. They were grown from wild collected seed. They flowered in June and set lots of seed. I think there were a few seedlings in the pot but they were well tangled up by the time I potted them on so the one flowering now could be a different clone. If you go back on this page you will see them flowering earlier.
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A PCI seedling in a garden bed under a crabapple
cheers
fermi
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Can anyone help me identify this North American. I was given it by my wife's boss, but she wasn't sure of the identity. Could be a hybrid or a species...
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It looks quite like one I've grown from seed as I. innominata. Mind you, I don't know if it was correctly named! Lovely iris anyway. You'll need to make sure it doesn't dry out, Broadleigh Gardens lost their PC irises due to drought. They do well here on the rainy west coast.
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Thank you for the warning Carolyn. I'll give it a bit of extra attention over summer.
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Jamus,
A few questions about your lovely Iris:
How tall does it grow?
How many flowers are there per stem?
If your Iris turns out to be I. innominata make sure that it has excellent drainage, especially with your climatic conditions. I agree that it will need to be kept moist during the summer. The tricky part is balancing the moisture levels when it gets hot. Too much moisture and the plants will rot away. This does not seem to be a problem in areas with cool summers.
There is a chance that your Iris could be a form of I. douglasiana.
The West Coast Irises hybridize freely with each other, even in their wild habitat. Careful examination of the plant is sometimes required to assure that it is indeed a species.
I wish that I could see the plant up front and personal. Perhaps I could help more, but then I am absolutely not an expert. Hopefully someone with more skill than I will see your photograph and make a positive identification.
Good Luck! Regardless it is a beautiful Iris. :)
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Robert,
Interesting to read your comments about drainage. I never give it a thought, and have never had trouble with irises rotting. Summer heat is not a problem here, so your observation seems accurate. Have the PC irises suffered in the prolonged drought in California?
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Carolyn,
It has been over 15 years since I have been able to visit the sites of many of the Pacific Coast Iris species in Northwestern California (Southern Oregon too). Each species has its habitat preference and these can vary considerably depending on the species. Some species grow near the coast in the summer fog belt, others grow inland but are still influenced by the cooling ocean breezes during the summer, and still others grow where there is very little or no ocean influence during the summer, experience high summertime temperatures and extremely dry conditions. Some, such as Iris innominata, grow on serpentine. All of this translates into varying water needs for the different species.
Adding to the complexity is the fact that the various species can hybridize with each other both in the wild as well as in cultivation. Iris innominata is a very choice compact species, ideal for the rock garden. Because of these desirable traits it has been used extensively by many hybridizers. Many of the hybrids retain I. innominata's compact habit and glossy foliage. They also tend to be easier to grow in the garden.
Most of the problems with Iris innominata are in hot summer regions where root rots can develop as the result of high temperatures and the need to irrigate this species. Excellent drainage helps ameliorate this situation.
Most of the PCI hybridizing has taken place in Coast California. Breeding for garden tolerance has often lead to a lack of drought tolerance and the need for irrigation (especially in the hot, dry inland areas). Where I live in the hot, dry interior of California, the native Iris species are dealing with the drought extremely well. Both I. hartwegii and I. macrosiphon need no summer irrigation once they are established in the garden. We just had our first autumn rain and they will be coming into growth soon. I can and do keep some of them green during the summer by irrigating them some during the summer. Excellent soil drainage is required for me to get away with this.
These are some of my experiences with PCI in a hot, dry climate. I hope that this information is useful.
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Interesting information, Robert. The main source of PC irises in the UK is, or perhaps I should say was, Broadleigh, who produced some lovely hybrids. Unfortunately there was a drought in the south of England a couple of years ago (not drought on the Californian scale, it's all relative), and their stock was wiped out. I had been hoping to buy a few more, but now they don't seem to be available. I have been growing some from my own seed, in the hope of getting something nice.
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PCI I bought from Broadleigh - when Christine Skelmersdale was speaking in Aberdeen - failed to thrive here.
Seed from a friend in North America has done better.
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Robert thanks for your thoughts; I'll take a couple of more anatomical photos and make some observations on flowers per stem etc. today. Mine is in the rock garden so drainage shouldn't be an issue and I water sparingly over summer... all I can do is hope for the best.
I have seedlings of all these PCIs coming out of my ears now. I put out a plea for seed and was inundated! I don't know where I'll put them all... many will be given away if I can find worthy recipients.
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Carolyn,
Thank you for your input! :) I knew nothing of Broadleigh. Very sad that they lost all or most of their stock. :'(
Jamus,
Of coarse, I have know idea what your garden is like (it looks great!), but I will share a trick I learned. Maybe you already know about it.
When breeding plants sometimes it is necessary to grow 300-400 F2 and maybe 250 or so F3 plants. If one is growing tomatoes or something like that, this can take a huge amount of space. Fortunately at the F2 and F3 level one can select for some general characteristics and everything will work out fine. To get around the space issue I would often grow 25-45 F2 or F3 tomatoes in 2 gallon pots. I could select for some general characteristics such as color of fruit, shape, and maybe a few other traits and grow these on. This also works in the ground too as long as one spaces the plants evenly (but still very close together).
Maybe you can do this with your PCI? Maybe you can put a bunch in a big pot(s) or in an out-of-the way spot in the garden and select a few plants you want to keep, give away a bunch, and the others can be recycled in the compost bin.
This works for me with a large variety of plants. I see no reason why it would not work with PCI. This does work for me. It is just an idea, and hopefully a helpful one :)
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PCI I bought from Broadleigh - when Christine Skelmersdale was speaking in Aberdeen - failed to thrive here.
Seed from a friend in North America has done better.
Maggi,
Perhaps you were unlucky with the weather while your plants were establishing? I remember getting plants from Broadleigh in autumn 2009, just before the 2 hard winters... Needless to say, they did not survive. Meanwhile, my established clumps were OK - a bit ragged after harsh frosts, it got down to -12C here, but they grew away fine.
Our local SRGC group had a talk on iris by Brian Young, of Holmes Farm in Ayrshire. He recommends splitting or moving PC irises in spring, just as root growth is starting, not in autumn, as is often recommended. He says that interfering with them in autumn is risky - interesting, as that's when Broadleigh send out their plants! If I get the opportunity to order more, I would overwinter them in my unheated greenhouse and plant out in spring.
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Interesting information, Robert. The main source of PC irises in the UK is, or perhaps I should say was, Broadleigh, who produced some lovely hybrids. Unfortunately there was a drought in the south of England a couple of years ago (not drought on the Californian scale, it's all relative), and their stock was wiped out........
Wonder how I missed the drought (Broadleigh are about 65 miles from me) ??? ;D
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I think you're right, Carolyn - it was late in the season and though we planted them in a sheltered spot to over-winter- it was one of the really cold ones and they all died.
David, from what I hear of your weather - it will have been the fact that the clouds emptied over you that lead to the Broadleigh drought :( :-X
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I think you're right, Carolyn - it was late in the season and though we planted them in a sheltered spot to over-winter- it was one of the really cold ones and they all died.
David, from what I hear of your weather - it will have been the fact that the clouds emptied over you that lead to the Broadleigh drought :( :-X
;D ;) :-*
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Around here I only transplant PCI when white active roots are growing. In our region that can be late autumn into the spring. At other times of the season the losses are tremendous. :'(
Some species and hybrids are tender to cold weather, others are quite cold hardy.
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Around here I only transplant PCI when white active roots are growing. In our region that can be late autumn into the spring.
Robert, that is exactly what Brian Young said in his talk to our group - as the white roots are starting active growth - that tends to be around April in Scotland.
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Carolyn,
Two autumn rain storms have rolled through and the temperatures have cooled considerably. I have a bed that I do not water at all during the summer planted with Iris hartwegii, Sisyrinchium bellum, and many other xeric species. The Iris and Sisyrinchium die to the ground every year. The rain and cooler temperatures have already brought new growth to the Sisyrinchium. I am still waiting for the Iris to break into new growth. It is still early. Generally I see new growth by early November. This is my signal that I can start dividing the PCI.
In other beds where I irrigate a little bit Iris hartwegii and I. macrosiphon stay evergreen, even when "dormant" during the summer. The irrigation seems to help them along as they clump-out faster and I see flowers sooner.
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Amazing that PCIs manage to adapt and flourish in our différent climates! Here, sisyrinchiums grow on all summer.
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Carolyn,
I will definitely share some photographs of the PCI Iris and Sisyrinchium this coming spring. I have some South American Sisyrinchiums too, however I have yet to try any in the summer dry areas. I am not sure they would survive.
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Your American Sisyrinchium reminds me of our Orthrosanthus, which I believe is represented in South Africa as well.
Here's another of the Pacific coast hybrids I've been given.
[attachimg=1]
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Jamus,
Beautiful PCI!
There are not many that I do not like. The flowers may be ephemeral, but for me PCI are well worth growing.
By the way, the previous PCI may indeed be Iris innominata. Glossy foliage and somewhat ruffled flowers are good signs. If the Iris grows about 20 cm tall and has generally 2 flowers per stem, these would be good indications too.
Sisyrinchium bellum is our xeric Sisyrinchium species. The others are hydric for the most part. I will have to look up Orthrosanthus.
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About a week earlier than last year, Iris unguicularis. The clump didn't get it's annual hair-cut and tidy up this year so is looking pretty ragged. (much like it's owner really)
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Already!
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It's been early for the last couple of years.
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Variegated Iris laevigata growing in a water-pot,
cheers
fermi
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It's been early for the last couple of years.
Another one, just to show the first one wasn't a fluke.
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Irisarians will be aware of the recent death of Tony Huber- who was much involved in growing iris particularly the beardless iris.
Brita Carson who is writing his obituary has asked for help in finding lists of his introductions and notes or photos of his plants that you may be growing. If you can help, please contact Brita via britacarsonATbtinternet.com ( - replacing the AT with @ )
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Tony Huber was much involved with beardless irises. His species and species hybrids registrations and introductions can be seen on the American Iris Society Iris Encyclopedia in the 'hybridizers' pages.
http://wiki.irises.org/bin/view/Main/Bio/HybridizerHuberTony (http://wiki.irises.org/bin/view/Main/Bio/HybridizerHuberTony)
Lawrence Ransom
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Excellent information, Lawrence, thank you!
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Spuria iris have started in our garden:
Golden Lady
Clara Ellen
Intensity
possibly Buttered Chocolate
Fergie's Poetry
cheers
fermi
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Spuira Iris Barleycorn
cheers
fermi
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Barleycorn's rather acid yellow is a good foil for the foliage, isn't it?
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I was sure that you'd comment on 'Buttered Chocolate', Maggi ;D
cheers
fermi
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I was sure that you'd comment on 'Buttered Chocolate', Maggi ;D
cheers
fermi
I hate to be too predictable!
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;D ;D ;D
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This is a welcome sight on a gloomy November day, albeit later than David's in Devon.
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south wall Ralph?
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Well caught up Ralph.
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south wall Ralph?
Yes, very warm and sunny.
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Well caught up Ralph.
Worth waiting for.
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By the way Ralph, if there was a prize for the tattiest plant mine would win.
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In southern Turkey, in pine forests at the Burning Stones (Chimeira or Yanartash) we saw an Iris in beautiful stocks for which only Iris unguicularis seems to fit. But they flowered very exposed above the tufts of leaves, while I otherwise only know pictures and descriptions with low standing flowers, often sunk-in in the foliage.
As the pictures show, the position of the flowers is not due to a long stem, but apparently the highly elongated pedicel or even the perianth tube (??). (photos taken in february)
There are also plants in the population, which show this elongation not quite as strong. (3rd pict.)
Does anyone know of such Iris types in southern Turkey or the eastern Mediterranean? Could it be the carica-taxon or the syriaca-taxon, both related to eg. included in I. unguicularis?
Many thanks
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Possibly Iris lazica
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I. lazica has dwarf, wider leaves with a bright green, distributed on the coast of the Black Sea.
For usual I. unguiculares the leaves are too long and the flower stem is tall and slender
Mayby a local form of I. unguicularis, which has got species or subspec. status ?
I know I. ung. subspec. carica from Rhodos, but it looks also very dwarf on open, sunny habitats.
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David, Gerhard, thankyou for your comments. I. lazica i exclude too because of it´s restriction to the north-east of Turkey.
Well, it seems to be I. unguicularis in an undetermined subtaxon.
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I saw similar form all around Adrasan, i think it's subsp syriaca
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Only one flower stem this year on the "Eye Shadow iris" hybrid 'Kin-Boshi';
And a first flowering on an Iris ensata hybrid (not sure of the name)
cheers
fermi
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In the Northern Hemisphere, Iris lazica is flowering. And Iris foetidissima seedheads continue to please.