Patagonia-Really hardy material

[Robert G]

I am curious if anyone out there can direct me regarding plant material or sources of that would be from the coldest parts of South America. It is a stretch I know. I have checked out www.chileflora.com and will probaly contact them. If there is any chance of anything surviving here it must be from high elevations. I think seed source would be the most important factor if success is at all possible. You know the notion that seed from the same species higher up the mountain, although often not collected, would have the hardier genes. It has worked in the past. This is part of a project connected to my work so any botanical gardens I could contact would welcome. Since it is connected with my work the focus is on woody plants, but not exclusive to. Remember that I live in USDA zone 4, although we have many zone 5 plants living in sheltered areas. Even then I suspect it is a stretch.

[Lori S.]

I can't help with Patagonian seeds, but it would be helpful to hear about what you've tried and not found hardy (or did find hardy), in case anyone can suggest other good candidates for your area that you may possibly not have considered yet. 

Woody species are definitely orders of magnitude more difficult than perennials here, where we don't usually  get lasting snow cover and have a very dry growing season and very dessicating conditions through the winter - I'm guessing that ephemeral snow cover and low rainfall/humidity would not pose such problems there? 
Since you mention that your focus on woody plants does not exclude others, I will mention that it is not difficult to find alpines that are hardy in these zone 3 conditions, if that's any help.

[cohan]

beavercreek does have some south american material rated zone 3-6ish; mostly not woodies, but maybe some small woodies...
http://www.rockgardenplants.com/
likely wrightman's does also...

[johnw]

Robert

re: South American hardies

This has got to be the shortest list on record though it beats the NZ list for here which is quite blank aside from a few very Hebes and Celmesias and one or two conifers.

The SA woodies growing here were collected in Tierra del Fuego and in the vicinity of Bariloche & Estancia Stag River or brought in from BC.

Araucaria araucana - one here doing quite well in Z7, just a commercial form.
Nothofagus antarctica - no special collection. Vigorous. Zone 6b
N. obliqua - struggling here in Z7 and just a little better in St. John's
N. procera - precarious here in Z7, just ok in St. John's
N. pumila - I bet it might be as hardy as antarctica but mine from Milde Arboretum died in a pot before testing
Berberis darwinii - Z6b but better in our Z7
Berberis chilensis - Z6b
Berberis empetrifolia - fine though slow in St. John's.
Fuchsia magellanica - better in Z7 but root hardy here as a rule
Pernettya mucronata - okay in Z6 but much more vigorous in our Z7,  Iunker-Ufro/Tweedy/Wilkins/Comber collections/friends
Bacharris magellanica - fine in Z6
Eucryphia glutinosa - hanging on by a frayed thread in Z7
Gunnera manicata and G. tinctoria with protection - cheating a bit!

All seem to despise summer heat & humidity as witnessed by the accession lists of all East Coast Botanic garden which show no survivors of the above. St. John's excluded from that and perhaps the  few Araucarias on the east coast of the USA.  All seem to perform best in summer cool Z7, hardiness generally is over-rated. You can add to this a smattering of perennials and bulbs.

re: altitude In China some of the very highest woodies - above 4300m as I recall - are frequently tender - ie Rhododendron forrestii, R. sanguineum, R. lepidotum which buried in snow and are solid Z7 plants and not the easiest to grow either while a bit lower down there are hardier species.  My guess is Tweedy and Comber did a pretty good job at collecting hardier forms, or the hardier ones were selected in the UK from their seed. Still it would be great to spend a year there just to see what's what with the temperatures and the snow cover and go from there. I'd love to get a hardy Chusquea culeo, saw some stunners at RBGE.

It would be of great interest for me too to hear from the South American forumists or others of what else might be worth a try and from where.

johnw   

[Lori S.]

Looking through the Beaver Creek list, I see :
"Junellia wilzeckii   $6.00     1" x 12" Patagonia Zone 3
Flat mats of small grey-green leaves are adorned through summer by upfacing lilac pink fragrant blooms; a suprisingly hardy & vigorous new Patagonian plant for troughs/rock gardens everywhere; older plants develop attractive contorted weeping woody stems, a trait that could be used to good effect spilling over the edge of a raised bed or trough."

I've had this for some years now in a trough - extremely slow growing; from Beaver Creek.  It finally produced a tiny (but compound!) spray of flowers last year.  (I may have posted a photo here, don't recall.  At any rate, it was not exactly anything to write home about yet, though interesting to me.)

EDIT:  Oh, and I guess there's Azorella trifurcata, which is completely hardy here, though not woody.  I'm convinced that this plant would survive on the moon! 

[cohan]

it would be interesting to know if some of the patagonians might do better here with drier winters and cooler summers than in fact in the warmer east..
certainly for patagonian cacti, their intolerance of winter wet is considered as important as cold hardiness (though i doubt many if any are actually this cold hardy)..
note that vojtech holubec is supposed to have his list of patagonian seed ready soon, if not already..

[johnw]

note that vojtech holubec is supposed to have his list of patagonian seed ready soon, if not already..

There you go, he'll have the goods.  His list is not up yet.

johnw

[Onion]

This is part of a project connected to my work so any botanical gardens I could contact would welcome. Since it is connected with my work the focus is on woody plants, but not exclusive to. Remember that I live in USDA zone 4, although we have many zone 5 plants living in sheltered areas. Even then I suspect it is a stretch.

Robert,
please contact Professor Fred Schröder from Goettingen. He stays several times in South-america, collecting seeds of  Araucaria araucana for the Botanic Garden and other woody species, with the same aim, hardy species for his climate. There are three botanic gardens in Goettingen. I don't know to which one he belongs now.
The links were given on the homepage of the "Old(Alt)Garden" of Goettingen.

http://www.altgart.uni-goettingen.de/

[Robert G]

Thank you everyone for your responses.

Lori- I am at home right now and am drawing a blank regarding woodies we have that you might be interested in trying. I will get something for you tomorrow. One thing you could do is google 'Dominion Arboretum Living Collection.' Honestly if there would be anything interested in trying and it sets seed  (cuttings too) let me know. You are in country after all. Off the top of my head- asian Acers, Cercis hardy strains and Magnolia cultivars come to mind. In some cases I suspect some hardiness ratings were changed based on their performance here...long before I got here. Iwould love to here what you have had luck with and I am interested in anything from anywhere that could grow here.

Cohan- thanks for the seed list suggestions. I suspect I will get something interesting from those sources.

John- Thank you so much for the great list. Maybe I should just move. I know it was a long shot. I would love it if just one Nothofagus would make it here...N.pumila maybe? You are right about hardiness in Asia, but one must be optimistic. You are right too I would love to here from any forumists that are somewhat local.

Uli/Onion-Thank you for that contact. I will get a hold of him. He is exactly who I wouldlike to talk to.

[Lori S.]

So, you are looking more for things with definite tree-like stature?
If woody plants with alpine characteristics are OK too, from my own (albeit limited) experience, I'd suggest trying Betula apoiensis, and various alpine salixes.