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Author Topic: Extreme Botanical Photography  (Read 3370 times)

David Lyttle

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Re: Extreme Botanical Photography
« Reply #15 on: March 20, 2021, 10:33:56 AM »
Hi Kris,
You would be no stranger to snow. When I was living in Saskatoon I remember the clear, sunny winters days with temperatures of -20 and sun dogs in the sky. In the summer I spent a lot of my free time photographing wildflowers at various locations round the Province. The main problem was the mosquitos!
David Lyttle
Otago Peninsula, Dunedin, South Island ,
New Zealand.

Maggi Young

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Re: Extreme Botanical Photography
« Reply #16 on: March 20, 2021, 02:39:05 PM »
    Myosotis retrorsa Meudt, Prebble & Hindm.-Walls, Austral. Syst. Bot. 31(1): 91 (2018)   
    https://www.publish.csiro.au/sb/SB17045
Margaret Young in Aberdeen, North East Scotland Zone 7 -ish!

Editor: International Rock Gardener e-magazine

Leucogenes

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Re: Extreme Botanical Photography
« Reply #17 on: March 20, 2021, 05:42:18 PM »
Hello David and Rudi

I think I am the reason for the wrong name of the Myosotis offered here. In previous years it was offered as M. pulvinaris.

In September 2017 I showed it in the Treat for alpine NZ. After a correction I gave Gerd the hint for the name M. glabrescens. You can read it again...from page 13 (#191)

As Gerd lives only 20 minutes away from me, I will bring forward my annual visit a bit and visit him next week. I will tell him about Myosotis retrorsa...he will be pleased. Attached is another photo from today...

So if I have caused any confusion by my hasty behaviour, I apologise very much.

David... all the pictures of yours shown make me very happy...this lone Celmisia angustifolia and the great photography of the foliage are just one example.

I look forward to seeing more pictures of your fieldwork.

Cheers
Thomas

kris

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Re: Extreme Botanical Photography
« Reply #18 on: March 20, 2021, 07:10:41 PM »
Hi Kris,
You would be no stranger to snow. When I was living in Saskatoon I remember the clear, sunny winters days with temperatures of -20 and sun dogs in the sky. In the summer I spent a lot of my free time photographing wildflowers at various locations round the Province. The main problem was the mosquitos!
Hi David
Happy to know that you lived here before. Few people even from Canada sometimes  ask where Saskatoon is. It is a lovely place in summer but winter is brutal.
Saskatoon,Canada
-35C to +30C

ruweiss

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Re: Extreme Botanical Photography
« Reply #19 on: March 20, 2021, 08:45:43 PM »
Hi David and Thomas, thank you for yor help with the true name of the Myosotis.
Rudi Weiss,Waiblingen,southern Germany,
climate zone 8a,elevation 250 m

David Lyttle

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Re: Extreme Botanical Photography
« Reply #20 on: March 21, 2021, 10:28:05 AM »
Hello Thomas,
The picture you show is almost certainly Myosotis retrosa. However it is I who need to provide the clarification for the mis-application of M glabrescens name to the plant not you. When the pictures of the plant first appeared on the SRGC forum they were posted as M. pulvinaris. I saw them and it was obvious to me they were not M. pulvinaris the main difference being the anthers were held above the corolla scales. The only other option that seemed to be available was M. glabrescens which was known at that time from only a small number of old herbarium specimens. It was re-discovered in 2007 by Mike Thorsen on the Hector Mountains but was not able to be relocated there subsequently. Mike's  original photos are in "Above the Treeline" and on the NZPCN website.

In 2017 we had a plant that we knew was in the UK and Europe that had originally been grown from seed collected in the Eyre Mountains. Dave Toole had photographed it in the Eyres. Several people including myself were keen to go there and find it. I went in there with Dave in Dec 2017 to his site below Hummock Peak. We found one solitary cushion of the Myosotis with no open flowers. It was a fairly miserable day so we were not anxious to linger botanising. I photographed the plant and sent the photos to Heidi. She visited the site again with Dave and found more plants. See link https://blog.tepapa.govt.nz/2018/08/20/searching-in-needles-and-haystacks-for-forget-me-nots/ The Eyre mountains plant has turned out to be a new species Myosotis retrorsa which is widespread mainly in western Otago, Southland and Fiordland.

In Feb 2020 we were back in the Eyre Mountains collecting Myosotis. We found plenty of Myosotis retrorsa, Myosotis druceii and Myosotis macrantha but no Myosotis glabrescens https://blog.tepapa.govt.nz/2020/10/14/photo-essay-remote-field-work-collecting-forget-me-nots-in-the-south-island/ After I had left the field party they visited End Peak near Wanaka and found Myosotis glabrescens https://blog.tepapa.govt.nz/2020/09/01/finding-data-deficient-forget-me-nots/ Subsequently it has also been found on Treble Cone close by.

It is not a matter of people being right or wrong when names are mis-applied in cases such as this. We have three species of forget-me-not, Myosotis pulvinaris which is fairly well known and understood, a data deficient species Myosotis glabrescens and a newly recognised species, Myosotis retrorsa. It has taken a lot of work in the field and herbarium examining countless specimens for Heidi to resolve this problem. The state of botanical knowledge moves on.

Hello David and Rudi

I think I am the reason for the wrong name of the Myosotis offered here. In previous years it was offered as M. pulvinaris.

In September 2017 I showed it in the Treat for alpine NZ. After a correction I gave Gerd the hint for the name M. glabrescens. You can read it again...from page 13 (#191)

As Gerd lives only 20 minutes away from me, I will bring forward my annual visit a bit and visit him next week. I will tell him about Myosotis retrorsa...he will be pleased. Attached is another photo from today...

So if I have caused any confusion by my hasty behaviour, I apologise very much.

David... all the pictures of yours shown make me very happy...this lone Celmisia angustifolia and the great photography of the foliage are just one example.

I look forward to seeing more pictures of your fieldwork.

Cheers
Thomas
David Lyttle
Otago Peninsula, Dunedin, South Island ,
New Zealand.

Leucogenes

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Re: Extreme Botanical Photography
« Reply #21 on: March 21, 2021, 11:17:17 AM »
Hello David

Thanks for the detailed explanation. A fantastic story about a small plant...that's what makes it so exciting for me.
I have not been able to establish this Myosotis retrorsa permanently in the Alpinum yet, but still I persevere.
Cultivating high alpine native NZ continues to be a major challenge in our changing climate. I have a lot of species in this year's sowing...with a lot of patience and a dose of naivety, I will continue to try to build up a little NZ here.

BTW...your two photos of Raoulia youngii shown are super. At first glance they bear some resemblance to Leucogenes grandiceps. I have fond memories of your pictures of the different growth forms from different locations.

« Last Edit: March 21, 2021, 11:29:10 AM by Leucogenes »

David Lyttle

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Re: Extreme Botanical Photography
« Reply #22 on: March 23, 2021, 09:59:34 AM »
On our second day in the field we went to the Pisa Range where we planned to collect Myosotis cheesemanii. The site was above Lake McKay where Hamish and I had found it in December 2014 on a NZAGS field trip. The Pisa Range runs roughly NE parallel to the Clutha River which has its source in Lakes Wanaka and Hawea. We had intended to drive to the site but at 1800 m just above the Kirtle Burn hut we encountered snow which resulted in a severe loss of traction. The only other option was to walk which we did. Heidi was anxious to get to the site so there was lingering to look at the plants. We walked down a steep  broken slope covered in mounds of Aciphylla simplex. It was blowing quite hard at the time Strong winds are a feature of these mountains which is why the main vegetation type is a dwarfed tundra-like cushion field.

Cushion field vegetation  on the Pisa Range dominated by Dracophyllum muscoides. Lake Hawea is in the distance.
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Looking north east towards the Waitaki Valley
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However I did manage to snatch a few pictures on my phone.

Aciphylla kirkii dwarfed because of the extreme conditions at this elevation. Often confused with Aciphylla hectorii which is a smaller plant.


Carex pterocarpa which is a high alpine sedge


Celmisia angustifolia Not sure why I took the photo as the plant is not flowering and is not particularly rare - I think it was an experimental one testing the phone.
David Lyttle
Otago Peninsula, Dunedin, South Island ,
New Zealand.

David Lyttle

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Re: Extreme Botanical Photography
« Reply #23 on: March 24, 2021, 10:49:57 PM »
We kept going and so did the wind. The ridge crest drops steeply on the eastern side. There were plenty of snowbanks persisting especially with the recent snow.

Crest of Pisa Range with sparse cushionfield and late snowbanks. Lake Dunstan in the distance.


Late snow bank above Lake McKay
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Above Lake McKay Myosotis cheesemanii habitat is on the upper margin of the snowbanks.


We searched along the snowbank margins and on the snow-free areas below them  but all we found at this point was Myosotis pulvinaris.


There were also numerous plants of Gentianella divisa flowering in the exposed cushionfield.


David Lyttle
Otago Peninsula, Dunedin, South Island ,
New Zealand.

David Lyttle

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Re: Extreme Botanical Photography
« Reply #24 on: March 24, 2021, 11:27:13 PM »
We could not find the Myosotis cheesemanii where we thought it was so we extended the search further along the ridge crest and then into places that where we thought it was unlikely to be but to no avail. We concluded it was under the snow but when we started for home at 5.30 pm we found some plants. We had covered the ground earlier. The plants were localised to a very small area.





Rugged crest of the Pisa Range above Lake MaKay


Looking across the upper Clutha towards Mt St Bathans.  The Hawkdun Range with its crest covered with snow is in the far right distance.
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The Dunstan Range with the Thomson Gorge (on the eastern side directly across from the rock out crop) separating the North and South Dunstans. There is a road through the Dunstans through the Thomson Gorge. There are a lot of gates to open. We drove back through it 3 days later after visiting the North Dunstans.
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« Last Edit: March 24, 2021, 11:34:59 PM by David Lyttle »
David Lyttle
Otago Peninsula, Dunedin, South Island ,
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Gabriela

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Re: Extreme Botanical Photography
« Reply #25 on: March 27, 2021, 03:04:39 PM »
Thanks again David for this virtual tour of superb NZ mountain scenery.
I don't know how you managed to take such excellent pictures in harsh conditions and not to mention with the phone!
Gabriela
Ontario, zone 5
http://botanicallyinclined.org/

David Lyttle

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Re: Extreme Botanical Photography
« Reply #26 on: March 28, 2021, 11:03:04 AM »
Hello Gabriella,
Thank you for your kind remarks. Working in the field can be challenging at times. I am aiming to get publication quality photos. In the field I use a Nikon D850 with a 105 mm macro lens + a 16-35 wide angle zoom lens. I use a tripod in the field as the Nikon is a very unforgiving camera. I find I can get good images under most conditions. The phone is a useful adjunct device. It's a Samsung A21s which is not top of there range but has a fairly useful camera. I use when I don't want to set up my camera (in a hurry, in the rain or just a record photo I don't want to take time over). I contribute photo observations to iNaturalist NZ which is a citizen science website. The phone enables you to provide the GPS co-ordinates directly for location data. iNaturalist has an app that lets you enter observations in the field provided you have cell phone reception. The phone photos are good enough for the internet especially if you need to downsize them as you do for the forum
David Lyttle
Otago Peninsula, Dunedin, South Island ,
New Zealand.

Gabriela

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Re: Extreme Botanical Photography
« Reply #27 on: March 28, 2021, 10:15:27 PM »
Thanks David. You always post excellent pictures and assumed that you always use a professional camera that's why I was surprised when I read that you took
equally good (in my opinion) pictures with the phone.
I also have a Samsung phone (not top of the line as well) and in the last couple of years I tried it here and there for taking pictures, most often with disappointing results. I guess I just need to persevere and hope that the saying "practice makes perfect" proves to be true one day :)
But indeed, it is very practical to use when you just need a record photo for yourself.
Gabriela
Ontario, zone 5
http://botanicallyinclined.org/

David Lyttle

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Re: Extreme Botanical Photography
« Reply #28 on: April 01, 2021, 09:52:38 AM »
Thanks David. You always post excellent pictures and assumed that you always use a professional camera that's why I was surprised when I read that you took equally good (in my opinion) pictures with the phone.
I also have a Samsung phone (not top of the line as well) and in the last couple of years I tried it here and there for taking pictures, most often with disappointing results. I guess I just need to persevere and hope that the saying "practice makes perfect" proves to be true one day :)
But indeed, it is very practical to use when you just need a record photo for yourself.

Gabriela, I delete a lot of my phone pictures. I find the image is very hard to see on the screen especially in bright light. Its hard to see if it is in focus or not.  My phone does give you options to adjust exposure, white balance etc but I find it is almost impossible to see the screen to operate the touch controls in the field. If my eyesight was better it might not be such a problem. So here is the comparison;

(1) Myosotis goyenii Samsung A21s phone


(2) same plant Nikon D850 on tripod with 16-35 mm zoom lens


This particular Myosotis is quite rare and was growing on a steep rock outcrop so here I am photographing it.


The site is the rock outcrop immediately above the figures in the photo.
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David Lyttle
Otago Peninsula, Dunedin, South Island ,
New Zealand.

Gabriela

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Re: Extreme Botanical Photography
« Reply #29 on: April 01, 2021, 11:48:40 PM »
Gabriela, I delete a lot of my phone pictures. I find the image is very hard to see on the screen especially in bright light. Its hard to see if it is in focus or not.  My phone does give you options to adjust exposure, white balance etc but I find it is almost impossible to see the screen to operate the touch controls in the field. If my eyesight was better it might not be such a problem. So here is the comparison;

Thanks David, you are right. In bright light I was never able to take a decent picture (decent meaning to be able at least to see what's on it). In the garden, with some patience and at the right moment you can capture something 'not too bad'.
But nothing compares of course with taking pictures with a camera, not to mention with your Nikon on tripod! Quite a commitment to carry it on the mountains in not very accessible places.

The last picture is National Geographic quality, or even more, breathtaking! An invitation to exploration :)
Gabriela
Ontario, zone 5
http://botanicallyinclined.org/

 


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