Seed Exchange - packeting query

[robg]

I'm doing some of the Wild Collected Seed, and have run into a problem with two members of the Allium family that appear to be bulbils rather than seed - those of you familiar with the seed exchange will know that bulbils, as 'live' material, cannot be sent outside the EC and the packets need to be identified.

I was fairly comfortable that what is purported to be seed of Allium Oleraceum is bulbils, but I then opened a packet of Allium Roseum and they appear to be bulbils too - my confidence in my previous diagnosis was then somewhat rattled !

Can someone come to my rescue please. 

Rob

[David Shaw]

Mark the individual packets as 'BULBILS', Rob, and note what you have found on your returns sheet. I would use red pen and block capitals to highlight his to the team.

[robg]

Thanks David - I realised after I'd posted this query that of course they were bulbils because they varied in size - doh !!  Marked up as you suggested.

This is the first time I've done packeting so it's a different ball-game to doing the Distribution.  The trouble is that if the donor does not identify as such to Stuart, then he would have to go through every incoming packet to spot that they were bulbils.  Perhaps he should do that for Alliums, but maybe it is reasonable to leave it to the packeter - just my luck to be the 'newbie' who catches it!!  I'm sure this must have happened before though.

Rob

[Karaba]

Sorry, I forgot to write on the packets and in the list I sent to Stuart that these were bulbils, I only sent an email to mention it but I was late. Rob, I' also a newbie as a donor, I will try to be better next year ;-)

[fermi de Sousa]

Bother! That's one of my first choices I won't be getting! We can't have bulbils sent to us in Australia (and little chance of them "turning around" anyway!). Maybe someone who gets the bulbils will one day donate seed from them
cheers
fermi

[Karaba]

I have also wild collected seeds of Allium oleraceum (it grows wild in my garden )) but only one seed of Allium roseum (and I havesown it). I went to southern France this spring but it was blooming and I only collected few more bulbs. I hope to get some seeds next year.

[robg]

Bother! That's one of my first choices I won't be getting! We can't have bulbils sent to us in Australia (and little chance of them "turning around" anyway!). Maybe someone who gets the bulbils will one day donate seed from them
cheers
fermi

Hi Karaba - forgiven.  Just the luck of two newbies! 

I've done the Distribution for years but now that Edinburgh have passed that on, I've taken up packeting.  I should have had no problem spotting bulbils, but getting two in a row threw me initially.

Rob

[robg]

Hi guys - back again with another query.

The wild seed has two donors of Anemone Occidentalis -- and the seed is different.  One packet is pale brown seed with long tails, the other about the same size but clearly darker in colour and no tails.  Has anyone got any knowledge of the seeds of this plant?  Otherwise what do I do?

Cheers
Rob

[Karaba]

One have maybe removed the tail... (I have done this with Dryas and Pulsatilla vernalis and alpina...) and the color is sometime different depending on the maturation of the seed when it has been collected.
Here's a picture of the seed : http://science.halleyhosting.com/nature/cascade/5petal/butter/anemone/occidentalis.htm

[Maggi Young]

The wild seed has two donors of Anemone occidentalis -- and the seed is different.  One packet is pale brown seed with long tails, the other about the same size but clearly darker in colour and no tails.  Has anyone got any knowledge of the seeds of this plant? 

This sort of query is exactly why those of us in this forum have been working over some years to bring together a collection of photos of  IDENTIFIED seed which can be used to help in these cases.

With  5500 seeds  offered each year in the SRGC Exchange this is clearly a mammoth task - which would undoubtedly be made easier if those sending in seed they KNOW to be correct would also photograph the seed on graph paper and post it to our seed ID project, or at least pass such photos on to me.

This thread is the one I'm speaking of: http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=4426.0   It is possible to search a plant name  only in the  Seed Exchange section of the forum , in order to refine  the search.

Sadly, Anemone occidentalis  ( syn. Pulsatilla occidentalis)  is not included- as yet!

[robg]

Thanks Maggi - that's been a useful trigger to make me aware of this facility and perhaps some others as well.

I do just wonder how widely your efforts are known as in all the years of doing the Distribution no one has mentioned this (that I can remember  ).  Certainly when packeting your efforts will be a help.

Rob

[Maggi Young]

A travesty  that no-one has mentioned it  in the Seed Team -  it is something that I have been working on for years and Ian and Carole do know about it. Originally it was something that was hoped to be a project that we would work on with NARGS and AGS, but I think the SRGC is the only one doing anything- unless those others are also working, but "secretly"!

Ian Pryde has also  been experimenting with macro photography of the seeds for the project. . We have nearly 750 seed pix on our lists from the Forum.  I have heard nothing from the other organisations.

We also give links in the Seed ID page and it's "reply" page  to various sites where good photos of seed can be found  - some of us are putting  effort into this!

[David Nicholson]

Hi guys - back again with another query.

The wild seed has two donors of Anemone Occidentalis -- and the seed is different.  One packet is pale brown seed with long tails, the other about the same size but clearly darker in colour and no tails.  Has anyone got any knowledge of the seeds of this plant?  Otherwise what do I do?

Rob, similar happened last year, see this http://www.srgc.net/forum/index.php?topic=12125.msg310040#msg310040

They turned out to be Anemone megallanica

[Lori S.]

I was one of the donors of wild-collected Anemone occidentalis - the seed I sent had the long tails intact.  Here's a photo of seed from the same small collection:

The plant is pretty unmistakeable in seed:

As said, unless the seed is quite different in shape/size, it may just be that the tails were clipped off?


(P.S.  I would submit photos of seed of verified ID but as you can see, I always have problems with lighting in the photos.  )

[Maggi Young]

Lori, the habitat shot is a real charmer- so many Castillejas, too!   

May I respectfully suggest that a well- ID'd  photo , even with lighting "issues"  is definitely  more  worthwhile than no photo!