Scottish Rock Garden Club Forum
Specific Families and Genera => Pleione and Orchidaceae => Topic started by: fredg on June 15, 2012, 07:34:03 PM
-
This site is Ophry apifera only.
A narrow strip of grass besides a main road belonging to an empty small factory.Took a trip over yesterday and it's far too early. I did spot about a dozen plants but only the one in flower so far.
The Dactylorhiza on Site 1 just down the road are slow this year too. I'll revisit in a couple of weeks.
-
Fred, your great photos here- and in other threads, are showing me how variable the Ophrys apifera are.... so many little faces.
-
That's why I'd like to get to this very limited site at the optimum time Maggi.
I would like to record the variation in markings of the small community, which is probably formed from the one genetic source, while the flowers are in prime condition
Already I have noticed three plants with their inflorecence broken off :(
-
I returned to this site as promised.
I hope people aren't getting bored with photos of Ophrys apifera, there's just so many plants this year.
-
I find these pictures to be a fascinating record of the subtle variations in the markings ofthese flowers.
And, even though Peter H. points out elsewhere, these orchids can be locally plentiful, I think it is a good thing that we can all see and share in the pleasure of them - especially those of us without such treasures in our area.
-
I'm very much enjoying seeing them all Fred. :o 8)
I hope you can continue to post pictures in this volume for years to come.
-
Excuse my ignorance please Fred. In 22012e are the pale flowers just older, or are they truly paler versions of the 'norm'? How many plants are in this picture?
-
There are two stems in that picture Ron, each of which has light (older) and dark flowers.
There are examples of this at the new site too. I'm not sure why it happens as other plants keep the darker flowers when old.
-
So each flower, even on the same plant, has individual markings? No two Ophyris apifera flowers are the same?
-
Well, looking closely at my photographs, variations in markings do seem to appear on flowers of the same plant. However there are also examples where they don't appear to do so.
I'll sit firmly on the fence for now ;)
-
This happens when the flower is pollinated as soon as the pollen touches the stigmatic surface the flower starts to collapse and changes colour.Can i just say this bee orchid is wind pollinated for those that don't know.
-
Well, looking closely at my photographs, variations in markings do seem to appear on flowers of the same plant. However there are also examples where they don't appear to do so.
I'll sit firmly on the fence for now ;)
I've just been through every pic I can find on Google images ( it was either that or do some decorating! ;D ), and I cannot find one image where the flowers on the same plant are identical. Same goes for all pics I can find on here.
Thanks for pointing that out Davey. I guess I assumed it was insects. ::) :-[
-
Fred
you seem to be having a good year visiting these various sites. Very nice to see them
-
I'll have to disagree with wind pollination as Ophrys apifera self-pollinates.
In Ophrys apifera, the pollinia are held in a chamber at the tip of the anther column. At the base they are attached to the column by a long slender thread or caudicle. As the flower develops the pollinia drop out, dangling on the caudicles, moving about in any slight breeze until they become attached to the sticky stigmatic surface at the base of the column.
1 Pollinium hanging on caudicle
2 Side view
3 Pollinia attached to the stigma, pollination occurs
-
Fascinating information Fred. 8)
Is this unique amongst the Genus Ophrys?
-
Fascinating plants. I did not know you could get them any farther than the South coast
I spent several holidays in Crete , Rhodes, Cyprus, Corfu and mainland Greece photographing Bee Orchids. Even armed with the best field guides, I could not identify many of the plants with certainty. There were so many variables within the group. I came to the conclusion that many of the named "sub-species"were actually just standard variations within the group. Maybe just to satisfy the ego of the author !
-
So each flower, even on the same plant, has individual markings? No two Ophyris apifera flowers are the same?
Can anyone help me understand why this should be the case please?
-
maggi asked why the flowers had eveolved to attract bees if the flowers are self- fertile
Ummmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm
While we research that, this is worth a read ;D
http://independent.academia.edu/RichardBateman/Papers/1240239/Conflicting_species_concepts_underlie_perennial_taxonomic_controversies_in_Ophrys (http://independent.academia.edu/RichardBateman/Papers/1240239/Conflicting_species_concepts_underlie_perennial_taxonomic_controversies_in_Ophrys)
-
Some interesting information in these.
It's not so much what she looks like it's the way she smells. ;D
Evolution of sexual mimicry in the orchid subtribe orchidinae: the role of preadaptations in the attraction of male bees as pollinators
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2267782/?tool=pubmed (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2267782/?tool=pubmed)
Integrating past and present studies on Ophrys
pollination – a comment on Bradshaw et al.
http://homepages.ulb.ac.be/~nvereeck/PDF's/Vereecken_et_al_2011_Comment_Bradshaw.pdf (http://homepages.ulb.ac.be/~nvereeck/PDF's/Vereecken_et_al_2011_Comment_Bradshaw.pdf)
Why sexually deceptive orchids have colored flowers
http://www.landesbioscience.com/journals/cc/SpaetheCIB3-2.pdf (http://www.landesbioscience.com/journals/cc/SpaetheCIB3-2.pdf)
-
And what his advice is to call it WIND AIDED SELF POLLINATION and i am all for that.
Its like me using a cocktail stick to to a self pollination, it is just a different mechanism of it occurring.
-
Sorry Davey .....but how did I get dragged into this ( i hope it still is a ... ) friendly discussion? ??? I haven't said anything on this thread for two pages and then it was a gentle enquiry, and a thanks to you both for information provided.
But as I'm here it seems you both know exactly what you are talking about and are both saying the same thing. Nobody has mentioned the two genera of bees that are often quoted, apparently wrongly.... :o :-X
Edit - I stand corrected. It was mentioned earlier in the thread as this quote,
Quote from: David Lang :- Britain's Orchids
"Although nearly always self-pollinated, pollination by bees of the genera Andrena and Eucera may occur rarely."
Maybe we should focus our energies on tracking down some explanation to Maggis question then?
-
Cheers Davey. 8) ;D
I am more than capable of starting my own unwarranted arguements ... ;) ::) :-X :-[
Wish we had a shake hands emoticon.
p.s. are all O. apifera flowers unique? .......please :) :)
-
This thread was getting rather heated - not what we want, so those posts arguing are gone.
I hope all concerned can kiss and make-up.
I've said it before, I'll say it again here : play nicely, Boys! ;)
[attachimg=1]
[attachimg=2]
-
Yessss, ..... I never got zapped, ;D ;D ;D
-
What a wonderful relaxing image, :)
Bee Orchid in the Breeze (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_crYPWho_Y#)
-
This thread was getting rather heated - not what we want, so those posts arguing are gone.
I hope all concerned can kiss and make-up.
I've said it before, I'll say it again here : play nicely, Boys! ;)
(Attachment Link)
(Attachment Link)
Play nice boys. I hope not like these idiots, where do these type of folks come from.
does a landy float (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=basDf5nKo04#ws)
I got this from my koi forum today. Not sure if it works just by copying the link.
Angie :)