Scottish Rock Garden Club Forum
Bulbs => NARCISSUS => Topic started by: zvone on April 02, 2012, 06:50:06 PM
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Hi!
Narcissus from My Garden:
(https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-JVUMKFnephs/T3dl5bOpFsI/AAAAAAAAFv0/uTSQEgUIu54/s640/IMG_9540.JPG)
MORE PICTURES: http://zvonem.blogspot.si/news/
Best Regards! Zvone
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Looks like a lovely spring day? 8)
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Looks like a lovely spring day? 8)
Thank's Anthony!
Beautiful allegory!
Best Regards! zvone
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N.Chiva has just started i love this little thing(cheers Fred).
(http://i964.photobucket.com/albums/ae121/davep1970/DSCF0005.jpg)
This one was grown from a mixed seed packet a few years ago.
(http://i964.photobucket.com/albums/ae121/davep1970/DSCF0008.jpg)
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That is very nice Davey. However, from "Daffseek" it seems to be simply a selected form of N. rupicola which is what it looks like. So, I don't understand why it should have a cv. name.
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That is very nice Davey. However, from "Daffseek" it seems to be simply a selected form of N. rupicola which is what it looks like. So, I don't understand why it should have a cv. name.
Gerry i have no idea.I just love it.
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It is an extremely attractive flower; most forms of N.rupicola are. They vary in size, the best ones are about 30mm in diam. Perhaps this selected form is slightly larger?
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This is my favourite daffodil, as it shows the influence of N. radiiflorus. I bought it as 'Mrs Langtry', which does not seem to be the correct name. Avon Bulbs sells it therefore as 'Elegance'. Does anybody know more ?
The Butterfly is Pieris napi, the Green-veined White.
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Hi Thomas, You might try the following website:
http://www.croft16daffodils.co.uk/
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Thank you, Anne, what a fascinating site.
My plant seems to resemble 'Stella' there, and what I grow as 'Stella' is quite different.
An I found a plant maybe even more star shaped and exciting than my 'Mrs Langtry' ... :D
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There are two Mrs Langtry's recorded on Daffseek:-
http://daffseek.org/query/query-detail.php?value1=Mrs.%20Langtry&lastpage=1& and
http://daffseek.org/query/query-detail.php?value1=Mrs.%20Langtry%23&lastpage=1&
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The second one with the year pre 2006 seems to fit what is sold nowadays as 'Mrs Langtry'. Maybe one should add "modern stock" to the name ... ?
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Whatever the name, these graceful old varieties have great charm.
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You are right, Anne, and I am getting more and more intrigued by their charm.
I show some more, even if these varieties are not plants for a rock garden ... :)
How I grow them
Bath's Flame
Lucifer
White Lady
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These old varieties are charming, I think. They look good in a more natural setting, as Thomas shows.
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White Lady is beautiful. I must watch for that one. I grow Lucifer here and it is a favourite of mine, but looks more orange than yours, Thomas.
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Thanks Thomas and Anne for showing these beautiful old cultivars. Several in my garden which have been here since the 1940s and may have come from an older garden nearby, look rather similar to the 'Bath's Flame' and 'Lucifer' you showed. I must check them more carefully next year.
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Interesting that some daffodils may date back to the 40s. Many purchased today seem to disappear after one year.
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Gerry,
I endorse you. Great narcissus flies are undercover and furtive... :o >:(
It's a cause in my garden, at least. Unfavourable weather is another... :(
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Gerry,
I endorse you. Great narcissus flies are undercover and furtive... :o >:(
It's a cause in my garden, at least. Unfavourable weather is another... :(
I don't know what the cause is Armin, though I doubt that it is narcissus fly here. Small species seem OK.
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Gerry,
if you once have the chance I recommend to visit the narcissus and tulip fields in the NL.
Under optimum growth and vertilizer regime conditions the 'newer' narcissus cultivars can grow unbelieveable huge!
In the first year in our gardens the blossom is fantastic due reserves from the previous year.
The same clone in my garden reaches 50% of the possible size in the second year...(not lifted and if no pests and no unfavourable weather kills them before)
Maybe 'old' cultivars can better acclimatise to 'normal' garden soil conditions then 'modern' jumbo breeds.
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A couple today, from north Burgos, Spain. About the names, you decided, as usual there is no agreement.
Ganymedes one receives 3 names:
Narcissus triandrus
Narcissus iohannis
Narcisus triandrus subsp. triandrus var. alejandrei
Bulbocodium one receives also 3 names:
Narcissus bulbocodium
Narcissus turgidus
Narcissus bulbocodium subsp. validus
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The Ganymedes is especially beautiful. Many thanks Rafa.
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I agree, a well-shaped flower, very pretty.
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Can anyone let me know what this one is please? Its been in the garden for years but only ever puts up this one flower.
I have plenty of seedlings from it though!
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Narcissus watieri- I'm impressed that it will survive longterm outdoors with you.
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Thanks again Maggi. :) Its in a very free draining area if that helps? Is it not one that usually lasts? I think Nora bought it at a fair about six years ago. It flowers every year but never mulitiplies. But it sets seed readily and they germinate and grow really well. I think I'll do a bit more homework on it now! ;D
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It is one that folks usually have a bit of bother getting to flower even under glass, Ron.
In our showing days we used to put big pots of it on the bench with dozens of flowers and got a few certificates with it, as I recall. Not sure where any pix might be though. The Bainbridges show another form they call 'Alabeish' ( that may not be 100% correct spelling :-\ ) but I don't like it so much as the type... which has rounder, flatter, fuller flowers. Alabeish tends to be more starry and have propelller twists in the petals. A pot of that was shown in the show pix of the forum recently... I'll go find it.
edit: found it .. in the Stirling show in Kincardine 2012 thread, first post of the page by Stan...Abaleish is the proper name!
http://www.srgc.org.uk/forum/index.php?topic=8836.0
and here from Perth Show 2010 http://www.srgc.org.uk/forum/index.php?topic=5350.msg148831#msg148831
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More on Narcissus watieri.... this link is to a Farrer medal winning potful from Nigel Fuller , at the Kent Show 2011, on the AGS website :
http://www.alpinegardensociety.net/shows/results/shows2011/shows/kent/images/Jon_Evans/sizednarcissus-watieri-exh-nigel-fuller-farrer-6622.jpg.html
http://www.srgc.org.uk/bulblog/log2006/260406/log.html to see this pic ( below) and also our own hybrid of watieri and triandrus.... N. 'Craigton Coquette'
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Incredible. :o Thanks for the follow up Maggi. :o
The pots at the shows, wow, so many in a pot. Would they be seed raised or asexual multiplication? And your plants and hybrid on the bulb log, very very nice.
Another plant I didn't know we had ::) ::), but we will take more notice of from now on!
p.s. That Perth show looks as though it was a Classic :o :o
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I would think Nigel's are clonal, not seed raised, but I am not sure. He's such a good grower he likely can get them multiplying happily.
Do you see what I mean about the "non-Abaleish" form being flatter, less reflexed, less twisting in the petals? I just prefer it... personal taste.
Perth is often a fab show... only downside is the strange "sports-hall" lighting. :-X
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Certainly the ' non- Abaleish' form appears to be less complicated and to my mind more stylish, but theres not much in it and I don't really know Daffs ( can I even call them that? ). Abaleish looks like its had the 'hair drier treatment'! You have seen many Maggi and noted their nuances, ;D; up until 2 hrs ago I had seen one and pretty much ignored it. So I go with your experience. :) :)
Must say I've enjoyed this steep learning curve ;D
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I suppose this might be N. watieri though I'm surprised to see it flowering in the open garden & even more surprised that it was on sale at a fair - it is hardly a common plant. I wonder if it could be the hybrid 'Xit'?
How tall is it Ron?
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A plant fair with many specialist nurseries. Sorry if I misled on that. Its what we call them here.
I'll retake a pic against a ruler tomorrow Gerry, but it's no more than a few inches.
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Gerry, I also think it could be Narcissus 'Xit', Narcissus watieri is also not easy to maintain in the dry Spain, so it puzzle me it can grows outdoors without problems there.
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Is 'Xit' fertile? This sets seed profusely.
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I don't think it is Xit - the proportions of the flower are wrong. Surprised that N. watieri would manage outside though.
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Looking at the photos of 'Xit' on Daffseek, they seem to vary somewhat (I suppose they are correctly identified).
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None of my watieri have seen fit to flower this year, so I can't show a side by side comparison.
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Maybe this helps it -
Annual rainfall (mm)
South Holderness - 600 ( but a lot less in last few years )
Segovia - 500
Atlas Mountains - 700
Very free draining soil ( its in our 'Med Bed' ). The rock is on the South side of the plant so its leaves (top 2/3 anyway) get full sun / uninterrupted light all day while the bulb and roots are in cool full shade from the rock all day. Plenty of other stuff growing all around it also, sucking the soil dry all year round almost ( unlike in a pot! ).
We are just very lucky I guess ;D ;D
Thanks for all your help everyone. We know approx. what it is now and thats good enough for us. :) :)
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We are just very lucky I guess ;D ;D
Skill, Ron, skill...
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A little thought went into the siting of it Anne, but only in a general 'what do bulbs from hot countries like?' sort of a way ;). I don't know one Daff from another, so lets say an educated great piece of luck! :) :)
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Rainfall can be misleading. In a lecture I was once told that Sri Lanka is lush tropical on one side and desert on the other. We were then asked to compare Sri Lanka's rain with that of Oban. Naturally we discussed Oban's incessant rain and empathised with the people living in the wet half of Sri Lanka. However, Oban gets the same annual rainfall as the desert side of Sri Lanka, which gets it all at once in the short wet season, not by being drip fed every day like Oban.
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None of my watieri have seen fit to flower this year...........
Same here. Likewise in 2011. It seems very fussy about summer treatment, hence my doubts about the identity of Ron's plant.
Here is mine from 2010.
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Very true Anthony, but the Atlas mountains rainfall curve is not extreme. However point taken. We are about 1 mile N of the great River Humber and its not unusual to see rain falling heavy over the river when we have none in the garden. Perhaps its not correct, but the local people say that the river draws the rain. ???
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Maybe this helps it -
Annual rainfall (mm)
South Holderness - 600 ( but a lot less in last few years )
Segovia - 500
Atlas Mountains - 700
I'm not sure figures on "annual rainfall" are particularly informative. Many bulbs - & certainly some narcissus - flower in running water but are completely dry (& often hot) when dormant.
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Not unlike myself Gerry. When I'm hot and dry I prefer to be dormant.
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Not unlike myself Gerry. When I'm hot and dry I prefer to be dormant.
Anthony - in that case, I recommend you bury yourself in a mix of equal parts JI3 & grit.
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Sounds like what Mark Antony proposed after the happening on the Ides of March? Grit I can get, now, but not JI3. Have to make something myself with bags of topsoil and seed compost and fine pumice.
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Hi!
Narcissus from My Garden:
(https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-581GHCbymHo/T4M_WKBhCFI/AAAAAAAAGQU/eO3GEp7xBwo/s640/IMG_9855.JPG)
Best Regards! Zvone
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The pictures of the firsts at the Norfolk & Norwich Spring Show which incorporates the East of England Championship (Class 1) are now online:
http://www.nnhs.org.uk/springshowgaller.html
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None of my watieri have seen fit to flower this year...........
Same here. Likewise in 2011. It seems very fussy about summer treatment, hence my doubts about the identity of Ron's plant.
Here is mine from 2010.
Not one I find easy either only one flower this year
Here a few of mine in the garden.
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Lovely, Ian! How do you keep the slugs off?
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None of my watieri have seen fit to flower this year...........
Same here. Likewise in 2011. It seems very fussy about summer treatment, hence my doubts about the identity of Ron's plant.
Here is mine from 2010.
Not one I find easy either only one flower this year
Here a few of mine in the garden.
Very nice Ian. I'm impressed that you can grow N. rupicola in the open garden.
Slugs are a problem here too & this year, caterpillars.
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Lovely, Ian! How do you keep the slugs off?
None of my watieri have seen fit to flower this year...........
Same here. Likewise in 2011. It seems very fussy about summer treatment, hence my doubts about the identity of Ron's plant.
Here is mine from 2010.
Not one I find easy either only one flower this year
Here a few of mine in the garden.
Very nice Ian. I'm impressed that you can grow N. rupicola in the open garden.
Slugs are a problem here too & this year, caterpillars.
Thanks
The plant is on what I call my scree garden but slugs can and do go here (well really I do use occasional slug pellets and hope :-\)
Can't claim any real skill here but this clone seems to do well in this spot and I notice is even seeding in front of the main plant. It is so small that it has to be in a raised position so that I can at least see it ;D. My pot under cover is much more leggy
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I'm so pleased.... I grew this Narcissus from Rafa's seed in 2008 and this is the first flower on the bulbs: N. bulbocodium ssp. bulbocodium And the other I purchased from the bulbil exchange last Sept at the Discussion weekend. I had no idea it would flower so soon...
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The pictures of the firsts at the Norfolk & Norwich Spring Show which incorporates the East of England Championship (Class 1) are now online:
http://www.nnhs.org.uk/springshowgaller.html
Good to see, Brian. Great website and Journal, by the way!!
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Why, thank you Maggi :-* :-*
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Had a visit from Bill Dijk on Thursday, and these were among the goodies I received> 8)
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The pictures of the firsts at the Norfolk & Norwich Spring Show which incorporates the East of England Championship (Class 1) are now online:
http://www.nnhs.org.uk/springshowgaller.html
Brian
Splendid website review of daffs. There's some genuine quality there, equal to the best of the northern growers. Thanks again for sharing.
Frazer
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Here is a favourite daff
N suzy
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Splendid website review of daffs. There's some genuine quality there, equal to the best of the northern growers. Thanks again for sharing.
The most pleasing thing Frazer, is that the entrant for class 1 has won the Championship for the first time. I know that Paul Payne (one of the other growers) exhibits with some success at Harrogate ;)
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Brian
I'm glad you picked up on my tongue in the cheek remark! ;)
Some seriously good blooms though - Class 24 winner is superb - and the photography really does them justice.
I'm off next weekend to see some of the best from the north east growers of Tyneside (Frankie Charlton etc) before then taking a trip down to the Harrogate show _I'll look out for the southern daffs.
Frazer
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The yellow form of Narcissus alpestris which is slowly increasing.
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Perfection in my eyes. 8)
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Very nice indeed Tony. None of my alpestris have flowered this year (two lots both from you, one in 2008 the other in 2010) although they flowered well last year. Do you find it a difficult species?
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Very nice indeed Tony. None of my alpestris have flowered this year (two lots both from you, one in 2008 the other in 2010) although they flowered well last year. Do you find it a difficult species?
You beat me to it David. Having read that it was difficult, I was going to ask Tony if it was his experience too. It is a very attractive sp.
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Very nice indeed Tony. None of my alpestris have flowered this year (two lots both from you, one in 2008 the other in 2010) although they flowered well last year. Do you find it a difficult species?
You beat me to it David. Having read that it was difficult, I was going to ask Tony if it was his experience too. It is a very attractive sp.
I have no problems with it and have several pots in flower at the moment. I wonder if you are growing it too hot and dry in summer. In the wild it is a high altitude meadow/mountain plant and although I let it dry out it is cool here even in the middle of summer which is how it is in the Pyrenees
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Thanks for that Tony. I had it in some covered outdoor shelving for the summer where it was dry but, last summer, was never hot!!
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The yellow form of Narcissus alpestris which is slowly increasing.
Tony,
simply stunning. 8) 8) 8)
A pity it is not a fast grower. I believe she would have many fans... :)
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It's beautiful, Tony.
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Can anyone ID this one for me please.?
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Pipit, maybe?
http://daffseek.org/query/query-detail.php?value1=Pipit&lastpage=1&
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Thanks Anne, that's it, now I remember planting it. The old brain is getting a bit fuzzy. :)
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Comes to us all Michael :-\
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What d'he say?
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Didn't quite know on which thread to post this. Started on the Frit thread thanks to Gerry ;), but could be wildlife etc. thread. Settled for this one in the end.
Hope you find that N assoanus is a nectar source for ( if not pollinated by ) Macroglossum stellatarum is as interesting as i do. 8) 8)
http://labs.eeb.utoronto.ca/barrett/eef/ (http://labs.eeb.utoronto.ca/barrett/eef/)
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I don't grow many Narcissus in my garden, but I got a few small species and cultivars, one of my best is 'Queen Ann's double daffodil'
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Didn't quite know on which thread to post this. Started on the Frit thread thanks to Gerry ;), but could be wildlife etc. thread. Settled for this one in the end.
Hope you find that N assoanus is a nectar source for ( if not pollinated by ) Macroglossum stellatarum is as interesting as i do. 8) 8)
http://labs.eeb.utoronto.ca/barrett/eef/ (http://labs.eeb.utoronto.ca/barrett/eef/)
I suppose it would have to be something with a long proboscis to probe that deep?