Epimedium - various threads gathered together here

[YT]

Epimedium grandiflorum 'Mugawa Gen Pan' (I wonder what that name means: YT? Tetsuo?)

Wim, that must be E. grandiflorum var. thunbergianum '武川源平 = Mukawa (Mugawa) Genpei'.
http://www7b.biglobe.ne.jp/~yamakusa/ika-005.jpg

[WimB]

Epimedium grandiflorum 'Mugawa Gen Pan' (I wonder what that name means: YT? Tetsuo?)

Wim, that must be E. grandiflorum var. thunbergianum '武川源平 = Mukawa (Mugawa) Genpei'.
http://www7b.biglobe.ne.jp/~yamakusa/ika-005.jpg

Thanks YT! I'll change the label! Does that name mean anything specific or is it just a description?

[WimB]

A clumper! E. qingchengshanense will probably be lumped together with E. fargesii indeed. Do you have a picture of the flower of E. qingchengshanense?

Crappy weather, so crappy pics... From Qingcheng Houshan, about 1500m altitude.

Thanks Bjørnar,

I would say that falls within the normal variation of E. fargesii. The flower might be a bit finer, but whatever it is, it looks nice!

[arisaema]

I would say that falls within the normal variation of E. fargesii. The flower might be a bit finer, but whatever it is, it looks nice!

Yeah, that's what I thought too... Should have a fargesii from Jiuchongshan, Chengkou in flower next spring, will compare them then.

[WimB]

This one is supposedly from N Vietnam, anyone care to guess what it is?

Epimedium davidii

[arisaema]

This one is supposedly from N Vietnam, anyone care to guess what it is?

Epimedium davidii

Thanks, Wim! E. davidii was my first thought as well, but Vietnam is a loooong way down from Baoxing... Maybe the "red flowered" Vietnamese species will prove to be more interesting, I had hoped for flowers this spring, but have only had leaves so far.

[WimB]

This one is supposedly from N Vietnam, anyone care to guess what it is?

Epimedium davidii

Thanks, Wim! E. davidii was my first thought as well, but Vietnam is a loooong way down from Baoxing... Maybe the "red flowered" Vietnamese species will prove to be more interesting, I had hoped for flowers this spring, but have only had leaves so far.

Yes, but if I remember correctly E. davidii grows in Yunnan too (not only in Sichuan)...don't know where in Yunnan exactly, though!

I'm looking forward too seeing the red-flowered Vietnamese Epi's!!

[TheOnionMan]

Regarding E. fargesii and E. qingchenganense, I grow both and have photos to compare.  Certainly qingchenganense looks similar to fargesii, but there are some differences too, although as others have expressed, perhaps not enough differences to ultrimately maintain species status. I hadn't even thought about calling into doubt its species status, as it just seemed a finer plant than fargesii, even though fargesii-like.

3 views of E. qingchenganense:





Flower comparison, qingchenganense on the left, fargesii on the right.  Interstingly, the former has yellow pollen, whereas fargesii has green pollen.



Foliage of E. fargesii picked today, evergreen foliage on left, new season foliage on the right. My impression has been that qingchenganense has smaller, more oval foliage, and less dramatically angular lobed as in fargesii, that fargesii has more narrow foliage.  But of course, such characteristics could easily fall within species variability.


Two views of both species taken today, on this cold drizzly day (was 78 F and sunny yesterday ).  On the left is E. qingchenganense (with grandiflorum 'Circe" behind), with qingchenganense emerging much later than fargesii, only showing new shoots a couple days ago, whereas E. fargesii has been in flower for about 2 weeks now.



On NARGS Forum, Gerrit posted an excellent closeup photo of E. fargesii 'Pink Constellation', here are the links to compare:
http://nargs.org/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=943.0;attach=30983;image
Topic link:
http://nargs.org/smf/index.php?topic=943.msg16779#msg16779

[TheOnionMan]

Epimedium grandiflorum 'Mugawa Gen Pan' (I wonder what that name means: YT? Tetsuo?)

Wim, that must be E. grandiflorum var. thunbergianum '武川源平 = Mukawa (Mugawa) Genpei'.
http://www7b.biglobe.ne.jp/~yamakusa/ika-005.jpg

Thanks YT! I'll change the label! Does that name mean anything specific or is it just a description?

Aha, the dangers of name corruptions, worn-label-transcriptions, and citation misapplication turning into phantom cultivars   Thankfully YT can help us track down such naming puzzles

[YT]

Epimedium grandiflorum 'Mugawa Gen Pan' (I wonder what that name means: YT? Tetsuo?)

Wim, that must be E. grandiflorum var. thunbergianum '武川源平 = Mukawa (Mugawa) Genpei'.
http://www7b.biglobe.ne.jp/~yamakusa/ika-005.jpg

Thanks YT! I'll change the label! Does that name mean anything specific or is it just a description?

That's a good question. "Mukawa (Mugawa)" is a place name at north west of Kofu Basin, Yamanashi prefecture, Japan. Probably this bi-colour epimedium was found and collected there. "Genpei" is a colour combination for well contrasted red and white and the word came from two major samurai clans used their family colours about 800 years ago like as House of York and Lancaster.

Aha, the dangers of name corruptions, worn-label-transcriptions, and citation misapplication turning into phantom cultivars   Thankfully YT can help us track down such naming puzzles

My pleasure, Mark Yes, such 'phantom cultivars' are big problems. This case is very lucky.

[TheOnionMan]

Thanks YT, fascinating to learn the history of these words and names.  Maybe you can comment on the following one.  I have uploaded 2 photos of Epimedium grandiflorum 'Bicolor Giant', introduced here in the USA by Darrell Probst, possible he is responsible for naming what was an unnamed variety. It is stated in the Garden Vision Epimediums nursery that this is "another giant red similar to 'Red Queen' and 'Orion', but with bi-colored bloom. Acquired from Gotumba Nursery, Japan in 1997 as a "pink grandiflorum".

Two photos of E. grandiflorum 'Bicolor Giant':


To compare, here is E. grandiflorum 'Orion'.  Takes a few years to get established, but it is a beauty with high flower power.  It stands straight up, the tall stalks with leaves well above the flowers, with highly visible dense clusters of rich rose-red flowers.  Garden Vision Epimediums says about this one:  a giant "red" flowered Epimedium probably originating from central Honshu in Japan.  This cultivar was named by American nurseryman Dick Weaver.




For comparison, here is a closeup flower view of E. grandiflorum 'Red Queen', probably the biggest of the grandiflorums, my plant over 36" (1 m) across x 30" tall, in full bloom now.

[WimB]

Regarding E. fargesii and E. qingchenganense, I grow both and have photos to compare.  Certainly qingchenganense looks similar to fargesii, but there are some differences too, although as others have expressed, perhaps not enough differences to ultrimately maintain species status. I hadn't even thought about calling into doubt its species status, as it just seemed a finer plant than fargesii, even though fargesii-like.

Wonderful pictures, Mark. And there is a difference indeed....but I would give it a var. status instead of making it a complete new species

On NARGS Forum, Gerrit posted an excellent closeup photo of E. fargesii 'Pink Constellation', here are the links to compare:
http://nargs.org/smf/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=943.0;attach=30983;image
Topic link:
http://nargs.org/smf/index.php?topic=943.msg16779#msg16779

Mikinori Ogisu's selection E. fargesii 'Pink Constellation' Og.93023 is a superb form!

[WimB]

That's a good question. "Mukawa (Mugawa)" is a place name at north west of Kofu Basin, Yamanashi prefecture, Japan. Probably this bi-colour epimedium was found and collected there. "Genpei" is a colour combination for well contrasted red and white and the word came from two major samurai clans used their family colours about 800 years ago like as House of York and Lancaster.

Thanks for the explanation, Tatsuo! Very interesting!

[WimB]

Thanks YT, fascinating to learn the history of these words and names.  Maybe you can comment on the following one.  I have uploaded 2 photos of Epimedium grandiflorum 'Bicolor Giant', introduced here in the USA by Darrell Probst, possible he is responsible for naming what was an unnamed variety. It is stated in the Garden Vision Epimediums nursery that this is "another giant red similar to 'Red Queen' and 'Orion', but with bi-colored bloom. Acquired from Gotumba Nursery, Japan in 1997 as a "pink grandiflorum".

Two photos of E. grandiflorum 'Bicolor Giant':

To compare, here is E. grandiflorum 'Orion'.  Takes a few years to get established, but it is a beauty with high flower power.  It stands straight up, the tall stalks with leaves well above the flowers, with highly visible dense clusters of rich rose-red flowers.  Garden Vision Epimediums says about this one:  a giant "red" flowered Epimedium probably originating from central Honshu in Japan.  This cultivar was named by American nurseryman Dick Weaver.

For comparison, here is a closeup flower view of E. grandiflorum 'Red Queen', probably the biggest of the grandiflorums, my plant over 36" (1 m) across x 30" tall, in full bloom now.

All wonderful plants, Mark.

I've seen similar plants in Koen van Poucke's garden here in Belgium. Most of them were received from Japan without a name.

It will be very fun   when different American and European breeders start naming these forms!

[Paul T]

Mark,

Great pics.  Those dark grandiflorums are gorgeous!!