Scottish Rock Garden Club Forum
Bulbs => Galanthus => Topic started by: mark smyth on November 02, 2007, 04:39:59 PM
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This snowdrop reginae-olgae 'Sophia' has only just emerged in the last couple of days. I'm not sure it should have been named
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Mark - be patient with this one, maybe it needs a while to settle down in your garden - I think the 'Snowdrops' book is spot on when it describes 'Sofia' as a "magnicent clone" - it is certainly one of my favourites.
Mine are in their second year and, with very upright tall scape & large, quite heavy looking, flowers, they have been flowering now for 3 weeks and still look superb - added bonus this year is that several bulbs have also thrown up twin scapes.
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Mark - looking at your photo again, I have to say that I would not immediately recognise it as g. reginae-olgae subsp. reginae-olgae 'Sofia' - I note also that you are spelling it 'Sophia' - is it possible that what you have is not the correct snowdrop?
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I didnt check the label. I have had it almost two years now and it has flowered for the first time
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'Peter Gatehouse' a lovely pre Christmas flowerer, as in mid to late December, is days away from opening
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This morning 'Peter Gatehouse' is out but not in the hanging position.
I have some information on my long petalled Galanthus reginae-olgae
"the forms with long outers seem to come from the Taygetos Mts around Profitis Ilias. They are widespread in the gullies and open woodland in this area. There seems to be much variation, green tips, yellow markings and the long outers."
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My old Nikon shows Galanthus 'Sofia' much better
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and here's a poor photo of 'Peter Gatehouse' due to high winds. I'll get a better shot this weekend while I'm at work
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Can I ask why this thread is called "Galanthus pre January 2007"? Last time I checked it was November 2007, so I'm a little confused? (Nothing unusual there of course!! :))
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yes you can. There will be many early season snowdrops appearing soon so I thought of having a pre January section, a main season section, January and February, and maybe a section for those that flower late mid March and later
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But shouldn't it be pre january 2008?
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ballcocks. It's the white fever building in my veins. I'm giving a lecture on snowdrops on Tuesday that will help the levels. It will be helped along greatly because I havent put it together yet
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There will be many early season snowdrops appearing soon so I thought of having a pre January section, a main season section, January and February, and maybe a section for those that flower late mid March and later
Oh joy! [attach=1]
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;D ;D ;D
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Maggi,
I didn't realise you didn't like Galanthus? :o
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It's not that I don't LIKE them, Paul.... I just think they are all the same! :-\
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Which MEANS that you don't like them!! ::) If you DID like them you'd know that they have intricate differences and each has special attributes, and they're wunnerful, and great, and cool and...... hmmm, maybe it's something I ate? ;D
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Maggi remember I stayed with you last February! ;) and have a certain tall one bonsai'd in a small put! Is it released yet? You do have a new large hole to put it in?
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Maggi remember I stayed with you last February!
So, Mark, you can assure Paul that we do have some of the white thingies!
and have a certain tall one bonsai'd in a small pot! Is it released yet?
Er, um, oops! :-[
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If tomorrow is good I/we would like to see photographic proof of you digging hole and releasing it
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... and Maggi why are you not watching your long haired fancy man on TV?
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If tomorrow is good I/we would like to see photographic proof of you digging hole and releasing it
Okay, but I think the weather will be VERY BAD!
why are you not watching your long haired fancy man on TV?
Which particular fancy man would that be? (You know I have so many :-X )
Whoever he is, Ian is watching the Cambridge Folk Festival at the moment!
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Maggi,
You need two TVs then. ;D Makes it much easier when one wants to watch one thing and the other wants something else. Saves fights!! ::)
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Does he work in Harlow Carr? He didnt feature tonight
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WHO ARE WE SPEAKING ABOUT?? Long hair, Harlow Carr, I am completely confused.
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It's alright Maggi.... I happens a lot around this place!! :o ;D
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sorry I cant remember his name
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Matthew Wilson?
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Never met the man! :'(
It occurs to me that Mark may have been using the phrase "your long haired fancy man" in a Northern Irish idiom,that is to say meaning " an attractive young man"...... meaning that I may have generally found this person to be worth watching.... I, on the other hand (and this is a case of, if the cap fits, wear it)took him to mean that some fellow was on TV , in whom I had previously expressed/demonstrated an interest!!
I'm beginning to sound like Bill Clinton.... :o
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back to snowdrops - our Martin has kept it quiet that he has written an article in the current RHS Daffodil, Snowdrop and Tulip year book 2007/2008 that I reading now
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back to snowdrops - our Martin has kept it quiet that he has written an article in the current RHS Daffodil, Snowdrop and Tulip year book 2007/2008 that I reading now
Don't expect too much, Mark. It's really just a filler piece written at short notice to fill an unexpected hole. Given the choice, I wouldn't have written anything about my snowdrop breeding for a few more years. Most of my (hoped for) results are still in the seedling beds and seed pots. The article is all about what I hope to achieve, which I can't help feeling is a bit of a cheat. I'd have preferred to have waited and written about my successes in a few years time, but they needed an article and there's not that much snowdrop breeding going on so...I suppose something's better than nothing in this sort of area.
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Where'd you get it from, Mark?
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it was on sale at our AGS meeting. You get a mention also. Will I mail you mine and I'll get another one next weekend?
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Hi everybody, and sorry for the long time I did not come.
I have a Galanthus reginae-olgae flowering for two weeks, but it came to me as ssp. vernalis : may I have to labelled it as G. reginae-olgae ssp. reginae-olgae ? It seems to me to be a diminutive form of my "true" G. r-o ssp. r-o.
Moreover, my G. ikariae ssp. snogerupii have begining to flower this week end : usually it is on the end of december and january !!!
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Hello Biodiversite
Welcome back.
Here in the south of England the snowdrops have become quite confused by the strange weather that we have been having (we had very cold weather in August/September & I think that this fooled the snowdrops into thinking that autumn had come and they started to produce strong roots - then in October the temperatures suddenly warmed up again and were 5C higher than the normal temperatures for this time of the year, & we did not have any rain for a month, which combined to stop many snowdrops in their tracks - now, over the past few weeks the temperatures have dropped again and we have had several frosts, together with a little rain, which has got the snowdrops going again).
Your g. reginae-olgae subsp. vernalis could well be correctly named - I have g. reginae-olgae subsp. vernalis 'Alex Duguid' in flower at the moment (this snowdrop was originally distributed as 'Mr Duguid's Christmas flowering snowdrop') - the really strange thing is that some of my g. reginae-olgae, which have usually flowered by now, have not even emerged from the soil yet.
Like you, my g. ikariae subsp. snogerupii has already emerged - this usually flowers a few weeks earlier than g. ikariae and I have noticed that, with the very mild winters of the past few years, my g. ikariae has been emerging/flowering up to two months earlier than expected.
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Thank you for your answer. Please let me know : if G. r.o. ssp. vernalis can flower in autumn, what are the differences that allow us to differenciate the 2 subspecies ?
Here is a (bad) photo of my G. r.o. ssp. vernalis :
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Please let me know : if G. r.o. ssp. vernalis can flower in autumn, what are the differences that allow us to differenciate the 2 subspecies ? Here is a photo of my G. r.o. ssp. vernalis :
Flowering time is really the only way to differentiate reginae-olgae from r.o. ssp. vernalis. Which highlights the problem with differentiating and naming subspecies and forms (and even cultivars) based on their time of flowering - which of course can vary so much according to the climate where they're grown (and if the climate changes everywhere!)
If I was shown your snowdrop and told "It's flowering now. What is it?" with no other clues as to naming, I'd have to say reginae-olgae. And I think any other snowdrop grower would probably do the same.
Personally, I don't think r.o. vernalis stands up as a ssp. and should simply be a later (or not so later!) flowering variant of r.o. Unless anyone else knows of any strong distinguishing features that I'm not aware of.
Sorry to butt in before Chris has a chance to answer, but I find myself up in the wee hours helping get young son off for a school exchange trip to France. So this is what four in the morning looks like, Maggi! :o
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So this is what four in the morning looks like, Maggi!
Yup, 'orrible, ain't it? :( As it happens, I had a reasonable night last night and was in bed asleep by about 2am! :)
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I think that Martin has said it all - it really is very difficult to differentiate the various forms of reginae-olgae, especially when they are growing in our gardens, as opposed to their natural habitats.
The only difference that comes to mind is that, for me, the leaves on subsp. vernalis are always present at flowering time, and usually quite well developed, whereas with subsp. reginae-olgae the leaves can be very short or, in some cases, absent altogether (but again, like the flowering time, this provides only a very generalised guide & much variation occurs).
The differentiation between sub species is probably more obvious when growing in their natural habitat, but even here there can be wide variation due to the many variables e.g. variations in climate from year to year, soil, altitude, geographical location etc etc.
Particularly in their natural habitats, the plants are constantly adapting to these different growing conditions, with one thought in mind - how best to survive! - and this is reflected in the often very wide ranges given for flowering periods in the various published reference works.
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Ah, I see M. Biodiversite, like me, combines an interest in reptiles (tortoises) with plants.
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Ah, I see M. Biodiversite, like me, combines and interest in reptiles (tortoises) with plants.
:) yes, and I hope in next months to write a article for a french tortoise revue about the integration of tortoise structures with the garden in general ;)
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As Chris rightly says, the pattern of leaf development through the flowering time is supposed to be another defining feature for reginae-olgae vernalis but there's a lot of variation which seems to negate the point - just as it did when reginae-olgae and corcyrencis were differentiated by leaf development or lack of it.
According to "Snowdrops" by Bishop et al, "the earliest flowering plants have shorter leaves than the later flowering clones at the onset of flowering." That doesn't really sound to me like a very strong basis on which to differentiate a sub-species. I suspect that, especially as climate change starts to muddle up flowering times generally in Europe, the sub-species status of r.o. vernalis will eventually disappear.
On the subject of flowering times, my autumn snowdrops have also been all over the place after this year's wierd weather. Many of them, like Chris's have been very late, and some don't look happy. My reg-olgae 'Hyde Lodge' for example are only just appearing and are coming up very slowly with small flowers, due to the dryness of the soil, which is usually pretty damp by this time of year but dry this year.
There seems to be plenty of moisure deep down in my soil from the earlier rains, so trees can reach it to sustain their autumn colour for a long period, but shallow-rooting stuff like autumn bulbs are suffering as the top few inches of soil are parched due to lack of autumn rains. Even the recent rain has barely wetted the grouind.
Yet, as has been mentioned, some normally Jan-flowering snowdrops are already poking their noses up. The overall effect, as last year, looks like being a compressed snowdrop season, with everything coming up almost at once.
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Martin, you are lucky with your 'Hyde Lodge' - not a sign of this form at all for me, so far this year!
The lack of any substantial early autumn rain, for the second year in a row, is a real problem as the autumn flowering galanthus really do want to have their roots sitting in moist soil at this time.
I have actually watered some of my r-o's this year, because the soil around them was just like dust, but this of course only had a temporary effect &, as you say, they need much more constant & steady rain over the autumn period, to really get those top few inches of soil wet enough to make a real difference.
g. peshmenii seem to have been particularly badly affected this year - most of mine have emerged, with tiny leaves showing, but have then just stopped in their tracks, with little or no further leaf development & very few plants producing flowers. I did notice a little spurt of growth after the decent bit of rain that we had here one day last week, but we are now getting towards the back end of their 'normal' flowering period, so I guess that nothing much else will happen this year.
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Chris, I started watering my reginae-olgaes as well just a couple of days ago. First time I've ever felt the need to do that! It seems to have helped a bit with the Hyde Lodge, which have started to come up a bit faster I noticed in the garden just now.
My r.o. Tilebarn Jamie performed even more poorly, with tiny little distorted flowers. But then T. Jamie never does as well for me as Hyde Lodge. I don't find it a robust clone here, certainly nowhere near as reliable a garden plant as Hyde Lodge, which I just love to bits.
Have you tried poking around to see if your Hyde Lodge are making shoots below soil level? As you say, it;s getting very late for them not to be showing at all. Don't want to be a doom-sayer, but with the very wet summer I'd be worrying by now if they'd rotted, especially if they're not tucked right under a shrub. Fingers crossed, I hope that's not the case but if they have suffered in the wet summer and there are some struggling remnants of bulbs there making no shoots then it might be an idea to get them up and do some emergency rescue work on them.
For what it's worth, for anyone on the forum who finds rare snowdrops failing to shoot in autumn/winter and discovers they've been half-eaten or half rotted away, you can still clean up and chip any remains even in autumn/winter. I experimented with late chipping and found that late Autumn is still okay, and I'm pretty sure even winter would do. The autumn/winter chips grew away fine and caught up with the summer chips. In fact I recall that they made bulbils faster, maybe because the snowdrops were into their normal growing season rather than making bulbils on the chips in what should be the dormant season. You don't always even have to have some basal plate left to chip. I've had chips of snowdrop scales with no basal plate make bulbils along the side of the chip.
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Martin
re 'Tilebarn Jamie' - I too have found this one to be quite variable. Last year I had one particular clump, which in the previous 2 years had produced really good flowers, turn completely blind - plenty of leaf growth, but not a hint of a flower. I dug it up earlier this year, planted a few bulbs back in the same spot & in two other places in the garden and all of them have flowered strongly again this year, including producing twin scapes! My conclusion is that this must be one of those snowdrops that really does not like its bulbs growing too close together, so it does need to be lifted & split every year or two, if it is to continue to perform well (probably also benefitted from a good feed too!).
re 'Hyde Lodge' - I have been putting off the evil moment, but I guess that I am going to have to bite the bullet!
You are right to stress the possibilities for rescuing damaged/ailing bulbs - I first realised this when my g. elwesii 'Henly Greenspot' failed to surface - I completely forgot about it & where it grew then got overrun by cyclamen. This year, which was 2 years after it was last seen, lo and behold it surfaced again and produced good leaf growth - I lifted the bulb, which looked healthy and was a good size & am hopeful that it will flower again next year. I thought that if nature can perform this sort of healing operation by itself, unaided, then I ought to be able to do something along similar lines and am now far less likely to automatically dispose of the damaged/ailing bulbs of rare snowdrops.
When I dug up my single bulb of g. plicatus 'Chequers' in the summer, I was delighted to find that it had produced two good sized offsets, but then realised that all that was left of the mother bulb was just the outer layer of the bulb - the rest of the bulb, including the basal plate and the top, had completely disappeared (I assume that the narcissus fly had been at work). I was about to discard the outer layer when I noticed that it had two bulbils growing from the top of this layer - I potted up said bulbils still attached to their food source, the outer layer, and will be watching to see if they grow on.
Very interested to read what you have said about your success with autumn/winter chips - this is a significant breakthrough. Do you do anything different with these autumn/winter chips, when you first pot them up e.g. in terms of mix, where you keep the pots etc?
You mention that the absence of a basal plate has not been a bar to producing bulbils on the side of the chip - have you actually been able to grow these on to produce normal flowering bulbs? I know that several people have been successful in producing bulbils from the 'tops' of the bulbs (which had previously always been discarded), sometimes in great numbers, and am waiting to hear if bulbs have grown.
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Hello !
please post some more photos of the various forms of galanthus reginae-olgae and galanthus ikarea....
in Greece i saw Galanthus reginae olgae ssp reginae olgae allways in flower without leaves , on different locations.
usually the plants are standing alone or with 2 or 3 bulbs . i think it's because they are deep in the rocks and have no soil to grow.
they spread more by seeds.
sometimes they make almost a field , growing together with different Cyclamen sp.
they rarely form a big clump.
Wim
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here is another photo , the flowers pushing through 15 cm or more rocks.
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Chris, the latest I chipped snowdrops was the end of October one year. I did the same as always, clean, chip, fungicide, vermiculite in bags, then into a warm cupboard. The bulblets formed quite rapidly and were big enough to pot in January, when they quickly made leaves and grew on as normal, making bulbs as big as those chipped in summer.
This year, out of interest, I might try lifting a bulb without leaves in December and chipping it, to see if that's still not too late. But if one finds a damaged bulb even during the main growing season, I'd still say it's worth cleaning up and either putting in some gritty compost to make new bulblets on its own, or try chipping - all better than binning damaged bulbs.
The times I've had bulblets form on the sides of scales on chips instead of from the bit of basal plate, I potted them up with all the others, so don't know if they definitely grew away ok, but I assume they did as they seemed perfectly fine little bulblets.
There;s no reason it shouldn't work, as it happens with lily scales, where you don't need the basal plate and growers will often cut large scales in two, top bit and bottom bit, to get bulblets on both. I've frequently got bulblets forming on the sides of lily scales.
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Forgot to say, Chris, that it's interesting you mention people getting new bulblets growing from the tip of the bulb cut off for chipping. Never occurred to me (duh!) to clean that up and put it in the vermiculite bag too. But of course it makes sense to give it a try. I'll be doing that in future.
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new bulblets growing from the tip of the bulb cut off for chipping
We have heard of this working, too....... waste not want not, as they say!
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This week I saw Galanthus elwesii Potter's Prelude at the weekly flowershow of the dutch
Bulb Org.
I think it is very early??
Sorry there was no better place to make a picture.
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Hello!
Thanks fo posting a photo,
i have several Galanthus elwesii var monostictus flowering since last week , i don't think this one was worth giving a name.
It has no special markings and is not very early.
There is a lot of variation in import bulbs from Turkey.
but... i like these plants in the garden very much. they give us a long snowdrop season in these cold wet days.
Wim
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Martin - thanks for this feedback on your late October chips. Sounds like they might have produced good sized bulblets in somewhat less than the usual minimum 12 weeks - when you potted the bulblets, did you put them straight outside, in a cold frame?
Will be very interested to hear how you get on with the December chipping experiment.
re using the 'tops' of the bulb - I gather that good initial results have been obtained & have heard of as many as 7 bulbils forming on the rings - it would be good if you were to pot the 'tops' separate from the rest, just as an experiment, to see if there is any discernible difference in rate of development, failure rate etc.
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Luit - many thanks for posting this photo of 'Potters Prelude' & interesting to see that this USA bred snowdrop has found its way to Europe.
I am not familiar with the weekly flowershow of the Dutch Bulb Organisation - can you tell me if this snowdrop was exhibited by a commercial grower, or a private individual?
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Wim - thank you very much for posting these photo's of g. reginae-olgae subsp. reginae-olgae in their natural habitat - really good to see - quite amazing how they seem to have adapted and can survive in such unpromising conditions!
Please do post some more from your visit to Greece, if you have any - do you have one of them growing with cyclamen?
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but... i like these plants in the garden very much. they give us a long snowdrop season in these cold wet days
Yes Wim, these early flowering snowdrops are a very welcome addition to the garden and look good when they form clumps.
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Thank you!
i have more photos of cyclamen , crocus , sternbergia and other plants.
not a good photo , but here is reginae olgae , growing together with cyclamen (hederifolium?)
Wim
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Yes, thanks Wim. That first (larger) clump of reginae-olgae is very impressive.
Chris, yes the bulblets from the October chips did seem to develop faster in the bags than from summer chips. It was exactly what I hoped to find, that development might be faster than during the normal dormant period. However, the bulbs at the end (after a season growing on in pots in the coldframe) didn't seem any bigger than from the summer chipping, so no real gain in the end (I had hoped that perhaps I might get bigger bulbs from chipping and developing bulblets in the growing season).
Still worth knowing it's possible in autumn, though, if you have a damaged bulb to rescue or receive a new bulb in late summer or autumn that you'd like to chip straight away for bulk it up fast and make it safer than a single bulb in the garden.
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The snowdrops grow under the plane trees with ferns and cyclamen species.
mostly they grow near the streams , where it is cool in summer.
there is great variation in the leaf colors of cyclamen.
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where the forest was burned this summer, the bulbs and cyclamen survived deep in the ground and are easy to find now.
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superb colour cyclamen!
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I am not familiar with the weekly flowershow of the Dutch Bulb Organisation - can you tell me if this snowdrop was exhibited by a commercial grower, or a private individual?
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Chris, this snowdrop was shown by the Royal Bulb Grower Association (KAVB).
They have it in their collection.
At the flowershow (every Monday) growers have the possibility to show their
products. This varies from many different bulbous plants to perennials.
You can see many new cultivars from (mostly) bulbs. For example you might see from december till May every week tulips. The last few weeks there were many
Liliums or earlier several weeks with Eucomis etc.
Luit van Delft
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Luit, very helpful answer - thank you very much.
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I'm attaching an untypical Galanthus reginae-olgae picture from the wild. This is the first time I found a clump, they normally seem to grow as single plants in the Taigetos.
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Kees - many thanks for posting this photo - another member of this Forum tells me, just as you have said, that they usually grow as single plants - Wim posted a superb clump a few days ago and now you - really good to see.
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The early bulb season continues with flowers open on Alex Duguid - all bulbs twin scaping - and a pot of plicatus plicatus. A pot of nivalis Sandersii Group have noses above ground. Some Castlegars are above ground also
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After all this 'galanthophillic' banter and all the exquisite habitat pictures of Galanthus spp, this question just had to be asked (by a person who can't tell the difference between a snowflake and a snowdrop ;) ) - which species are most likely to succeed (in pots) in a subtropical climate? I have a cool, dry winter (min. -1 or -2'C occasionally) and a warm, moist, humid summer (max. 25 - 30'C, occasionally 35 - 40'C!). Last year I tried my hand at Crocus from seed (...and they're doing fine!) this year it's Galanthus...
Thanks a lot.
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Hi Rogan - with the climate that you describe, this is going to be quite challenging as, in order to break dormancy, snowdrops need a cold spell.
The 'Snowdrops' book (by Bishop et al) does offer some hope - on page 321 it briefly describes the experience of snowdrop growing in the USA, in places such as Southern California, Louisiana & Missouri, although it makes the point that they do not do well in the South East, where summer temperatures and humidity are too high.
I don't know how your climate compares with the above parts of the USA, but the book says that the most tolerant species, in the USA, is the autumn flowering species g. reginae-olgae (and that the clone 'Cambridge' seems to have performed particularly well).
The same article notes that 'one brave soul is trying' to grow galanthus in South Africa, but it did not say who! You mentioned that you "can't tell the difference between a snowflake and a snowdrop ;)" - apparently the summer snowflake (leucojum aestivum) is grown around Cape Town, where it is called 'snowdrop'!
Good luck & would love to hear how you get on.
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Many snowdrop species will not actually experience frost in the wild and are well adapted to Mediterranean conditions. Look at all the species found on the Greek Islands. I can't grow some because it's too bloody cold and wet. How about Galanthus fosteri?
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Rogan, the most widely available snowdrops through the bulb trade are nivalis and elwesii. Nivalis won't tolerate constant summer lifting and storage but elwesii is much better adapted to such treatment. So why not try obtaining some (not too expensive) dry bulbs of G. elwesii from one of the major bulb growers and try growing them first in pots, where you can control such things as moisture better than outdoors, until you have them switched to your seasons, then you could try growing them outdoors in your winter and lifting them for dry storage (in dry sand perhaps) during your wet summer. Elwesii are quite readily raised from seed too, setting seed very freely and in large quantities, so you could also collect seed from your pot-grown elwesii (better still hand-cross-pollinate for a large seed crop) and start off a batch of seedlings. I imagine repeated seed sowing and natural selection would eventually give you a strain of elwesii more suited to your garden, but that would take a while.
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... and mentioning G. fosteri it is also above ground with the flower buds visible
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a look around my raised beds today I could see way too many noses above ground
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Hi Rogan,
our climate is a bit colder than yours in winter(-7oC) and not so wet in the summer but we get quite hot (40oC). We've had reasonable success with Galanthus elwesii in the open but they stay dry during the summer. If you are growing them in pots you could just keep them sheltered during the summer rains.
The comments from (the recently exfoliated) Martin B. sound quite reasonable and if you want the names of some bulb growers in the Southern Hemisphere just ask as it's almost time for their catalogues to come out! I usually get Marcus Harvey's catalogue as an e-mail attachment and can send that on to you (and anyone else who's interested - he does send bulbs to the Northern Hemisphere!)
cheers
fermi
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I noticed a couple of flower buds on Galanthus peshmenii in a trough outside. These are from the same batch that flowered in my greenhouse over a month ago.
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my plants in a trough have produced a couple of late flowers also including a green tipped flower. I forgot to photograph it, and my Colchicum cretense, at the weekend. The latter may be over by this Friday when I'm at home again. Multi flowered this year compared to only one last time. Dontcha hate this time of year for photography
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Thank you for your extremely helpful comments re. growing Galanthus in South Africa. I'm willing to give it a try, certainly with G. reginae-olgae which may very well succeed outdoors in my climate. I see Jim and Jenny Archibald stock it, so I will try it from seed in the autumn.
A Leucojum sp. (L. aestivum?) does grow quite well in moist, shady spots in my garden where it 'naturalises' modestly and produces its charming blossoms in mid-winter. However, I have to grow clumps in mole-proof wire baskets to keep the little beasties at bay - at least I don't have problems with badgers and echidnas!
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Here's 'Alex Duguid' flowering way too early and yes I agree it looks like any other snowdrop but not many are twin scaped and have a very broad silver line down the leaf.
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Here's 'Alex Duguid' flowering way too early and yes I agree it looks like any other snowdrop but not many are twin scaped and have a very broad silver line down the leaf.
... and also standing very upright, like a soldier, quick to increase and most welcome too!
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yes I should have mentioned vertical stems. Mine came very cheap £1.66 each - pack of 3 for £5
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One of the few things managing to look good at the present is G reg olgae "Cambridge" which is slowly bulking up. Very welcome at this ime of year
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the group photo is very good.
Working in the garden today between rain showers I see the so called 'Melvillei' has flower buds present as does the whole group of 'Castlegar', 'Atkinsii', 'Wendy's Gold', 'The Whopper' and many more
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Mark this plant is OK but there is no sign above ground of any of my G reginae olgae species even in a pot which is showing a tip just under the soil. Does anyone else have the same problem or are mine the only ones?
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Mark,
Could I impose on your for further information on your G. 'The Whopper'?
Over the past while I, with help, have been trying to establish the background of as many Irish cultivars as possible. G. 'The Whopper' continues to crop up as one of those which adds to confusion in the nomenclature of snowdrops.
The name was certainly used as a nickname for G. 'Cicely Hall' by some but seems to have also been associated with several other snowdrops - in the vein, 'that one's a whopper' with the name being subsequently being applied to various cultivars, often previously un-named ones. Of course, this has led to a confusion with plant names and, in some cases, with some of these 'whoppers' being equated with 'Cicely Hall' for example because of the coincidence of nicknames.
Can you give some background to your own 'Whopper', please? Where did it originate etc?
Paddy
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Mine are a mix of Margaret's and Bob's. I had measurements and other details of both but I've lost them. Grown side by side they are very different. Both are of elwesii ancestry but one showed more likeness to elwesii leaves to the other. One was also more reliably twinscaped. The Whopper tends to fall forward and Cicely stands well. Weather permitting I'll photograph The Whopper's leaves tomorrow
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Many thanks, Mark.
Your notes display perfectly the confusion which can arise with named snowdrops. You have plants of the same name from two reliable sources and they are different.
I'm sure this could be reported from multiple other sources also.
Paddy
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Does anyone else have the same problem or are mine the only ones?
No you are not alone Ian, my Cambridge is only up about 2" whilst St Anne's and Hobson's Choice (for example) are nearly as far up. I reckon it's going to be a really odd season.
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there is a snowdrops day here in three months time but there wont be much to see in my garden
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Quote from Brian
"No you are not alone Ian, my Cambridge is only up about 2" whilst St Anne's and Hobson's Choice (for example) are nearly as far up. I reckon it's going to be a really odd season."
Brian Tilebarn Jamie is up but doing very little I am wondering if some of the Reg Olgaes will come up at all or whether they have rotted off in our wet summer. I suppose only time will tell and it is very tempting to chance a bit of finger blight - I hope I can resist
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Yous guys must be living a whole lot nearer the equator than I am, because only the tips of even my earliest snowdrops are visible. My peshmenii is still in tight bud in a trough.
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Ian both my Tilebarn Jamie and peshmenii are not showing at all! As you say it may have been the
winter summer wet weather.
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or Narcissus fly grubs have been busy
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The new list of Colesbourne Park is available online
http://www.snowdrop.org.uk/
for collection only. :'(
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thanks Brian,
collection only - but well worth the trip to Glouscester - we did it in a day trip last year - though we may consider staying overnight somewhere in 2008.
Here are a few pics I took last year:
http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?topic=233.0
regards
John
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(and I have just noticed the first reply was you saying you must try and do the long journey yourself ;D )
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yes well worth it.
The Colesbourne list is now out of date as it was emailed last week to good customers ::)
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A lovely list with some very desirable plants. When I read such lists I bemoan the fact that I live at too great a distance to be able to travel and collect.
It will teach me patience - they say that everything comes to the one who waits, so I will wait and live in hope.
Paddy
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I have been waiting for this list to go live since visiting Colesbourne in February. I checked on the site all last week and finally at 7.30am on Saturday morning (1st December) I saw the new list for 2008. Immediately I sent an e-mail and followed this up with a letter just in case.
I thought that I was one of the quick ones but after Mark's comments today I got a little panicked and phoned Dr. John Grimshaw. Unfortunately I am dozens down the list and it appears that at least half of the six plants I requested have already gone and there is little hope for the others! Dr John will confirm later today but needless to say that I am very disappointed. At what time did this go live? Don't Galanthophiles sleep?
I guess that I'll have to try again in another 12 months.
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it appears that at least half of the six plants I requested have already gone and there is little hope for the others!
Hi David
try not to be too disheartened. I myself have learnt over the last 4 years of growing snowdrops that patience is essential for this hobby. A 50% success rate isn't too bad at all - in the past I have, on more than one occasion, had a zero percent success at various nurseries. There are loads of snowdrops that are well worth growing, increasing reliably year on year, that are much easier to obtain than many of the newly found rare ones.
I am sure that members like Mark, Snowdropman and Paddy can give a list of brilliant plants that should be easier to source - and that will add interest and variety to any collection.
The trip to Colesbourne will be well worth it even if you only get 1 or 2 out of the 6 you have requested.
Good luck.
kind regards
John
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Ah but there is now snobbery against the good old ones. Everyone wants for example the pink
reginae-olgae
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I've grumbled in the past and will again about this business of offering a rare snowdrop for sale when there's only maybe four or five bulbs (sometimes just one or two!!) available. Better, I would say, to chip those few bulbs and wait to sell a few more years when you can supply the demand better and disappoint people far less!
But then again, this business of trickling out a small handful of rare bulbs each year does, I'm sure, help to keep the fever and the snobbery going and the prices high!
If I ever raise anything really worth distributing from my hybridisation, I wouldn't make it available until I had good stocks to meet anticipated demand. That just seems to be good business sense and considerate to your customers to me. Whereas this business of loads of people being disappointed every year can't be good in the long run for anyone.
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Better, I would say, to chip those few bulbs and wait to sell a few more years when you can supply the demand better and disappoint people far less!
I couldn't agree more. I have even ordered a plant from a well known supplier as soon as the catalogue was out, a friend ordered the same bulb nearly a week later using a postbox in an isolated village so you would think she would have missed out. Needless to say she got the bulb and I didn't - so much for treating orders in strict rotation! But there is always another supplier (hopefully) and another year (hopefully again!!).
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:o Tss tss...Talking about galanthus, and all looking so sad???? :'(
Just to cheer you up, and even though there is still time before they bloom again for me, here is the most cheerful galanthus I know!
Maybe it could even give the last push towards Maggi's conversion? ;D
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'Blewbury Tart' the ugly duckling and beauty at the same time
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I don't think of it in terms of beautiful/ugly...I just think of it as "special", "cheerful", and "different"...
Zeph
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14C here today will not help stop the march of the Galanthus in my garden
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Many thanks for the words of encouragement. I know that patience is a virtue but this doesn't come easily to me!
I have to agree that there is a lot of snobbery going on in the snowdrop world. I'm not too bothered about whether the plant is fashionable or not, I just go for the ones I like. Unfortunately most of these appear to be extremely rare or expensive but more often than not, both!
I guess my beef is that the list 'went live' early on 1st December as stated on the web site but unfotunately the list had already been sent out a few days prior to this. So no surprise that most of the highly sort after bulbs had already gone (probably to those who have extensive collections already thus keeping the supply restricted to outside of the circle and ultimately keeping the prices high). Maon over :)
Anyway, thanks again for your words of encouragement. I apprecaite it. I check this site daily for chit chat and ramblings regarding all things snowdrop and love looking at the pictures. I guess that this is what fires my passion! I hope to post some of my own photos as the season progresses. Fortunately, or unfortunately, my 'drops aren't as advanced as some of those who post here and therefore it is likely to be after Christmas before these get posted up.
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To get snowdrops flowering on or before Christmas you need 'Castlegar', plicatus 'Three ships', 'Peter Gatehouse', elwesii 'Haydn', 'Colossus', elwesii Heimalis Group ...
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I hate cats! Every year a cat dumps a deposit on my clump of 'Castlegar'. This year is no different. It's only just recovering from a major attack a few years ago when all the leaves were damaged
NOTE TO MARK - protect Castlegar from the neighbours cat! ;)
__________________________________________________________
John
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Pink reginae-olgae? Are we talking a symbolic statement here, or is there really a pink reginae-olgae? ???
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John well remembered. It is protected this year.
Yes there is a pink/pale orange r/o if I remember right
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I'm happy to wait until after Christmas for my snowdrops. There is too much happening elsewhere that prevents me from getting outside and giving my 'drops a good coat of looking at!
I did get an early 'fix' however as my reginae-olgae have already flowered!
Unfortunately some of the plants listed by Mark are still on the 'difficult to obtain' list but in time I'm sure that this will change and I'll get more time before Christmas to enjoy them, but currently I'm happy to look at your photos so please keep them coming.
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At the rate things are progressing in my garden, peshmenii will be lucky to open its petals before Christmas. One of the two flowers only just bent down last week but it is still rolled up. The other is still inside the spath. Nothing else is much more than half a centimetre up.
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David those are easy to get
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Zephirine... you have chosen exactly the wrong plant to entice me... I hate that thing!
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I hate that thing!
Maggie! Hate is such a strong word. :o What has blewbury tart ever done to you?....
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I hate that thing!
Maggie! Hate is such a strong word. :o What has blewbury tart ever done to you?....
Uh-oh!
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Blewberry Tart = ghastly indigestion... seems a reasonable explanation to me :P
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Okay then, since as a Moderator, I suppose I must be moderate...... "Sadly, dear Friends, I find this Galanthus Blewberry Tart to be seriously unpleasing to my finely tuned artistic eye".... better?
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Mark,
Can you let me know who has 'Three Ships' avaialble for sale. Every enquiry I have made is met with a 'Sold Out, sorry'.
I don't doubt you, but I must be looking in the wrong place!
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Okay then, since as a Moderator, I suppose I must be moderate...... "Sadly, dear Friends, I find this Galanthus Blewberry Tart to be seriously unpleasing to my finely tuned artistic eye".... better?
that's much better! ;D
(being a soft Southerner I was always told off for using the word 'hate' when I was younger)
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David check your personal messages. ;)
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I seem to remember seeing three ships being sold by three elderly gentlemen on Ebay after Christmas last year?
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Thanks Brian. I have sent you a reply.
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my reply from Colesbourne has been great
David you should attend the Galanthus Gala or the East Lambrook day. The former has c10 suppliers in attendance and they are always left with the best. The rarities always get snatched up by rampaging non natives ::) You should check the Broadleigh and Beth Chatto web sites in Late February.
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Home early from work and had a look at early appearing snowdrops. I have 27 above ground
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I seem to remember seeing three ships being sold by three elderly gentlemen on Ebay after Christmas last year?
Ho, ho ho!
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Martin you may Ho! Ho! Ho! but there are some very reliable suppliers of Galanthus on Ebay. I bought from them in 2006 and 2007. Many are going OTT with prices but many are ingnoring good 'drops
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Martin you may Ho! Ho! Ho! but there are some very reliable suppliers of Galanthus on Ebay. I bought from them in 2006 and 2007. Many are going OTT with prices but many are ingnoring good 'drops
Mark, I think Anthony was making a joke.
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Mark,
I will be going to the snowdrop gala and have already been forewarned about the rugby like scramble for the rare varieties on sale. You'll be able to recognise me as I'll be the one with the wife who looks like she doesn't want to be there! It's not an act, she doesn't want to be there!
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David, I must offer you a little advice, this, remember, coming from a wife of long standing... ( that reminds me, must see about getting a cushion) do not drag your unwilling spouse to the Snowdrop Gala day... find another event in which she has a deep interest and send her off to it, preferably with one or two of her chums... in one of their cars... this will leave you free to enjoy a day's 'dropping shopping with a happy heart...... it will tend to have the effect of both of you hitting the bank balance, but hell, it's only money and most of us eat too much anyway! Had I known you earlier, i could have advised you to chooose a gardening wife.. but maybe your good lady IS a gardener, albeit one like me, who does not see the glory in the white fever!!??!!
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I have Blewberry Tart I bought in a very weak moment because it was cheap. I p[aid more than it's worth though. Maggi I agree with you .............BLEWBERRY TART WHY ?? ? ???
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I didn't mean an offense to your eyes, Maggi :-[...you had just complained that snowdrops looked all the same to you...this one is definitely different, at least!
I do like it, it's cheerful and funny! Though I prefer the pure form of the common snowdrops, nivalis and elwesii for instance.
Personnally, I don't care for doubles more than "that"...
Zephirine
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Maggie,
My wife was given the option not to attend but I think that she's going to make sure that the white fever doesn't cause me to part with too much money. As far as gardening goes...she doesn't. She likes looking at nice gardens but doesn't like the effort in producing and/or maintaining them.
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'Blewbury Tart', by the way, is really a bit of a sexist name. As I understand it, at one point it was jokingly called Blewbury Muffin (it was found at a place caled Blewbury, hence the punnny name) but then it was changed to Blewbury Tart as a double-punny-entendre, as in "it's not a muffin, it's a bit of a tart - a Blewbury Tart" because it doesn't hang its head demurely but instead has its 'skirts' raised up for all to see (get it? - yes that kind of tart). And yes, the name was thought up by a man!
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I`ll have to agree with David it`s hard to get the special ones.galanthophiles are always swapping,not selling their special drops.so I, sometime ,buy at e-bay or in Holland and hope to get what I ordered.
Dutch bulbs though are far less big than Brittish bulbs so my Blewbury Tart,who I really like,has already failed twice.got really bad bulbs in Holland.I don`t buy there anymore.I`ll stick to the well known nursery`s in U.K.
It`s hard to write English but I love all your comments and photo`s.
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Loes, we are so pleased that you are joining in and taking the trouble to write in English... you are doing very well with it, congratulations! You should join the experiment, after all it is not essential to be an expert to take part, surely?
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After rain, snow 20 cm and frost -7° C. in the last weeks Galanthus reginae-olgae from Corfu is still flowering. Seed pods and flowers are together. I lost all my snow drops in a hard winter 16 years ago. All my plants are now self seedlings. G. reginae-olgae from Greece (Pelepones) has long finished its flower.
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Lovely the way the sun is catching them - thanks for posting.
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very early snowdrops taken today
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Hi Mark
Those snowdrops are well ahead of my garden. Are they Nivalis?
In the next few days I will have Elwesii var monostictus and Hiemalis, but I expect them around this time
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unknown cultivar with the earliest flowering now for about 10 days. They arent reginae-olgae
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Hi Franz
great to see the pictures of the Corfu bulbs - the ones you kindly sent to me have increased in number again but are just leaves again this year. If they don't flower next year I think I should move them to somewhere else in the garden.
What aspect do you have them planted in?
with kind regards
John
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John,
I do not know how sunny your garden is. I think the Mediterranean species likes and need a little more sun. In my garden they get 70 % sun and 30% bright shade.
Franz
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The weather is runny and pics not very good, but here are G. reginae-olgae and caucasicus hiemale. They don't like the rain during two days !!!
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I think caucasicus has been changed to monostictus.
They tend to have grey leaves so your pics look like hiemalis, but I'm not a galanthophile.
Hopefully one of the experts will give an opinion
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I've just been browsing the Galanthus mid February to March 2007 thread
http://www.srgc.org.uk/smf/index.php?topic=266.msg5873#msg5873
On the first page is a pic of Galanthus transcaucasicus from biodiversite which shows the flowers very close to the ground, similar to the one above from dominique
But if it is the species it wouldn't have hiemale in the name because that is a group name for any un-named cultivar flowering before Christmas?
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yes you are correct G. caucasicus is now G. elwesii monostictus
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My first new snowdrop seedling of the season. I took a few quick snaps but the most in-focus ones didn't show the flower off very well. This one does show the elegance of the flower shape and the long pedicle well but I've had the usual problem with getting the camera to focus on the white flower instead of the background. Still, it does show the elegance of the flower nicely so I'll post it until I have time to get a better pic.
It's just an elwesii monostictus, or what I still privately call caucasicus (single-marked elwesii type). The mark's a nice heart-shape, and the flower has a nice scent. Nothing world-shattering but I think it's nice enough to chip and make a clump for the garden.
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Incidentally, Gal. caucasicus may turn out to be a valid species name after all. I've heard that true caucasicus has been found in the Caucasus Mts., and that some old clones that have been around for a very long time might possibly be true, while others (from more recent Turkish dried bulb imports) are single marked forms of elwesii. All a bit confusing, but may in the end show how inadvisable it is to rename plants on the basis of limited wild material, observations in cultivation and assumptions about what may or may not have happened in the past without firm evidence.
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It's just an elwesii monostictus, or what I still privately call caucasicus (single-marked elwesii type).
So it maybe Martin but as you say it does show a degree of elegance, and sounds like a good mark.
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@ dominique
Do your G. caucasicus ( ;) ) really have this yellowish colour?
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@ dominique
Do your G. caucasicus ( ;) ) really have this yellowish colour?
No, the yellowish sheen on the leaves is just the indoor light shining on them. Had to take the pic indoors with the lights on as it was so dark and gloomy outside today, and I didn't want to use flash. I'll try to take a better pic tomorrow to replace this slightly out of focus one.
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It had been the second yellow G. elwesii...
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Martin, I do like the rounded fullness of your snowdrop............... there, got this one back to me!
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Hi Arne
Yes the colour is good but I don't know if it was the same colour last year. It is only from I am new member of srgc ( 1 month) that I look at these details. All galanthophiles have open my eyes on these splendid and various flowers. You are all responsable of my new desease !!! And I risq to ask you thousand questions about them and you say : Still Dominique, again,again,again, STOP !!! You are so good galanteachers and I am galantho...ill !!! Thank you everybody. My caucasicus hiemale is now elwesii monostictus, ok , noted.
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I heard from Janis Ruksans that the true G. caucasicus has been found
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@ dominique
Do your G. caucasicus ( ;) ) really have this yellowish colour?
Sorry, I thought you were asking about my Gal. caucasicus pic! Which is why I answered a question for dominique. :)
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Martin, I do like the rounded fullness of your snowdrop.
Praise indeed, coming from you Maggi! ;D The seedling has a good pedigree. It's from a large, very round-flowered G. elwesii that came, via my parents, from E.B. Anderson, and which I use a lot as a seed parent. This seedling's from a batch where I crossed the elwesii with G. plicatus, but in this seedling the cross doesn't seem to have taken (although it has with other seedlings) - sometimes difficult to tell, but this one shows no signs of hybridity, so it's probably pure elwesii as a result of self-pollination (I don't bother removing anthers from pollinated flowers - life's too short and I do too many pollinations).
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very good colour Wim.
Martin I hope you show us a good close shot of your snowdrop! Do you use manual or auto focus?
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Here's r/o vernalis 'Alex Duguid' again showing it's vertical stem
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very good colour Wim.
Martin I hope you show us a good close shot of your snowdrop! Do you use manual or auto focus?
I can't see Wim's post on the forum. Has it been removed?
Mark, I'm using auto focus but I was using your trick of focusing on my hand then taking the hand away. Didn't work in this photo. I was in a hurry. Will try to get a better shot tomorrow.
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but better!
Yes his photo is gone
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Mark, I'm using auto focus but I was using your trick of focusing on my hand then taking the hand away.
I think I must have missed this technique during my 5 month absence. Could you point me ot the original post please. :)
thank you.
John
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what I do if the camera ignores the flower I want to photograph is to put my hand behind the flower when taking a macro shot. The hand must fill the frame. The camera will 'see' the flower and pull it in to focus. I remove my hand, hold the buttton down to re focus and take the photo. You dont have to this with an SLR
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I do like the rounded fullness of your snowdrop
My goodness Maggie, is this a recognition of snowdrops! Pick me up off the floor. There is nothing wrong with a bit of rounded fullness ;D
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There is nothing wrong with a bit of rounded fullness
Indeed, Brian, with a figure like mine I can only agree with that!
Martin, your snowdrops have impeccable pedigrees.... breeding will out, I suppose. I tend to find the chubbier drops more appealing than the slimmer types, pretty as those can be, and, of course, I contend that it is really only the difference between tubby ones and skinny ones that makes any difference between these snowdrops, anyway!
Since I am lucky enough to have Alec Duguid's entire AGS Journal collection ( bound volumes, at that) as well as some of his other books from his library, then I can also admit to a liking for any flower given his name... so I like your 'drop, too, Mark.
Now I'm off to lie down for a bit until this little attack of white fever passes.... or I may go out and drink in the charms of a perfect crocus... that usually does the trick
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Maggi,
I would recommend a good tranquilizer before lying down... ;D
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@ dominique
Do your G. caucasicus ( ;) ) really have this yellowish colour?
Sorry, I thought you were asking about my Gal. caucasicus pic! Which is why I answered a question for dominique. :)
I wondered a bit but no problem. ;D
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Martin B I would say Your looked a bit on the pink side. (To be honest I thought You tricked with it in photoshop) so I understand that You answered.
I am amazed how the white fever strikes so hard and fast 12 pages in a month and over 2400 views.
Luckiely I am a bit blind to it and to cheap to pay 10£ for a snowdrop even if that is considered a bargain.
Still very nice to read about the experience people have with this.
David regarding brining You wife to the gala and pushing Your wife might be better on that then You. Mine is better than me, on a bulb sale at the local garden club women +50 were better than most rugby players and my then pregnant wife was much more successful than I was in getting plants so maybe bringing Your wife will get the "shopoholic" in her going. My wife is not that interested in gardens either. She likes them but not the work so it was the event that got her going rather than the bulbs it self.
kind regards
Joakim
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Here's a slightly more in-focus shot of my first Gal. elwesii seedling of the season. It wasn't easy to shoot to show it to its best advantage. When you lift a snowdrop from the garden, pot it and bring it into poor light conditions indoors, it'll often go all floppy-stemmed and fall about at all kinds of odd angles so you can't get a natural looking pic of it! This was the best I could do. It wouldn't open up enough, even in today's bright sun on the windowsill, to show the nice heart-shaped mark.
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excuses excuses! ::)
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Can we see an enlarged version of the flower itself?
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Hello!
Galanthus plicatus 'Three Ships' and 'Collossus' are allways early flowering,
Do you know other early flowering varieties of Galanthus plicatus?
around cambridge there are many woods with carpets of Galanthus plicatus.
are some of these also early - flowering?
Wim
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Can we see an enlarged version of the flower itself?
Just for you, Mark:
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very nice. thanks
My success story has been with 'Colossus', c40, but this year not one is poking up through in the garden. Some in a pot are up. Last year the first was open on December 5th
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Wierd season - my Colossus are well up, ahead of last year, as well as loads of others, but it's not usual for me to be ahead of you, Mark, out in the middle of the Gulf Stream!
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Martin is there really a pink tinge to your seedling or is a trick of the light?
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Martin is there really a pink tinge to your seedling or is a trick of the light?
Just a trick of the light I'm afraid. Don't know where the slight pink tinge is coming from in today's pic - it was taken in daylight with nothing red anywhere near it.
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there are some true 'orange' snowdrops out there. I must try and get some sent to me
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I`ve got a question for the experts:
are the elwesii monostictus always flowering ahead of the elwesii elwesii and cultivars?
and:are elwesii monostictus with no cultiver names,all counted as hiemalis?
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I`ve got a question for the experts:
are the elwesii monostictus always flowering ahead of the elwesii elwesii and cultivars?
and:are elwesii monostictus with no cultiver names,all counted as hiemalis?
1. no
2. hiemalis only indicates early flowers
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thanks,I`m learning.
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here are a couple to keep the active forum members and lurkers happy
The pre Christmas flowering G. plicatus 'Three Ships- "I saw three ships come sailing in ...."
and a very early nivalis type that isnt Castlegar or maybe it could be
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Mark, my Castlegar are up now. The flowers will be open in a day or two so I'll have a look and compare with your mystery snowdrop. Also get a pic if I can. Have yours already flowered?
It's certainly about the right flowering time for Castlegar, and your mystery flower isn't a million miles away from Catslegar in overall looks and mark - although the mark looks a little widely splayed and wide at the ends. I always remember my Castlegar as having quite arrow-head-shaped thin marks without much widening at the ends. But I could be wrong. Will look as soon as they're open.
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well advanced and began c2 weeks ago
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I don't have any of these early flowerers, but even the ones I do have that are supposed to be, like elwesii 'Hiemalis', are still not up. ???
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to keep the forum members and lurkers happy
I thought lurkers were forum members, not second class citizens :-\
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OK the active members and lurkers
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Phew! I'll go back to a little lurking. ;D
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Brian with 187 post You can not be considered as a lurker.
Maybe members that have not posted anything or guests that are regular guests that only looks but does not say anything can be considered to be lurking?. It is a pity since I think they would be able to give valuable comments. Not everyone is like me and have problem keeping my mouth/hands shut. ::) and just have to comment when I see something I think needs to be commented (even if I can be far off regarding knowledge of the subject).
Kind regards
Joakim
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I've been looking at the stats for my snowdrop web site. Numbers are way up but I'll not bore you with them. A new feature is I now know where visitors come from. There are some real oddities in there showing white fever is spreading through the tropics and deserts
Taiwan, Hong Kong, South Korea, China, Japan, Malaysia, India, Israel, Bangladesh, Hondura, Brazil, UA Emirates, Thailand, Iran ...
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Just a random, rather cruel thought, mark... are you sure these far-flung folk are coming for the snowdrops and not because they've googled "white fever" and are actually looking for something quite other??!! ;) :o ::) ??? 8) ;D
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Mark,
These certainly are countries which Iwouldn't think of as the traditional sites for snowdrops. Amazing really. I presume these are the minority visitors. What are the numbers like from Ireland and the UK?
Paddy
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USA is top where did I get USA from?
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January '07
Great Britain
Germany
United States
Belgium
Netherlands
Sweden
Canada
South Korea
Ireland
Romania
December '07
Germany
Great Britain
Netherlands
United States
Belgium
Sweden
Taiwan
Belarus
Turkey
France
The top 20 phrases used on search engines were
www.snowdropinfo.com
snowdrops for sale
north green snowdrops
snowdrops in the green
galanthus primrose warburg
galanthus
galanthus for sale
galanthus big boy
mark smyth
buy snowdrops
galanthus trym
snowdropinfo
snowdrop days
galanthus bertram anderson
snowdrop info
galanthus diggory
judys snowdrops
galanthophile
bulbs for sale
galanthus three ships
The top 3 words used in search engines were
Galanthus
snowdrops
snowdrop
The top 4 search engines used were
Google
Google images
Yahoo
Ask Jeeves
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Back to snowdrops. I was home early enough tonight to have 10 minutes in the garden before dark. A lone G. rizehensis is in flower with 4+4 petals
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Here is Galanthus cilicicus, flowering in a shady part of my garden
Gerd
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Martin don't you owe us a photo?
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Martin don't you owe us a photo?
My Castlegar haven't opened yet with all this cold, and the flower on the elwesii seedling went over quickly from being brought indoors so I couldn't get a decent shot of the inner mark like you asked for. Nothing else flowering yet - all standing still thanks to the freeze (down to -3c and -4c the last few nights - not as low as north of the border, but still pretty chilly).
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OK next year.
elwesii 'Haydn' is now in flower, 'Castlegar' and 'Castlegar' lookalike. 'Colossus' has now decided to put it's heads up. Like you the advance has been held back by recent cold days and nights. Daphne 'Jacqueline Postill' is fully out
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A group of 'Castlegar' look-a-likes
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Mark,
Is it that you grew these from seed of 'Castlegar' that you refer to them as "Castlegar-look-alikes" or is there another story to them?
Some years back a snowdrop was being passed around with the, to me at any rate, very off name of "Not Brenda Troyle". What an odd name under which to pass a snowdrop around.
However, I have a snowdrop here which we refer to as "Not Bill Baker's Green Tipped" because we were given it as 'Bill Baker's Green Tipped' but found when it flowered that it was not in fact that cultivar at all. As we didn't know what it was we refer to it as "Not Bill Baker's Green Tipped." I can see the sense in using such a name within the garden and family but not of passing a snowdrop around with as such.
Paddy
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I suppose I better show a couple of decent photos of it. I was trying to rouse some comment with the rubbish photo.
It flowers earlier than 'Castlegar', the ovary is a different shape and the inner mark is different
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Whatever it is, Mark, it's very nice for this time of year (if it continues to flower this early).
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They are early every year mostly tail end of November
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Is this a scene we can still look forward to in Clivedon Woods?
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most likely provided bulbs robbers havent been in
Did you read that Eurobulbs in Wisbech has been fined £5000 for digging wild Bluebells? The farmer who allowed them to be dug has also been fined.
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Did you read that Eurobulbs in Wisbech has been fined £5000 for digging wild Bluebells? The farmer who allowed them to be dug has also been fined.
Trouble with some of these fines for digging wild bulbs is that they may seem large but when you divide the fine by the number of bulbs taken it often only amounts to a few pence per bulb!
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here's an ordinary early flowering G. plicatus and a leaf shot to show the pleats in the leaf
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Here is what I grow as 'Castlegar', bought from Avon Bulbs, and reliable at producing a second scape. The look a like is below again for comparison
According to the book 'Castlegar' has a deep notch and a pedicel that grows above the tip of the spathe. I'll report back in a week or so as these flowers mature. It was only introduced in 1999 so the garden I got mine from couldnt have the stock they have now in 7 years assuming it was freely available in the first few years
Just to comment now you can see the look a like does stick out beyone the spathe while the real one doesnt. Time will tell
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Here is a new website, dedicated to Galanthus - still in its early days, but should build up an interesting picture gallery over time
http://www.galanthus-online.de/index.html
I see that one of the contributors is our own Johan Mens.
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A good one for all the Schneeglöckchenliebhaber out there! What a word! :D
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Looks promising, Chris.
Paddy
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"SNOWDROP WALK FOR SRGC SCOTTISH ROCKERS, WE INVITE YOU TO A SPECIAL DAY AT BRECHIN CASTLE ON SUNDAY 17TH FEBRUARY. COST WHICH INCLUDES LUNCH IS £25 SO PLEASE BOOK EARLY AS NUMBERS ARE LIMITED"
I should have said this from Ian Christies web site
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Here's another early flowering snowdrop 'Mrs McNamara' and a frosted 'Colossus'
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Wonderful pics everyone. So far off from Galanthus here...... first ones usually start flowering around the middle of April for us!! I particularly like 'Three Ships'. Every time I see pics of it I wish I had it. Must check and see whether Marcus has imported it or not? ;)
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mucho excitement today - the snowdrop catalogues have arrived
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... and orders sent off! ;D
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yes mine is away too
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You sad sausages! Have you no chocolate to sit about and eat... or were you scoffing that as you made your selections from the catalogues?? ::)
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Maggi it only takes 10 minutes or less to make the order and run for the post office
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Maggi it only takes 10 minutes or less to make the order and run for the post office
Ten minutes!!!??? It took me half the afternoon, agonising over what I could afford and what I couldn't. But I've now spent all my birthday money on snowdrops (as I do every December) from Ron Mackenzie's Snowdrop Company and John Morley's North Green Snowdrops (well, all my birthday money - my Mum's very generous - and then some!)
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Maggi it only takes 10 minutes or less to make the order and run for the post office
All well and good if you are just running to catch a post, if you need a stamp, then here you'd need to take not just some chocolate, but also a flask of tea and some sandwiches, to sustain you as you wait in the seemingly endless queue. Don't know what it is about our Post Offices and this season!
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Martin you must be at the stage to work out a list very quickly. Any sign of your, or anyone else's 'Castlegar'
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Martin you must be at the stage to work out a list very quickly. Any sign of your, or anyone else's 'Castlegar'
No, I still agonize. It's the cost really! Plus I'm looking for good breeding material for my seedling programme as well as nice 'drops for the garden, so there's always a lot I want. My Castlegar are up, but too windy today for pics. They look pretty much like yours. That 'Not Castlegar' is dfeinitely something else. Wrong mark.
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just as I thought
Here is one of my small clumps, again, showing that the extended pedicel cant guarantee that it is 'Castlegar'. I've emailed Matt and Alan Street to get their opinions but none have bothered to reply. I know there is a lot of pooh poohing when a snowdrop is not found by the inner circle.
So John Morley is going for an auction again this year that will exclude the ordinary person like you and me in favour of those with big wallets
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Just out of interest....whose catalogues have arrived?
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North Green and Snowdrop Company
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Bloody hell....that was a quick reply. I have sent my orders off today for the Snowdrop Company and North Green yesterday. There are so many to choose from and so little cash to go around! I just hope that my orders are one of the first to arrive. I was disappointed earlier this year so hopefully I have got in quick enough this year. That's assuming that the lists haven't already been sent out to others a few days earlier of course and all of the choice ones snapped up.
I see what you are saying with regards to the aution. I can see both sides of the argument unfortunately. Afterall John Morely is running a business but for the like of us it will not be possible to compete with those with large wallets. I will just have to look at the photos in the book!
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John mailed his on Christmas Eve so some people got their's yesterday and most got it today
Arne I'm sure you will get yours. I was told European customers have their catalogues sent a few days ahead of us. I also know the Snowdrop Company adds further snowdrops to the catalogue by hand for those of you in Europe - or maybe a select few
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That would be very nice, although I cannot order many, money is very little at the moment. ;D
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Your "I can't believe it's not
butterCastlegar" snowie clump is lovely, Mark. Perfect shape to the drops, in my opinion ::) 8) ;)
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Do you/Ian grow any early snowdrops?
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I forgot this from earlier today
'Ding Dong', Avon calling - for those of us old enough to remember
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G. 'Castlegar' is in flower here. Several blooms were blown off in gales yesterday and today but two are still bravely holding their own at the moment.
Paddy
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You can't rely on pedicel length alone as an identifying feature. The pedicel often elongates as the flower ages, starting shorter than the spathe and ending up longer. I'd seen it in the garden with various snowdrops and used to grit my teeth as people trotted out that old rubbish about S. Arnott and Brenda Troyle being distinguishable purely by pedicel length - until the snowdrop book finally put paid to that daft theory.
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Paddy do you have a photo of yours?
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Do you/Ian grow any early snowdrops?
No, Mark, we don't. We have had various form of G. regina olgae over the years, but they never persist in the garden for any length of time. There's the odd, sad, lonely flower here and there, very disappointing.
It is interesting to see that some of the snowies flowering around this time look much more robust, though your climate is rather kinder than ours, I think :P
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well that will be sorted in March or April but like I tell everyone else you have to remind me. Lots of people complain about broken promises
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for next year I`ll have to send for their catalogues I understand.
those companies have the best/priciest? ;)
till now I ordered from companies with websites and online ordering,just did it again,because they sell nice drops I do not have but that won`t be good enough in future years.
just wondering,do they send dormant bulbs or in the green?and what is best according to you?
my first G.nivalis is in flower in the greenhouse and almost in flower outside.not the regular nivalis,that`s weeks? behind.
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I know there is a lot of pooh poohing when a snowdrop is not found by the inner circle.
Well Mark the way to look at it is that we are the inner circle, then you won't feel so bad.
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No we are on the outside looking in
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that I know. I'm refering to the snowdrop world. I'm sure the same situation is found in the Cyclamen, Frit, ... worlds
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Here are the addresses for the snowdrop catalogues
North Green Snowdrops
Stoven
Beccles
NR34 8DG
Snowdrop Company
Barn Cottage
Shilton
Oxfordshire
OX18 4AB
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I wouldnt recommend everyone who sells on the internet. Ask here first
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Today I received the catalogue of the Snowdrop Company.
The problem is that one have to pay by cheque. Do they not accept cash or credit cards?
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Yesterday i swapped a few viridapice for those i think elwesii, the bulbs are enormous for a galanthus.
The biggest were already size 10 and more, these are the latest flowers, the man said the first had started in November and they came originally from Turkey.
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The problem is that one have to pay by cheque. Do they not accept cash or credit cards?
Hello Arne, although they are "businesses" in actual fact they are people selling from home. As such the Snowdrop Company - Dr Mackenzie, probably does not sell enough to warrant a credit card payment. Have you tried getting in touch to ask if he will accept cash? It's worth a try. North Green does accept credit cards but John Morley is also an artist so probably (?) sells some of his work too rather than just having a few days in the year when money is coming in.
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I wouldnt have swapped G. n. 'Viridapice' for elwesii unless you were getting more than a 1 for 1 swap. If you buy elwesii bulbs in the autumn from a supplier a large number will flower in the autumn.
This is a very bad time of year to dig snowdrops. The bulbs will be depleted in a month and have no roots to replenish the bulb properly for 2009. The best time is during late April when the leaves are turning yellow. I know bulb suppliers sell in Feb which is also bad but it's the only way to get the bulbs. The best time to buy snowdrops is when the leaves are totally gone. Judy's Snowdrops, Beth Chatto and Paul Christian sell dormant bulbs
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Have you tried getting in touch to ask if he will accept cash?
No, I have not tried getting in touch with him. If he had an an email address I would contact him.
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They dont give out email addresses because there will be 100s of people asking for everything they can think of. I get many emails from people who have gone through the book and sent me an A to Z list of what they want.
Arne what are you looking for?
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I am looking for many but at the moment it is to expensive for me. There will be different things next year (including a snowdrop gala here in Germany) I have to save for... ::)
But it would be nice to know how to pay for the next year.
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This the the Snowdrop Company's sales list for next year
Atkinsii £2, S. Arnott £3, r/o Hyde Lodge £10, elwesii monostictus £5, Magnet £3, Ketton £7, Merlin £7, Galatea £5, plicatus Bertram Anderson £10, Might Atom £7.50, Robin Hood £10, plicatus Sibbertoft Manor £8, John Gray £9, Benhall Beauty £10, Daglingworth £10, Peg Sharples £7, elwesii David Shackleton £9, Faringdon Double £10, Bill Bishop £10, Allenii £10, elwesii Hiemalis £10, plicatus Florence baker £10, Mrs Thompson £10, Hill Poe £6.50, Ophelia £5, Hippolyta £5, nivalis Ray Cobb £20, ikariae Emerald Isle £25, elwesii Marjory Brown £15, Spindlestone Surprise £25, Fieldgate Superb £25, Primrose Warberg £25, Kildare £20, The Pearl £10, plicatus Trym £15, Baytop Rizehensis £20, Ermine House £15, Ermine Joyce £15, nivalis Blonde Inge £15, elwesii Ransom's Dwarf £10, elwesii Comet £10, Sutton Court £25, Ruth Birchall £25 Cowhouse Green £30, plicatus Patricia Ann £10, South Hayes £25, Colesbourne £30, Godfrey Owen £40, Fiona's Gold £30, Washfield Colesbourne £25, nivalis Spetchley Yellow £25
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Arne send me a reasonable wants list and I'll give you an honest opinion
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Mark,thanks for the adresses for snowdrop sellers.
Arne,I had the same problem so once I send money,pounds,but not registered and they arrived safe.but that is always a risk.just now I payed someone by cheque and that was easy but costs are huge(and that above sending costs which are also pricey).
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I will do it later. Thank you very much, Mark.
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wow!that`s a big list of very desirable snowies! :o
the cheaper ones you can get elsewere but these...
now I know what I`m missing and what I want for next years!...a copy of the catalogue.
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Loes, therefore I would like to use a credit card or to send them money in a registered mail. Using credit card would be the best because my parents would give me theirs but no cheques.
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I've now highlighted some that will make the start of a great collection
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North Green have listed the following
nivalis £1, nivalis Angelsey Abbey £12, nivalis Blonde Inge £16.50, nivalis Poculiformis Group Henry's White Lady £17.50, nivalis 'Viridapice £3.50, reginae-olgae £4.50, rizehensis £7, plicatus Baxendales Late £6.50, plicatis Edinburgh Ketton £17.50, elwesii Percy Picton £20, plicatus The Pearl £30, plicatus Three Ships £17.50, plicatus Upcher £5, plicatus Washfield Warham £10, plicatus Wendy's Gold £17.50, elwesii Cedrics Prolific £8.50, elwesii Comet £12.50, elwesii Hiemalis ex Broadleigh NKA Donald Simms £10.50, elwesii John Tomlinson £16.50, elwesii Naughton aka Largest of All aka Oliver Wyatts Giant £25, elwesii Peter Gatehouse £15, elwesii Three Leaves £7.50, Allenii £10, Anne of Geierstein £25, Atkinsii £2.50, Bloomer £25, Ginns Imperati £12.50, Hobson's Choice £12.50, Imbolc £15, James Backhouse £3, Merlin £8.50, Primrose Warburg £25, S. Arnott £3.50, Straffan £6.50, Barbara's Double £18.50, Dionysus £5, Hippolyta £6.50, Lady Beatrix Stanley £3.50, Mrs. Wrightson's Double £20, Richard Ayres £17.50, Titania £7.50, nivalis Blewbury Tart £15, nivalis Elfin £7.50, plicatus Diggory £50 but not at that price, plicatus Trymlet £35, elwesii Barnes £12.50, elwesii Hiemalis Donald Simms £12.50 £2 more because it's on the short list!, Lodestar £10, elwesii Marjory Brown £15, elwesii Yvonne Hay £25, Cowhouse Green £30, Kildare £30, Mrs Thompson £17.50, Trotters Merlin £17.50, Forge Double £17.50, Heffalump £20,
The auction for the rich only
gracilis Corkscrew, elwesii Brian Mathew, Cicely Hall, David Baker, Greenfinch, Green of Hearts, Little Ben - why auction?, Rushmere Green, Wasp
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I thought it was a good deal to swap 5 for 20, viridapice have i got plenty and no elwesii yet in my collection.
Could you say what kind of species it might be?
I will do my atmost to keep them alive.
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Gerard you can buy dormant bulbs of Galanthus elwesii from Jan Pennings if you can buy by the 100s or higher or PC Nissyen
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I do sell bulbs to gp Nijssen, but i do never buy back, maybe i should ask him.
But those lists look good too, couldn't it be so till the time we have ordered some of the rare ones like Heffalump,Walrus,Big boy etc they are sold out? Besides that most of them do UK orders only.
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Gerard you say the bulbs are enormous on the galanthus you swapped, so they may be elwesii monostictus as they have the largest bulbs in my garden
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Gerard nivalis 'Walrus' is readily available. I have never seen 'Big Boy' for sale but have seen it in gardens during snowdrop events. I dont think I have ever seen 'Heffalump'
Below is plicatus 'Colossus' and below that a snowdrop bought a couple of years ago as plicatus 'Cotswold Farm'. I believe they are the same
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Below is plicatus 'Colossus' and below that a snowdrop bought a couple of years ago as plicatus 'Cotswold Farm'. I believe they are the same
Mark, they certainly look very similar. Are they both flowering now? The late Ruth Birchall's garden at Cotswold Farm is only a few miles away from Colesbourne, here in Glos., where Colossus originated, so it's quite possible Ruth might have got it from the Elwes's.
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Rob they are almost as big as tulips, and i know how tulips look like.
I never thought a snowdrop could grow that big.
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I think North Green has to high prices for some drops. I do not collect snowdrops for a long time but these prices are definitely too high like £17.50 for Mrs Thompson :o . Elsewhere one can buy it for ~ £10.00.
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Arne,
I think you misunderstand about a cheque.it goes like this:
you get (online)to your bank and say it`s a ausland paying.then you fill in the amout in pounds and only give the name and address of the person you send the money to.your bank sends money to England and there is a cheque made with the amount on it and is send to the person involved.
that person can collect his money at his bank.so no cheque-paper of yours is send,only a paper in England.afterwards the amount is collected of your bankaccount and some money for the costs involved(being the change euro`s/pounds and costs for sending the cheque in England.those costs were 11,50 euro`s for me lately).
so your parents only pay their own bank!
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Great Britain should adopt the Euro. Then there were no problems and fees for a bank because we could use an easy bank transfer with IBAN and SWIFT/BIC. ;D
Back to reality: The UK did not adopt the Euro and so I have to send cash for snowdrop orders from the UK.
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Great Britain should adopt the Euro. Then there were no problems and fees for a bank because we could use an easy bank transfer with IBAN and SWIFT/BIC. ;D
Back to reality: The UK did not adopt the Euro and so I have to send cash for snowdrop orders from the UK.
Arne :
It is not a problem to send a money transfer to England - I pay my membership for Cyclamen Society on this way .
The only importent is you must have the IBAN and BIC Nr. ......if you have this numbers the money transfer is free !!!
The easiest way from germany to send money to Dr. Mackenzie is money ( cash in GBP ) in a registered letter .....either you write any alternatives or he will send you the money back .
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I wanted to do that this autumn but I was told by my bank that there were fees for the receiver because if he would like to withdrawal the money he has to pay for the change (euro - pound).
I hope my bank was not right and I can do that without fees.
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Arne, it must be possible for you to buy British pounds from your bank, or perhaps from a travel agent. That way you are posting British pounds to your supplier who will pay it into his own bank without incurring any charges. Any charges involved will be taken into account by your own bank or travel agent when they charge you in Euros for the amount of British pounds you wish to buy. If you wished to send Euros to your supplier then he would incur charges from his own bank to convert them to pounds.
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When I sell photos to companies out side of the UK and they pay using my IBAN number I loose 12% in handling fees. I have now increased my selling price to compensate.
I would send cash in a signed for envelope
Martin the bulbs of 'Cotswold Farm' were supplied a well known collector who should have known better. Yes both are flowering now.
The Castlegar lookalike is 10cm 4 inches tall. I dont think it will extend anymore than this. Look what these two are doing. Maybe they are saluting Lord Lieutenant?
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I pay for my money transfers to England not any fees !!!
The only is you have to send the amout in Euro ....
It is not correct if you have to pay any fees inside of EU !!!
Arne : go to the website of your bank - go to "Auslandsüberweisungen" -there is all written .....